I Tried To Be A Good Samaritan Last Night

[Guest Ams]

Hi Kirsty

I'm usually just a lurker on these forums (I'm in the local pet rescue scene so I just like to visit the forums to keep up on the latest news in the dog world), but I joined up so I could shoot you a message. Sounds like we live roughly in the same area. Listen, in the event that you see the dog again (fingers crossed; sounds like those grotty teenagers are locals), I'd suggest you phone Peninsula Animal Aid. They're located in Clontarf (Redcliffe), only about 20 minutes drive from Narangba.

Unlike the RSPCA, PAA is a no-kill shelter. I know that they're currently at full capacity with their dogs unfortunately - however if you visit their website, there's an after-hours mobile you can call (the lady is called Lynne, I believe - very no-nonsense but passionate about pet rescue and a huge dog lover). I'm sure Lynne would help you and would not fob you off like the council and the RSPCA did (who IMO are fairly useless).

I understand you may not have wanted to get into an altercation with the teens by taking their dog if they were there... in a situation like that, I'd recommend bluffing and telling the teens that the council have instructed you to take the dog to the nearest shelter facility. If they tried to obstruct you, threaten to phone the police. They wouldn't want to tangle with that and would get out of your face pretty quickly. Also if memory serves, Narangba station has cameras, which is another deterrent in case they wanted to get nasty.

Morally, they have no right to be owning that dog. From a legal perspective... well, there's no logical way you could get into trouble for taking the dog in this particular situation, I'll tell you that much. You're not a council representative, so technically you're not allowed to seize dogs. However: the dog is un-registered, unmicrochipped and is wandering loose in a public place, which means it can be impounded as a stray. Given that the dog had no registration or microchip, the teens have no legal way to prove that the dog is theirs. Any person whose dog is unregistered and is found wandering is subject to a hefty fine. The scabby teens can't be bothered to spend any money on the dog anyway, so they wouldn't pay to get the dog back. The dog would be held for the required number of days at the shelter, and would then revert to being the property of the relevant shelter. After which the dog can be desexed, given the necessary vet care, microchipped and re-homed to a place where it will actually be looked after and loved.

Realistically, if you see that dog again and it has no tags or ID, there is nothing to stop you from picking it up and taking it somewhere and saying that you found it wandering - people do it all the time. You're not stealing the dog, and again - scabby teens have no proof that they own the dog. (Trying to not rant about their abhorrent lack of care for the dog and just keep this factual...)

In the event that you're in a similar situation again, hopefully this might help?

Legally if she had taken the dog then she could well have been charged with stealing. The fact the psns stating they owned the dog but could not prove it at the time is immaterial. Unless she could prove they did not they could make a complaint and it may well stick. Stealing is taking something you know is not yours with an intent to deprive the owner of the thing. If you take a dog to a pound knowing the person will not know where you have taken it or have the funds to retrieve it (esp when they are present when you take said dog) there would be a reasonable case to answer.

In this instance the OP did everything she could.

[Souff]

Impersonating a council officer is NOT a good idea. It is probably a sure-fire way to have a charge laid against you.

And I wouldn't be too sure that the teens could not prove that they owned the dog either.

[Souff]

The RSPCA at Fairfield is open 24/7 for stray/surrenders and anyone is able to take a dog there. The local police do not pick up lost/found dogs. They will occassionally help with an injured dog if routine business permits. The OP did the best she could in the circumstances. There are huge holes in after hours services in Qld and this is simply one example.

This is just a hindsight view, BUT, if you have a stray dog on our hands and it needs a lift to the 24/7 shelter at Fairfield, why not send a message through to this wonderful community of DOLers !

I am sure there would be a DOLer in the area who has a vehicle and can drive and would be willing to be the Dog Taxi for that night.

Souff

[The Teacup Warrior]

I didn't say she should impersonate a council officer. I said she should tell them the council told her to take it to a shelter. Hell, if the council can't come get it, why not ask the guy on the phone if she has permission to take it to a shelter? I'm sure he would say yes.

I'm not trying to criticise, so please don't take it that way. I'm simply offering advice and information in the event that anyone here finds themselves in a similar situation in the future.

As far as stealing the dog - it's only stealing if she takes it with the intent to keep it. The scabby teens said that their friend "gave" them the dog. They have no documentation or registration to prove it's theirs. And irregardless, the teenagers are in the wrong by leaving an unregistered dog in a public place (which they admitted to) - a dog which sounds like it's in definite need of medical care.

