Leash Walking

[aussielover]

Thanks Nekhbet

Thanks Aidan for the explanation, though I don't really see how a leash correction for inappropriate sniffing is "asking for more of a response than the animal understands"

[Aidan]

Thanks Aidan for the explanation, though I don't really see how a leash correction for inappropriate sniffing is "asking for more of a response than the animal understands"

This is one of the issues with "purely positive" training for loose leash walking. The environment will force you to lump, there will be distractions your dog can't handle. There are a few ways around this, you've found one.

Dogs are born with the "sniffing is how I find out about the world" program and we want them to understand the "sniffing is OK when I'm off-leash, but when I'm on-leash I've got to do this other thing instead" program.

So we're forced to lump. We could take it step-by-step, introduce distractions at a rate they succeed. Or we could stop them every time they tighten up the leash, either by jiggling the leash or taking a step away from the thing they want to get to, or whatever.

Does that make sense? Your reply sounded defensive, I'm not sure if you meant it to.

[aussielover]

Maybe a little defensive... LOL

I do understand more clearly now though after reading your second post.

I agree, indroducing distractions at a level they could handle would be ideal, but not realistic for many people.

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is). I mean, there are obviously different ways of dealing with distractions etc but I have been given a particular method and it seems to be working for us (i wouldn't keep using it if it didn't).

I only started this thread to see whether other people have had success or problems with this, as it is not a method i have used before (my other dog was allowed to do what she wanted on the lead, but luckily she was pretty good naturally with no training effort form me).

[aussielover]

Maybe a little defensive... LOL

I do understand more clearly now though after reading your second post.

I agree, indroducing distractions at a level they could handle would be ideal, but not realistic for many people.

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is). I mean, there are obviously different ways of dealing with distractions etc but I have been given a particular method and it seems to be working for us (i wouldn't keep using it if it didn't).

I only started this thread to see whether other people have had success or problems with this, as it is not a method i have used before (my other dog was allowed to do what she wanted on the lead, but luckily she was pretty good naturally with no training effort form me).

[Aidan]

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is).

I don't know if it's a bad thing or not and I didn't make that judgement. Obviously it would be bad to "throw her in the deep end". And honestly, gentle collar corrections are often not particularly effective so I would usually aim to prevent access to the sniffy stuff (although my dogs are allowed to sniff, just not pull). If you have a dog who is quite responsive and you can just give a little jiggle it's actually more gentle than, say, the "penalty yards" approach of backing up which usually needs to be quite firm.

[SpecTraining]

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is).

I don't know if it's a bad thing or not and I didn't make that judgement. Obviously it would be bad to "throw her in the deep end". And honestly, gentle collar corrections are often not particularly effective so I would usually aim to prevent access to the sniffy stuff (although my dogs are allowed to sniff, just not pull). If you have a dog who is quite responsive and you can just give a little jiggle it's actually more gentle than, say, the "penalty yards" approach of backing up which usually needs to be quite firm.

Throwing dogs in the deep end too quickly I think is a common mistake by many dog owners Aidan. A green dog/puppy taken for a walk the first few times with massive distractions it can't cope with, the dog will be all over the place with 101 unwanted behaviours I have found, then comes where to start reshaping the behaviour and many owners work on a behaviour that should possibly be perhaps behaviour No. 10 to address. The dog has missed the first 9 behavioural steps and the owner has jumped straight to behaviour 10 and the dog lacks the foundation work to fix behaviour 10 properly.........does this make sense???

Garry

[aussielover]

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is).

I don't know if it's a bad thing or not and I didn't make that judgement. Obviously it would be bad to "throw her in the deep end". And honestly, gentle collar corrections are often not particularly effective so I would usually aim to prevent access to the sniffy stuff (although my dogs are allowed to sniff, just not pull). If you have a dog who is quite responsive and you can just give a little jiggle it's actually more gentle than, say, the "penalty yards" approach of backing up which usually needs to be quite firm.

Throwing dogs in the deep end too quickly I think is a common mistake by many dog owners Aidan. A green dog/puppy taken for a walk the first few times with massive distractions it can't cope with, the dog will be all over the place with 101 unwanted behaviours I have found, then comes where to start reshaping the behaviour and many owners work on a behaviour that should possibly be perhaps behaviour No. 10 to address. The dog has missed the first 9 behavioural steps and the owner has jumped straight to behaviour 10 and the dog lacks the foundation work to fix behaviour 10 properly.........does this make sense???

Garry

I understand what you are saying, but the dog in question is 6 months old and corrections on started after she had already been walking on the lead reasonably well for 2-3 months.

She did respond to voice commands eg. leave it, forward etc but these, even with a reward did not stop the behaviour, only manage it when it did happen. The trainer suggested to use corrections to let the dog know that that sort od behaviour was just not on anytime.

Since using this method, the dog has not attempted to sniff inappropriately as frequently.

[SpecTraining]

I guess I still don't understand why in this particular instance, it would be a bad thing (lumping that is).

I don't know if it's a bad thing or not and I didn't make that judgement. Obviously it would be bad to "throw her in the deep end". And honestly, gentle collar corrections are often not particularly effective so I would usually aim to prevent access to the sniffy stuff (although my dogs are allowed to sniff, just not pull). If you have a dog who is quite responsive and you can just give a little jiggle it's actually more gentle than, say, the "penalty yards" approach of backing up which usually needs to be quite firm.

Throwing dogs in the deep end too quickly I think is a common mistake by many dog owners Aidan. A green dog/puppy taken for a walk the first few times with massive distractions it can't cope with, the dog will be all over the place with 101 unwanted behaviours I have found, then comes where to start reshaping the behaviour and many owners work on a behaviour that should possibly be perhaps behaviour No. 10 to address. The dog has missed the first 9 behavioural steps and the owner has jumped straight to behaviour 10 and the dog lacks the foundation work to fix behaviour 10 properly.........does this make sense???

Garry

I understand what you are saying, but the dog in question is 6 months old and corrections on started after she had already been walking on the lead reasonably well for 2-3 months.

She did respond to voice commands eg. leave it, forward etc but these, even with a reward did not stop the behaviour, only manage it when it did happen. The trainer suggested to use corrections to let the dog know that that sort od behaviour was just not on anytime.

Since using this method, the dog has not attempted to sniff inappropriately as frequently.

I personally find that adding a correction along with positive reinforcement provides the best results for most dogs. The level of correction to suit the individual dog is the important factor I think.