New Obedience & Tracking Rules

[bedazzledx2]

Not clever! The rules are quite clear about a distinct loop in the lead and for it to allow the dog freedom of movement. There's no shortcut for good training and it'll fall apart in Novice without the lead.

Maybe so the ones who are woeful right across the entire round don't get a rude shock in Novice when they get their CCD title on three scores of 70? I've seen a lot of tight leads in CCD scraping through, there is a fair chance they won't cope with the lead removed.

At least they are only scraping through - I watched a CCD ring recently where dogs on tight leads were scoring in the 90s. Many held their leads in their right hands and then braced the lead against their left hip area. Also watched an experienced trialler correct a dog harshly in the figure 8 behind the judge's back. Same dog placed on a countback.

[wuffles]

Do you think that there is a judging issue that should be addressed as well with CCD if people are being given scores they don't deserve?

I won't be trialling until I think we are well and truly ready, so I don't have a problem with any of the new rules, but it's hard starting out so reading these forums gets me worried sometimes that if we don't score in the high 90s then people will be thinking "they're one of THOSE people"

[leopuppy04]

I think it's great that they've made CCD a bit more challenging. It was too easy and as a result far too many dogs were hitting the rings not prepared enough for it. I think a higher pass mark brings it more inline with other classes and making the stand for exam worth a bit more is also good as it's not an easy exercise to train and 10 points was a bit skimpy!

I don't think making the stays 4 metres longer should have a huge impact, the dogs I've seen blow it tend to lie down, sit up or go play with their neighbour, that's going to happen regardless of the distance the handler is from the dog. I can only hope that these changes mean people will think a little more before entering CCD or maybe clubs will spend a little more time training and helping newbies before they hit the ring. I don't know what it's like in other states but the standard of work here in QLD in CCD is dismal.

Couldn't agree with you more Seita! There are some lovely working CCD dogs, and they won't be affected by the new rules. I think it we make it a little more challenging then people won't just enter 'just to see how they go'. I also like the inclusion in the rules about the constant tightening of the lead etc. How many dogs to you see that only turn when the lead tells them their owner is going somewhere! To me - heeling should be like dancing - a perfect synchrony of handler and dog working together... at least thats what I am for... whether we get there or not.......

Bugger, Scoota's request for a rule change to being allowed to stand in the box obviously didn't get through

Scent discrimination in UDX is made a little harder with the stewards putting the wash cloths out by hand (not tongs) and then the dog having to find the judges scent.

Oooh that does make it a little harder. Poor Scoota - he mustn't have pushed hard enough for his rules! Just make sure you TELL him that his rule change didn't get in Ptolomy - otherwise he might want to continue to stand :D. At least he FINDS the box and doesn't go out and do the jump on the way out

Neither did Ness's of UD via logbook .

What did Ness request?!

Not clever! The rules are quite clear about a distinct loop in the lead and for it to allow the dog freedom of movement. There's no shortcut for good training and it'll fall apart in Novice without the lead.

Couldn't agree more bedazzled!!! Good triaining at the start and you reap the rewards at the end of it all

Now.... back to remind Kinta what a stay means..... LOL

[leopuppy04]

Do you think that there is a judging issue that should be addressed as well with CCD if people are being given scores they don't deserve?

I won't be trialling until I think we are well and truly ready, so I don't have a problem with any of the new rules, but it's hard starting out so reading these forums gets me worried sometimes that if we don't score in the high 90s then people will be thinking "they're one of THOSE people"

don't be silly Wuffles. I remember getting passes on 82 etc, so just because you don't make hte 85 doesn't mean that the dog doesn't work well - but it's quite common to score well in CCD if your dog works well :D. I find all the people I trial with are really nice to newbies. We encourage them to do well - we've all been there before and had our dogs work terribly as it just wasn't their day . I think everyone should be encouraged to have a go, although sometimes people really do put their dogs in before they are ready for it

Ava will be fine - she's an Aussie

[ness]

LP Ness requested that all you had to do for a UD title was pass each exercise 3 times and you could get them signed off. Didn't matter if you didn't pass them all in the one day .

Think she also had a vote in for Scoota's stand in the box.

Edited October 14, 2010 by ness

[JulesP]

Problem is I don't think it will stop the 'lets have a go' people from entering. They will just fail worse and I am going to be further away from rescuing my dog if their unstable dog goes and jumps on her!

[leopuppy04]

Tell ness that Leo would have voted +1 with her!!

[Staff'n'Toller]

LP Ness requested that all you had to do for a UD title was pass each exercise 3 times and you could get them signed off. Didn't matter if you didn't pass them all in the one day .

Think she also had a vote in for Scoota's stand in the box.

Ness needs like the QND in retrieving, finish 5 trials and you get your novice title.

