My Border Collie Is Limping - Not Much Anymore!

[piper]

I am glad you have a supportive breeder. Even if you suspect it is injury related it is good you let her know.

I hope when he does the arthroscopy no further surgery is needed. Good luck keeping your pup quiet and sane, I don't envy you prolonged rest with a BC pup!

[dancinbcs]

Hopefully with you getting it diagnosed so early and it being only a tiny lesion, the rest will allow it to heal without surgery. If he does need surgery the prognosis is good for a normal life, but he will be more prone to arthritis as he ages.

Cage resting a Border is the pits but due to the rate that they tend to injure themselves, many owners have to face this hurdle.

[OSoSwift]

I can sympathise with the cage rest. My Whippet is on 6 weeks crate /dog run rest at the moment. I do not have the young BC factor though!

I was hoping it wasn't something like this I am sorry you are having to go through with it.

Hopefully he improves after the rest period.

[woody2shoes]

Our vet called. He has finally heard back from the specialist. They definately see elbow dysplasia there. They have recommended 4 weeks strict cage rest with some more anti-inflams for now. Then after that if he is still lame we need to go to surgery. The vet said he can do it up here but he strongly recommends we go to the specialist instead, which is in Brisbane, a five hour drive from here. Still, if it comes to that I will be going to Brisbane. Surgery would mean his elbow would likely never be 100% and that he would have a high chance of arthritus later in life.

Chester is already going mad from the one week rest he has had and that hasn't even been full cage rest, its been in the laundry rest.

I have to buy a large crate when I get paid on Friday so that I can give him proper cage rest. He's going to go even more mad and depressed.

:p

Hi Tenille, I'm sorry to hear the news about Chester but truly, it's not all doom and gloom.

I crated Gidget for nearly 2 months before her elbows were finally diagnosed and then following surgery, she was confined to the house for another two (I opted for open arthrotomy because I didn't feel confident in the other surgeon - if you decide on the arthroscopic procedure, Chester's recovery will be much faster). I realise Gidget's not a BC but she certainly was a very active and athletic lab pup bred to work so it was not an easy task to keep her confined for so long.

First things first, you need to find things to occupy Chester. Kongs filled with carrot and peanut butter, bones, anything he can chew on and keep himself amused safely. Just watch the bones as they will wear his teeth down if he gets too many. I posted on DOL many, many times looking for advice on how to keep Gidget amused...and DOL'ers were great at sharing their ideas.

Also, try not to think too far ahead. You can despair very easily if you do. One day at a time is a good way to approach it I found.

Oh, I suspect that they will do the arthroscopy to investigate and if they find anything, they'll go ahead and do the procedure right there and then. That's certainly what I was told would happen at my first appointment.

It's not easy to stay positive but Gidget's FCP was quite severe and she is fit as a fiddle now. She is never lame, there is no swelling, she doesn't pull up sore and she literally throws herself into everything 100%. She's not on any meds and except for daily Joint Supplement and Fish Oil Capsules, and a pre-winter course of Cartrophen injections, she leads a normal happy life. I wouldn't have done things any differently in hindsight. Good luck! :D

w2s

[dogbesotted]

The vets called me tonight - the more experienced doctor is back today and he has found a very slight sign of fragmented coronoid process on Chester's left elbow. So the xrays are now being sent to a specialist for a recommendation.

i was about to mention that.., a friend had just had her 12 month old go thru surgery on both lebows...

nasty but she is recovering. it is a nasty problem as surgery is not curative.

H

[Staranais]

Tenille, even as a worst case scenario, I bet you could still do tracking with your dog. Tracking champion is nothing to be sniffed at!

[woody2shoes]

Absolutely Tenille! FCP does not mean you wont be able to do things with Chester...you might not be able to do ALL the things you planned to but he should have an active life once he recovers. Friends of mine have a now 7yo very active Search and Rescue dog who had bilateral surgery at 8mo. Try to stay positive...

w2s

[Lollipup]

I went for an appoitment with our vet today and he showed me the xrays and explained in detail what is going on. I could definately see a slight change on the xrays on his left elbow. There are no signs of any problem on the other elbow. Its definately FCP. He prescribed some more anti-inflams (Rimadyl - a months worth, that seems a lot?) and also some sedatives (valium) for if Chester is getting too upset with the confinement.