I'm not saying she should have taken the dog. What I am saying is that if she wanted to, legally she she could not be charged with stealing. She's not taking the dog with intent to keep it. The animal is clearly neglected and as the OP describes it, was at risk of being hit by a car and a train on several occasions. She would have every right to remove the animal.

Frankly, I could care less about the property rights of the teenagers. This dog is clearly being neglected - the focus should be on the dog's rights. It was left running loose in a public place, without food or shelter. Whether it was for a few hours or not is utterly irrelevant - doing that to an animal is actually a violation of animal cruelty laws. One could also argue that if the dog were aggressive, the teens could be held liable for public endangerment.

Again, I don't want to get bogged down in legal semantics. I'm simply suggesting a course of action in the event of a similar situation. Not everyone here will agree with it - and hey, not everybody has to! I'm sure if ten board members were put in the same situation, everyone would act differently. My point is, there are resources in the Moreton Bay Council area outside of the RSPCA and the council. I'm just sorry that the OP spent 2 hours being d*cked around by the RSPCA and council with no result, when she was clearly trying to do the right thing and help the animal.

[The Teacup Warrior]

Also, she could tell the scabby teens which shelter the dog was being taken to. If they don't have the money to get it back, frankly - who cares? If they don't have the money to register a dog and care for it properly, they shouldn't own it. It's not like she's abducting the dog to hold it for ransom.

I dunno, like I said - not everyone's going to agree. Not everyone's going to act the same way in a particular situation. If it were me, that's what I would have done - but then, as it has been pointed out to me by several people, I am a little crazy. Also very confrontational.

I still don't think she could get in trouble for theft. I've seen plenty of irritated neighbours bringing their neighbour's dogs in when they've found them outside of the yard. Whether that's right or not, I'm not getting into. But nobody would consider that stealing - even though they know who the owner is and could have just put it back in the yard.

[bridie]

Good for you for following this up Kristy...

Some serious butt kicking needs to be done and without your letters, the 'bosses' would never have known and actions like this would have continued.

Be assured that you did everything you could for this sweet dog but you have now helped alot more future stray dogs in the area.

Thanks

I was wondering if perhaps I was wasting my time, and then thought, even if I am, I've tried. I will let everyone know when I get a response.

I look at all the wonderful rescues the dolers do on here and it restores my faith that there are people that care.

P.S. Thanks Cody - even though I didn't know for this time, useful to know for future, even for my furkids. I didn't realise there were any nearby vets open till that late!

Heh Kirsty,

Have just read this thread,mate welcome to Australia so there are some good Poms over here. You did more than most would have done,you were let down by those that should have helped you and this poor dog,responses were pathetic....be it excuses,true or lies.

Have you seen this dog since? not that you'd want to go though all this again.

Thanks for caring.

[Tatelina]

Tricky but even though you don't have friends or family - there is a huge community here that would assist with doggy transport and care. Someone here would have taken the dog for you if you could have held it for a short time. A crate in the garage might have helped. Maybe you could collect yourself a list of contact numbers for nearby rescue organisations from Pet Rescue or here, just in case you meet that dog or one like it again.

A huge community whose helpful members aren't always online or able to assist. I can't imagine contacting a rescue and saying, 'I've found a stray dog, come and get it' and have someone turn up on the doorstep and say, 'Sure, we'll take this stray dog for you!' A nice notion but frankly unrealistic.

That is exactly what loads of the rescues do. In this case it was unrealistic, because the OP was unable to keep the dog safely for the time it would take to find a rescue volunteer to fetch the dog. It's not likley to be instant pickup. Even the council can't do that. But a phone call to a local rescue when nobody else would come would be one more thing to help the dog worth trying.

How many rescues do you know of, that take a stray dog directly from the street?

ALL stray dogs need to do the mandatory 7 or 14 days (according to their microchip status and state legislation).

ETA: Good for you OP for trying your best to help this dog out. May good karma flow back to you!

Edited October 12, 2010 by Tatelina

[The Teacup Warrior]

Plenty of rescue groups will take in strays directly off the street. Yes, they are required to hold them for X amount of days - rescue groups use that time to try to contact the original owner, see if the dog's microchipped etc; if the dog's not being cared for properly some rescue groups will ask if the owner would like to sign the dog over to the rescue organisation. If the dog's not claimed by X amount of days, the dog becomes the property of the rescue group and they're able to re-home.

In the meantime, the dog is cared for by the rescue group, fed properly, given shelter and is wormed and flea'ed straight away.

Even if the dog is re-claimed, generally the fine that's issued via the council serves as a good wake-up call for the owner to take better care of their dog.