[ness]

Ness votes for removing the 170 minimum so long as you pass each and every exercise . Or maybe wildcard UD where you can select an exercise and receive full marks without having to complete it.

Edited October 14, 2010 by ness

[Seita]

Bugger, Scoota's request for a rule change to being allowed to stand in the box obviously didn't get through

Ella would like this to apply for Drop in the box too!

I think it's great that they've made CCD a bit more challenging. It was too easy and as a result far too many dogs were hitting the rings not prepared enough for it. I think a higher pass mark brings it more inline with other classes and making the stand for exam worth a bit more is also good as it's not an easy exercise to train and 10 points was a bit skimpy!

I don't think making the stays 4 metres longer should have a huge impact, the dogs I've seen blow it tend to lie down, sit up or go play with their neighbour, that's going to happen regardless of the distance the handler is from the dog. I can only hope that these changes mean people will think a little more before entering CCD or maybe clubs will spend a little more time training and helping newbies before they hit the ring. I don't know what it's like in other states but the standard of work here in QLD in CCD is dismal.

Couldn't agree with you more Seita! There are some lovely working CCD dogs, and they won't be affected by the new rules. I think it we make it a little more challenging then people won't just enter 'just to see how they go'. I also like the inclusion in the rules about the constant tightening of the lead etc. How many dogs to you see that only turn when the lead tells them their owner is going somewhere! To me - heeling should be like dancing - a perfect synchrony of handler and dog working together... at least thats what I am for... whether we get there or not.......

I agree about there being some really nice dogs in CCD too and obviously some that are ready but have terrible handlers (wink wink Huski) there's just alot of really really crap dogs in there as well. I'm glad they've put the tightening of the lead thing into the rules although it should have been penalised for all along... I remember be penalilsed for that back in Novice under the old rules when I started trialling my first dog like 10 years ago

[RubyStar]

Do you think that there is a judging issue that should be addressed as well with CCD if people are being given scores they don't deserve?

I won't be trialling until I think we are well and truly ready, so I don't have a problem with any of the new rules, but it's hard starting out so reading these forums gets me worried sometimes that if we don't score in the high 90s then people will be thinking "they're one of THOSE people"

I'm sure people must think similar of me when they see me in Open with Ruby

Ruby was one dog that was entered into CCD way before she was ready, and look at us, we are still paying the price for trialling before being ready. I think a lot of people with their first dogs fall into that trap.

Second dog comes along, you're not as eager to jump into the ring. I waited until Millie was ready and then waited a bit more. It has paid off, she is only 1 pass short of her CD title and has taken less than 5 months pretty much in straight passes including CCD (the Royal though was a big fail, stagefright got the better of her ) Took me about a year after CCD to get the guts to enter Ruby into CD and then it took us 6 months to get CD. Think it might take years to get Ruby's CDX but if things keep going well, Millie will have hers well before Ruby.

Anyway I've gone off onto a tangent with info noone really cares about ;) Back in my hole

Edited October 14, 2010 by RubyStar

[RubyStar]

Neither did Ness's of UD via logbook .

Ruby requested that for Open

[RubyStar]

Maybe so the ones who are woeful right across the entire round don't get a rude shock in Novice when they get their CCD title on three scores of 70? I've seen a lot of tight leads in CCD scraping through, there is a fair chance they won't cope with the lead removed.

At least they are only scraping through - I watched a CCD ring recently where dogs on tight leads were scoring in the 90s. Many held their leads in their right hands and then braced the lead against their left hip area. Also watched an experienced trialler correct a dog harshly in the figure 8 behind the judge's back. Same dog placed on a countback.

I remember one trial where someone in CCD was yanking the lead to get the dog's nose off the ground while heeling and when it wouldn't auto-sit, they'd click their fingers as a double signal. It wasn't a pretty round, but, they came 1st! I would hate to see the new qualifying score make obedience numbers drop even more, but at the same time, I hope it increases the standard. I wish it had been tougher when I started with Ruby, we mightn't have jumped in so quickly. And while I am still struggling with her in the ring, I wouldn't like to see the exercises get easier just to pass, I am aiming to get BETTER and if the exercises got harder to pass, well that's ok too!! Something to work towards

[Tay.]

How often do rules get changed??

[kallistar]

Bugger, Scoota's request for a rule change to being allowed to stand in the box obviously didn't get through

Scent discrimination in UDX is made a little harder with the stewards putting the wash cloths out by hand (not tongs) and then the dog having to find the judges scent.

