Rare Or Disqualifed Colours In Breeds.

[Crysti_Lei]

Disqualify colours in French Bulldogs, much the same as Staffords.

Some of these colours are fetching $20000 + in the states. :D

Blue

Leanne

Looks like

lol

Edited December 13, 2010 by Crysti_Lei

[peigirl]

Bahahaha CL!

[Greytmate]

I don't get it. From that photo, it just looks like the pigment is not black or it's just a bad photo in bad light.

The nose is definitely depigmented.

The angle of the photo keeps the light from illuminating his most distingusihing feature.

The colour (lack of colour) is clearer here.

That looks like liver pigment, not no pigment. No pigment appears as a light pink like this dog.

[Tralee]

Greytmate

Please have a look at "Arawn Bladewyn Chalice", third from the left, in front of the yellow bowl.

She is also Pink Nosed.

Do you think she could be shown, the same as the others?

By the way, FYI, the dog on the far right, is a Satin Coat Maremma, another sub-type.

Edited December 14, 2010 by pewithers

[becks]

What's a satin coat? It looks no different on that photo to the other dogs

[Tralee]

becks

Compare the 'horse hair' standard (front) to the 'satin hair' fault (closest to gate).

Edited December 14, 2010 by pewithers

[Crazy Daisy]

becks

Compare the 'horse hair' standard (front) to the 'satin hair' fault (closest to gate).

Maybe I just don't know what to look for but I can't see a difference?

[Guest]

I get it, look at the tail it looks more 'buff' n fluffier the rest of the coat is longer u can see it's a lil more longer n has more body I guess u could say, maybe a bit longer too there is a difference but it's hard to tell, I'm sure someone in the know could pick out the fault just like that but too the rest of us theres not much difference! I guess we can feel like the pet owner thinking that every dog of a certain breed looks the same while the breeder is there going 'NO! R u crazy they r completely different types!!!!! Ones pet quality!' lol I'm sure we have all had that one, I know I have!

[Greytmate]

Greytmate

Please have a look at "Arawn Bladewyn Chalice", third from the left, in front of the yellow bowl.

She is also Pink Nosed.

Do you think she could be shown, the same as the others?

By the way, FYI, the dog on the far right, is a Satin Coat Maremma, another sub-type.

She could be shown, she probably wouldn't be disqualified (unless classed as Isabella?) , but sadly she does not meet standard.

The standard calls for Black pigmentation of the mucous membranes, eyelids and the central and toe pads.

The standard also calls for black lips, and black eye rims. Instead of being black, she is liver, so her lips and rims are are brown, as well as her nose.

Depigmentation is a different thing, and it has health concerns that don't apply to liver pigment. Depigmentation certainly should be disqualified in this breed, given what this breed is supposed to be able to do.

Nose: Completely depigmented.

Eyes: Moderate or bilateral depigmentation of the eyelids.

Depigmented areas look light pink, but are actually translucent, you can see the blood underneath, the skin is transparent.

Colour genetics is fascinating. Rather than tell you here how "Rosa" nosed Maremmas sometimes happen, you could have a look at this site. It is a very easy way to keep up to date with colour genetics, as more is being discovered all the time. (so exciting) .

Nasa Rosa maremmas are rose nosed, not pink nosed. But to make sense of this, you need to look at it as being a variation of the B series of genes, which is generally known as liver.

I can see the difference between the coats too. The correct coat would feel dry and slightly coarse to touch. This coat is dirt repelling, wash'n'wear, and is a bit spitz like.

The other coat is softer, more like a GR coat, and smoother or oilier in texture, which is not dirt repelling.

[poodlefan]

I don't get it. From that photo, it just looks like the pigment is not black or it's just a bad photo in bad light.

The nose is definitely depigmented.

The angle of the photo keeps the light from illuminating his most distingusihing feature.

The colour (lack of colour) is clearer here.

How is a dog that has lack of colour in its nose supposed to deal with being outdoors in sun and snow? That would be a recipe for skin cancer here or in Italy.

My guess is that's why its a fault - it goes right to fitness for function.

[Greytmate]

BTW, that photo of four dogs shows a perfect punnet square of what 'is likely to happen' when you bred two dogs of perfect phenotype, but who are each carrying one undesirable liver gene and one undesirable satin gene.

[Tralee]

BTW, that photo of four dogs shows a perfect punnet square of what 'is likely to happen' when you bred two dogs of perfect phenotype, but who are each carrying one undesirable liver gene and one undesirable satin gene.

It would be a punnet square except they aren't four offsrping but Sire, Son, Daughter and Dam.

If we;

Let Pigment be: PP and pp, and Coat be: CC and cc;

with full pigment being dominant to incomplete, and Horse Hair dominant to Satin Hair then we have:

Sire Dd/CC, Dam Dd/cc, Son DD/Cc, Daughter dd/Cc,

where, in terms of the standard, the son has an improvement in pigment and the daughter has an improvement in coat.

Here are two snaps that show the difference in coats more distinctively. (Horse hair coat and Satin coat respectively)

Edited December 19, 2010 by pewithers

[Greytmate]

Yes.

But that allelle is written as BB, Bb, or bb. B for black, and b for the liver (which is a pigment modifier, not depigmentation).

The more we learn about genetics, the more that the breed standards need to catch up with their terminology.

[Tralee]

Yes.

But that allelle is written as BB, Bb, or bb. B for black, and b for the liver (which is a pigment modifier, not depigmentation).

The more we learn about genetics, the more that the breed standards need to catch up with their terminology.

So, thanks for the 'heads-up' about depigmentation.

It means we can go ahead and show the young girl with her older brother.

BB, Bb and bb are pairs of alleles

Our lecturer at Uni used to make a point about Mendel being an Augustinian Monk, who did his best work on Genetics in a Czechoslovakian monastery.

His insinuation was that Mendel had some Divine help in choosing pisum sativum for investigation.

At this time of year, I find it useful to reflect on the fact that Darwin was religious and so was Einstein and Newton.

Thanks again

:rolleyes:

Edited December 19, 2010 by pewithers

[Tralee]

'oops'

"once is quite enough"

Some might even say, " Once, is far too often!"

:rolleyes:

Edited December 19, 2010 by pewithers

[BittyMooPeeb]

At this time of year, I find it useful to reflect on the fact that Darwin was religious and so was Einstein and Newton.

I'd like to hear what this has to do with rare and disqualifying colours!

At this time I year, I prefer to reflect on beer and presents.

[WreckitWhippet]

At this time of year, I find it useful to reflect on the fact that Darwin was religious and so was Einstein and Newton.

I'd like to hear what this has to do with rare and disqualifying colours!

At this time I year, I prefer to reflect on beer and presents.

Or just presents in my case :rolleyes:

[OSoSwift]

At this time of year, I find it useful to reflect on the fact that Darwin was religious and so was Einstein and Newton.

I'd like to hear what this has to do with rare and disqualifying colours!

At this time I year, I prefer to reflect on beer and presents.

Or just presents in my case :rolleyes:

oh me too! I have a ripper this year

[felix]

At this time of year, I find it useful to reflect on the fact that Darwin was religious and so was Einstein and Newton.

That 'fact' is in fact incorrect in at least two of the three. But, as somebody said here, completely irrelevant.

[angelsun]

Mismarked tri Aussie Shepherd (she was mine and her name was Glory)

Chocolate German Pinscher(right and sitting beside her litter brother who's black/tan). Four colours permitted here, only two in Canada (thank goodness!)

Here are all four accepted colours in the states and Australia. Dilutes are riddled with health issues but they keep insisting on breeding with them and for them