MonElite Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 As to communication - my dog "knocks" on the door when he wants to go out or come in, paws the fridge if he is hungry, or if really hungry barks at the fridge than runs to me to check if I'm paying attention :-) He will paw my runners if he wants to go for a walk, and point the collar that he wears for walks. They communicate a lot in DOG language it is up to us to understand this language. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V.A.H. Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Darken the room--his and yours Close all doors, sound proof the bedroom.?? Wear him out, or give him a whisky before bed?? Pigs ears, a clock ticking in a blankie,his own teddy to snuggle?? When he's fine IGNORE--Sidoney has hit the nail on the head Buy ears plugs--yours!! And the best of British to you, what al ovely pup, I am sure he's going to be great soon enough! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralee Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) Hi Gibbo. Fortunately, I have enough time not to have to go down the "ignore the dog" route. Personally, I don't think it's good for them. I know it's not what's been done in the past, but to me the contemporary thinking of yesterday is so 'old school'. At puppy school on Thursday night we were told to check chain. I won't be doing that either. They also use a spray bottle. Hey, why don't you just use a bow and arrow? I, like you, also have a 12 week old pup but I can see that it is the only thing which we have in common. I know my views are not popular but this is the approach I wish to explore. I am not alone on this. My chief mentor has directed me to Delta Obedience. DOL is a forum. An open forum. An open public forum. I didn't bait you or attack you. Good Luck with your dog. Edit: reference to Delta Obedience Edited January 31, 2005 by Troy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cavNrott Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) . Edited December 22, 2008 by cavNrott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Great advice Sidoney, and written simply and eloquently. Gibbo, it might be a good idea to take your lovely little pup over to visit the neighbours for an introduction. You can explain how you are trying to keep the little one quiet in the mornings, so if they are being disturbed by the barking, they will understand that you are taking steps to stop this happenning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralee Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Hi Gibbo. I appreciate that not everyone has the time, energy or interest that dogs require but I do think that the basics cannot be discounted. Animal care requires humane treatment, not just because its nice but because its the law. Hey greytmate. Keep in mind that dogs are pack animals, and by not having him inside with you, you are excluding him from his pack. He just wants to be with you. Great advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Yes pewithers, but a dog must learn that he can't always have what he wants. Even in a multiple dog family, I would advise that the dogs become accustomed to being left alone occasionally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifi Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Pewithers, I think you may be setting your pup up for acute separation anxiety. They should learn that sometimes thier human wont be available at all times. Dogs do need boundries & discipline all delivered with consistency, and not from anger. Yes, they also need company, unconditional love and training. And whilst not all modern methods agree, I still believe in the pack structure with me as top bitch! Gibbo, I have a multiple (lots) dog household, each one was raised with similar methods recommencded by Sidoney & Greymate, the only one who is a problem barker and quite anxious - is the one who had me on tap at all times, she was sick for several weeks at four months, and I was in attendance for her every whim! she's a spoilt bugger now, and is slowly learning safe separation and non reward for barking. We have proven the methods suggested by those who've been around for yonks, especially with rescues, who have been able to settle into a happy routine. good luck with your new baby, he may also need some canine company too, fifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralee Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) Yes pewithers, but a dog must learn that he can't always have what he wants. Yes of course, but the owners have to make some sacrifices too. It seems to me, the more sacrifices the better. I am happy to make an unrestricted number of sacrifies because dogs are reasonable; the number really required is limited. I am simply not willing to leave any out. It's only fair that people get more than a one-sided view. Besides owners can't always have everything they want either. I thought they'd be aware of that. Afterall, that's the commitment they make when they take a dog on; it's their responsibility and their obligation. Anyway, no advice, no judgement, no condemnation. Just an anecdote that gives another perspective. Edited January 31, 2005 by pewithers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bommy Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) This is a post I believe by GIBBO!!! PLEASE DO NOT HI JACK IT. Gibbo, look I used the same method Sidoney has described not only on my dogs but also on my kids except for the it was described by Dr Richard Furber & is designed for kids I just applied the same principles for my dogs,WHICH BASICALLY IS IGNORE hey no barking early in the morining, my dogs like my kids are well adjusted, happy social creatures who love my companionship but also love their time! LETS FACE IT, try as you may thoughthere is no way you can substitute human behavious for dogs or vice versa to do so could lead to a grand failure. So I would think that letting them be a dog get used to the PACK ORDER but also isolation is a good thing. SO I