I had a helper with doing the JSD who put the clothes out by hand earlier this year.. me having pink kittens about it, Tux passed that with flying colours

for the Distance Control... 4 would of been plenty... and with a recall at the end to make it a more upbeat exercerise. ( I hate this because it is such a down exercise for Tux and me)

And for the MR, why couldn't they just do 1 leather, that way Tux would only get one chance to be over the top happy ( he is very vocal with the exercises that he loves to do). Did try to stop it, but had a very unhappy dog who refused to retrieve his dumbell so have learnt to wear it.

[TerraNik]

How often do rules get changed??

Every 5 years or so

[SmoothieGirl]

Maybe so the ones who are woeful right across the entire round don't get a rude shock in Novice when they get their CCD title on three scores of 70? I've seen a lot of tight leads in CCD scraping through, there is a fair chance they won't cope with the lead removed.

At least they are only scraping through - I watched a CCD ring recently where dogs on tight leads were scoring in the 90s. Many held their leads in their right hands and then braced the lead against their left hip area. Also watched an experienced trialler correct a dog harshly in the figure 8 behind the judge's back. Same dog placed on a countback.

I remember one trial where someone in CCD was yanking the lead to get the dog's nose off the ground while heeling and when it wouldn't auto-sit, they'd click their fingers as a double signal. It wasn't a pretty round, but, they came 1st! I would hate to see the new qualifying score make obedience numbers drop even more, but at the same time, I hope it increases the standard. I wish it had been tougher when I started with Ruby, we mightn't have jumped in so quickly. And while I am still struggling with her in the ring, I wouldn't like to see the exercises get easier just to pass, I am aiming to get BETTER and if the exercises got harder to pass, well that's ok too!! Something to work towards

While they got first place, please tell me they didn't get a pass?

We've just started trialing and Bronte has her first CCD pass with 83. Mind you, while she nailed everything, her heeling was very average and I didn't expect a pass. To the outside observer she probably looked great, no tightness on the lead, nailed all position requests apart from one auto-sit, but to me her heeling was airy fairy and a bit off the leg. We've worked on that lately and I'm expecting much better things tomorrow at Eastern, but still I'll be crossing my fingers a little that I don't project any nervousness down the lead to her.

The rule changes don't phase me at all, distance changs are no real issue unless we start talking 20 odd metres away. Personally I'd leave the returns in to help trainers teach the dog a little honesty in completing the task. What I mean by that is having the dog really wait until it is released from position, rather than doing the exercise and then quickly releasing the dog. But whatever, it really makes little difference to my training and trailing habits. Its all about not rote training our dogs and getting them used to the unexpected, that way they should (we hope) respond on the specific command, rather than anticipating and making it up.

Btw, if a dog jumps on my dog in the stays I'd be annoyed as she would probably break, stuffing up our chances for a pass, but heck we all have to start somewhere and we don't always get our judgement right. Trialing is different to our usual training and sometimes us nuffy's get it wrong or our tension creates the wrong reactions in our dogs, but we don't know until we try.

I agree that people should be encouraged to wait until their dog is well and truely ready to trial, but we need to be a little patient with others. Some people will never go further than CCD because to them that is a huge achievement in itself and not everyone out there is as serious as the dog and handler that may be standing next to them. To some of us this is our real life (having to work being an annoying distraction) to others trialing is just their recreational past time.

This is a little I know, but sometimes I think we DOLers forget that we are all RAVING DOG MAD and that there are other very good owners out in the world that that enjoy their dogs just a wee bit more passively than us.

Anyways, thanks heaps for posting the updates. Typical that I've just this week printed and bound the current rules. Oh well, I'll just be back at Officeworks again in Jan now.

Edited October 16, 2010 by SmoothieGirl

[sas]

oohhhhhhh - that's ok then! I was going to say - that's a bit harsh if you miss ONE sit or ONE drop or ONE stand you fail!!!

I was freaking out there

[JulesP]

SmoothieGirl if a dog jumped on Poppy in the stays I doubt I would be able to get her back in the ring. So I would be totally pissed off. Nothing to do with me being a nutty DOLer.

[Mrs Rusty Bucket]

I watched one tiny dog in CCD trial - it bounced around the heel work like a yoyo on a rubber band I don't think it did one sit, one drop, or one stand (not still anyway). And then when it came around to the recall, the handler picked it up, put it in the sit postion, told it to stay - left her dog, marched towards the judge, and the dog gleefully took off and shot past both of them. Judge said "exercise finished" (not complete).

I'd call that a classic example of "not ready" but maybe they could do all the work perfectly at training - I don't know. I wouldn't promise that my dog who can do all that is required for CCD on or off lead - at training - wouldn't do she liked in a trial. Oh the lure of possum poo. I think if I ever do decide to trial I will tell the judge that I'm doing everthing I'd do at training except give her treats - ie not let her get away with being naughty - just because it's a trial and you're not supposed to double signal or correct.