He said that the chances of the rest working and not needing to do the arthroscopy are more than 50% so quite hopeful. He explained that this is because often the cause of dysplasia can be because the two bones that meet at the elbow joint are growing at different rates and therefore aren't fitting together like they should. The rest is supposed to enable the growth of the bones a chance to catch up and grow into each other in the right way. Well it sounded better when he explained it, I am bad at explaining things.

I am also looking into getting a chiropractor. I would really like to avoid surgery.

He also told me to stop researching into it on the internet as there is a lot of crap out there :D and I was reading things that stressed me out and confused me even more (not referring to DOL).

On another note, Chester has learnt with his clicker and target training to open and shut the cupboard door using his nose, clever boy. I may regret that later....

[woody2shoes]

I went for an appoitment with our vet today and he showed me the xrays and explained in detail what is going on. I could definately see a slight change on the xrays on his left elbow. There are no signs of any problem on the other elbow. Its definately FCP. He prescribed some more anti-inflams (Rimadyl - a months worth, that seems a lot?) and also some sedatives (valium) for if Chester is getting too upset with the confinement.

He said that the chances of the rest working and not needing to do the arthroscopy are more than 50% so quite hopeful. He explained that this is because often the cause of dysplasia can be because the two bones that meet at the elbow joint are growing at different rates and therefore aren't fitting together like they should. The rest is supposed to enable the growth of the bones a chance to catch up and grow into each other in the right way. Well it sounded better when he explained it, I am bad at explaining things.

I am also looking into getting a chiropractor. I would really like to avoid surgery.

He also told me to stop researching into it on the internet as there is a lot of crap out there and I was reading things that stressed me out and confused me even more (not referring to DOL).

On another note, Chester has learnt with his clicker and target training to open and shut the cupboard door using his nose, clever boy. I may regret that later....

That's good news so far Tenille W. Fingers crossed all goes well for Chester and the need for surgery can be avoided. Please keep us posted.

I think that keeping him mentally stimulated while he's being confined is vital so while you may regret it later I'd be training him as much as possible atm. It will keep him from getting too bored if nothing else!

Good luck!

[Staranais]

He said that the chances of the rest working and not needing to do the arthroscopy are more than 50% so quite hopeful. He explained that this is because often the cause of dysplasia can be because the two bones that meet at the elbow joint are growing at different rates and therefore aren't fitting together like they should. The rest is supposed to enable the growth of the bones a chance to catch up and grow into each other in the right way. Well it sounded better when he explained it, I am bad at explaining things.

I am also looking into getting a chiropractor. I would really like to avoid surgery.

That's great news! You explained it just fine, & I'm happy for you. It's hard to keep them confined, but it will be worth it if it avoids the surgery.

Did he see the incongruity at the elbow joint in the rads, or are they just guessing it might be there?

Hopefully you can avoid surgery, but if he does need it, far better to get it than not get it.

[Lollipup]

He said that the chances of the rest working and not needing to do the arthroscopy are more than 50% so quite hopeful. He explained that this is because often the cause of dysplasia can be because the two bones that meet at the elbow joint are growing at different rates and therefore aren't fitting together like they should. The rest is supposed to enable the growth of the bones a chance to catch up and grow into each other in the right way. Well it sounded better when he explained it, I am bad at explaining things.

I am also looking into getting a chiropractor. I would really like to avoid surgery.

That's great news! You explained it just fine, & I'm happy for you. It's hard to keep them confined, but it will be worth it if it avoids the surgery.

Did he see the incongruity at the elbow joint in the rads, or are they just guessing it might be there?

Hopefully you can avoid surgery, but if he does need it, far better to get it than not get it.

They can't see the bone fragment but they can see an incongruity at the elbow, I think it was at the humerus. Its basically a lot more white built up there. I can see it but I don't remember what he called it. Some kind of lines that are normal on one elbow but on the left elbow you can't see the lines much, just a small but more concentrated mass of white. There's a difference anyway that is indicating the dysplasia. Hmm sounds like I have no idea what i am talking about...

[woody2shoes]

They can't see the bone fragment but they can see an incongruity at the elbow, I think it was at the humerus. Its basically a lot more white built up there. I can see it but I don't remember what he called it. Some kind of lines that are normal on one elbow but on the left elbow you can't see the lines much, just a small but more concentrated mass of white. There's a difference anyway that is indicating the dysplasia. Hmm sounds like I have no idea what i am talking about...