WOULD SAY FOLLOW SIDONEYS ADVICE, many other experienced people here have said go for it they would be the ones to take heed of. BTW Hubby is a fireman & poodlegirl is right! Jacqui Edited January 31, 2005 by bommy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tralee Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) Pewithers, I think you may be setting your pup up for acute separation anxiety. Sooki has spent an absolute minimum of time 'crying' and doesn't cry at all now; not even when she is penned so that I can leave her for a time. As I have made obvious, I don't have any evidence of your fears. They should learn that sometimes their human wont be available at all times. It is also indicated, in the quoted statement above, that Sooki has learned how to cope during periods of confinement and isolation. However, I have noted your points, as I have always done. Edited January 31, 2005 by pewithers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifi Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 I'm glad Sooki is doing well. I have never been an advocate of leaving a pup crying and barking hysterically for an indefinite period of time, I think pups need a 'controlled crying' time, so that they know we won't jump to their every sound, but are careful to respond within a fair period of time, if its obvious they are really distressed. I find if the settling in barking/crying time is reducing each day, then its working, some pups do have real fear and leaving them to scream themselves hoarse isnt providing them with a safe environment. I think its a judgement call, not all methods will work with all pups. You do get to know that naughty demanding attention bark, from the ' I'm genuinley unhappy cry. our pups have a huge pen & crate in the lounge, we let them out for last wees at 10pm and try and wake them for first pit stop at 6am. they are then put back in the pen without much interaction, and soon learn that quiet must prevail until at least 7am. fifi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacklabrador Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) PW how did this thread end up about you? Someone else asks advice and you take over. I agree that someone must be able to have access to more than one point of view. BUT you are running your own puppy school there - largely experimental practices, many of which aren't recommended - either with modern practices or older practices. When you have raised several pups on your own with these practices and have been completely successful with several different dog personalities.. you may then speak with some authority on your point of view. (Your point of view has changed MARKEDLY in between "reading" about a pup and actually "getting" a pup - initial posts in 'fact or fiction' - you mentioned getting a puppy muzzle etc ). So when you are talking about your puppy rearing practices - please inform the person who you are "advising" that you are NEW to puppy rearing and really just feeling your way along for the first time. Its obvious to us... its not necessarily obvious to the newcomer. Sorry Gibbo... I did just hijack this further - but needed to say this. Edited January 31, 2005 by blacklabrador Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Hi, I would just like to add in my two cents worth because I just can't keep my mouth shut! From your first post I believe you said that the back door is open so that he can go out and toilet whenever he needs during the night? Am I correct? Just wanted to clarify. My first thought would be that it's getting light at that time, the birds are singing etc. If you close the door and keep it nice and dark in the laundry you *might* find he sleeps a little longer- my three do, they are not puppies of course, but if we sleep till 8 or 9 in the morning, they don't get up either!! I would go with Sidoney's advice- try to catch him before he starts barking, take him out the the toilet and when you bring him back in, settle him quickly back to bed and give him his breakfast stuffed in a Kong, or a nice big bone, every morning, without fail. The rationale being that if he wakes, has a wander outside, then has early brekky and a full tummy, hopefully he'll go right back to sleep- you might get to sleep till 7am, no promises though! LOL This is a proven one- a stuffed Kong or a raw bone will be much more interesting than playing on his own with his toys. Good Luck Mel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greytmate Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 I am happy to make an unrestricted number of sacrifies because dogs are reasonable; the number really required is limited. Dogs are not reasonable. They are not able to reason. This thread is not about you making sacrifices for your dog, it is about helping Gibbo train his dog. You are not contributing towards that. The fact that you are willing to make unrestricted sacrifices towards your own dog is irrelevant here, but I will say that it shows that you are a poor example for the role of pack leader, and quite possibly when your dog is mature she will take advantage of your weaknesses and take on that role for herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abzndbonnie Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 i have a boxer and a golden retriever and they never barked untilw e moved this year and we are right near a road and everytime someone walks past they go for it and bark like crazy. There's is a territorial problem, theyve never had people so close to the fence before. We cant change it we have tried ignoring them yelling at them, but in the end it probably lets people know we have dogs and they arent going to get in our yard. also i notice a boxer lover in here, our dog has been jumping our fence and getting out ever since we got her. She is a retired show dog but we got her at 18 months and she is now 9 and has been getting out i reckon about 3 to 4 times a month and we have to chase her for miles! we are concerned about ehr safety and also all the pound bills!! we have tried the