No, it's all very complicated stuff and you are doing well to remember any of it Tenille!

The best picture I ever got of what was going on was from the CT Scans at Werribee Vet Hospital. The surgeon was able to show us the fragment in her left elbow clear as day and he suspected she had FCP in the right one too. She did - the fragment just hadn't broken away yet, that was all!

Keep at it. If you can avoid surgery it will be a great thing!

[piper]

Hopefully the rest works Tenille and you avoid the surgery.

Just thought of some more fun training tasks for you - look up some assistance dog training. Things like pulling zips, taking socks off, indicating a door bell or phone ringing. Hold and give of lots and lots of different type and size items.

[bordacollies4me]

sorry to hear about Chester, but hope his rest helps...

just thought i would give some info on a chiro ...

Robert Humpries he is locasted in Jimboomba but well worth the drive, i regularly take my 5 down, he is very reasonably priced at $40 only if they need adjusting, his contact ph is.. 5547 7595

[Lollipup]

sorry to hear about Chester, but hope his rest helps...

just thought i would give some info on a chiro ...

Robert Humpries he is locasted in Jimboomba but well worth the drive, i regularly take my 5 down, he is very reasonably priced at $40 only if they need adjusting, his contact ph is.. 5547 7595

Wow that's funny because we used to live in Jimboomba before we moved to bundaberg, it's our home town and my OHs parents still live there so that's a possibility. Thanks!

[Lollipup]

Hopefully the rest works Tenille and you avoid the surgery.

Just thought of some more fun training tasks for you - look up some assistance dog training. Things like pulling zips, taking socks off, indicating a door bell or phone ringing. Hold and give of lots and lots of different type and size items.

Thank you Piper. I've actually just started my NDTF course and I'm doing assistance roles and substance detection electives plus the module on complex skills so any of those skills are a plus!! I'll have to look up some ideas.

[piper]

Thank you Piper. I've actually just started my NDTF course and I'm doing assistance roles and substance detection electives plus the module on complex skills so any of those skills are a plus!! I'll have to look up some ideas.

A couple more thoughts Body targetting using different body parts - shoulders, hips, bum, sides of face etc. You can then use those to get some other cute tricks. You can teach yes and no through use of targets and devel

[piper]

Thank you Piper. I've actually just started my NDTF course and I'm doing assistance roles and substance detection electives plus the module on complex skills so any of those skills are a plus!! I'll have to look up some ideas.

A couple more thoughts Body targetting using different body parts - shoulders, hips, bum, sides of face etc. You can then use those to get some other cute tricks. You can teach yes and no through use of targets and develop some fun questions to use as cues or a discrete hand signal so you can ask different questions.

If you have to video your training of a complex behaviour don't make the msitake I did when doing my complex behaviour for my delta course when I did it years ago - I didn't think Piper would pick things up as quickly as she did so decided not to get the video camera out a few times and it was really hard to show the training of each phase when she knew what was required. I ended up doing a second complex behaviour and videoing it from the start instead.

Edited November 17, 2010 by piper

[Lollipup]

Hey all, well the four weeks is up tomorrow and we go to the vet tomorrow night to see where to go from here. I took Chester outside for some training and a bit of a walk around today. He also had a short spurt of a run in the back yard. I thought all was well until we came inside and a few minutes later watching him walk I noticed a limp again

I want to ask the vet tomorrow about some natural supplements we may be able to try. But it is looking like he will need the surgery

[Staranais]

Oh dear, that's a pity! I was hoping the crate rest would have done the trick for you.

If he needs the surgery, you can still give the supplements to help the joint heal & to protect the cartilage. My understanding is that there's very little concrete evidence that these oral supplements help significantly to prevent arthritis (with the possible exception of Pentosan), but they may help and they're not thought to do any harm. Since her shoulder OCD surgery my girl has been filled with so many pills she nearly rattled, poor thing, not to mention the injectable chondroprotectants she is periodically given.

What we're on, if it helps, is glucosamine, fish oil (+ vit E), green lipped mussels (she likes them whole, but you can get powder!), and injectable Pentosan. She also sometimes gets chondroitin & MSM.