low-power electric fence, making the fence higher(but she digs under) closing our old fence up with more wire(but again she jumped over) it got to one stage the two dogs nearlly killed a sheep. they have NEVER hurt anyone and they are very gentle but this once they got to a sheep and it ended up ugly. we are quite fed up with this and it has resulted in the boxer being tied up and she gets let off and taken for walks every day. She's a terror but we love her. we have also tried building runs but she stil gets out. We should have named her huidine!! do u have any suggestions? love abz xox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jed Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Gibbo has posed a problem - and has received good advice about how to cope with his own situation. Owners want to keep their dog in the situation which is best for them. Gibbo, I had a similar problem - with an 8 week old cocker pup I was minding for a friend. He began barking at 4am. Ignoring him did work to some extent .. but not totally. However, he did grow out of it --- just in time to go home!! pewithers, you have certain aspirations for your pup, and indeed some breeders and trainers do advocate allowing the pup to sleep in the bedroom in a crate. This works for most pups However, if Gibbo's pup is to sleep in the laundry, he needs to learn social habits. There are many successful methods of puppy raising and training, but the best method is the one which works for you. I don't think pewithers was hijacking the thread, he was suggesting something which was working for him - in his own situation. His method works for him, but this is not what Gibbo wants. Incidentally, the very best dog I ever owned sustained some serious injuries at 10 weeks, and her recovery necessitated her being close to me for the next 10 weeks - this included sleeping in the bedroom, and spending about 20 hours a day with me. Whether this was the reason she was the best dog I've had is a moot point - there is no criteria to judge by, but going by my own experience, I don't think Sooki will develop separation anxiety. I had another very good dog which was hand raised from 3 weeks and slept in the bedroom from that day until she died, 12 years later. She had no problems either. I've had others who spent their formative years sleeping in the laundry at night - also very good dogs. The main thing to remember is that the dog is a social animal, Cockers were bred to be close to people, so ensure the dog has sufficient people time. Horses for courses!! s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo Posted January 31, 2005 Author Share Posted January 31, 2005 (edited) I'll try to cover most of what i have read and learnt Well that opened a can of Worms. Thanks to all those that added there constructive advice to my situation. I took the bait and landed the thread in Hi-jack teritory so I'm not too fussed - i got out of it what i needed - good constructive advice from people who took into account my situation Although I've been around dogs all my life, my parents have had Dogs before (Golden Retriever and a German Sheperd) - This is My first Puppy where I will be the pack leader. I am a newbie to both the forum and to the role. Just goes to show how good forums like these are. I've learnt something - and 1 or two others may have too. To answer a few questions - the laundry is probably getting a little light in the mornings - i'm installing a doggy door this weekend - which hopefully will keep it a little darker for him. I have the laundry door propped open - although wilburs area is still warm and out of the wind/rain etc. I have to agree with fifi (and others that have mentioned it) - it is definately the "Naughtly demanding attention" bark - i know when he is genuinely unhappy about something. Like last saturday when i accidentally left all of his toys on the kitchen table and he couldn't get them. he also has a defense bark that is quite funny - i shouldn't laugh at it but is is so cute - he thinks he is so tough. Greytmate - I spoke to the neighbours last night and they hadn't actually heard anything yet - so maybe i'm parranoid. They thanked me for the notice as well and Wilbur got to meet the cats next door (from a distance) I'm sure they taunt him anyway The neighbours have already met Wilbur - and they all love him. Status Report----> Last night Wilbur woke up at about 3;30 - had a bit of a cry for about 5 minutes - went outside to the loo and went back to sleep. he's been doing this on and off. He didn't get up to full barking power which was good. At 5:30 he woke up with the birds/cars in the area and had a cry for about 10 minutes - a few loud puppy barks and then to settled down for a rest. My actual alarm clock went off at 6am - for me to go to work - and Wilbur was sitting on his bed. I went to the laundry - gave him lots of praise and a few treats - we then went outside and there were a few wee spots on the paving from the night before. When I went to work - Wilbur had a bit of a cry again - My Fiance was up by then and ready to take him for a quick walk around the block. As we spoke about - that would be his reward when he settles down again in the morning. When he did it was walking time. Last night was "interesting" I think the past few weeks i've tried to resist the urge of going to hom. I should receive my clickers in the mail in the next few days - but I started training Wilbur with treats and his dumb-bell. He is doing the grip very well. I've attached his photo of him sitting for us - this was taken about 3 weeks ago. Edited January 31, 2005 by Gibbo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bommy Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 Awwwww Gibbo he is so cute! Jacqui Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ninaandted Posted January 31, 2005 Share Posted January 31, 2005 he is gorgeous - did you say his name was wilbur? excellent! good luck with everything! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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