Buying A Puppy On Breeders Terms

[princesszelda]

Please PM me if you want my breeder's details (Victoria)

[oakway]

Lets explain what can happen when you go to purchase a pure bred dog.

In SOME cases you may find the breeder will have two prices.

One a higher price for a puppy of prospective show quality.

This puppy would be on the MAIN register which allows you to what you want with the puppy.

Show, breed or any other activity. For this you will also need to be a member of states controlling body.

Secondly the LIMITED register or what some of us call pet quality. SOME breeders sell puppies that are not required for breeding or the show ring at lesser price. This allows you to do obedience and some other activities but not show or breed REGISTERED litters.

This may clear up why we can get two prices.

Either the puppy you are purchasing is a show prospect and you are charged accordingly or it is a pet.

This does not mean that ALL breeders charge this way.

Some breeders charge a flat rate for all their puppies and place them on the what they believe to be the appropriate register for that puppy.

What happens between you and the breeder as regards to breeders terms is up to the both of you to decide what you believe to be fair for both parties.

You have been given plenty of information as to regards that and I hope you find it all helpful in finding a suitable BMD.

[Dju]

http://www.zanzebern.com/

Click on "puppy plans"--there are puppies ready to go to new homes pretty much straight away apparently.

http://www.bernese.com.au/PedigreeInfo.htm

These guys are expecting a litter of puppies soon and taking puppy inquiries

There should be a few more, if you're willing to wait a bit and transport them interstate. Personally, your breeder's terms make me go . I could never agree to something like that.

[Kirty]

Wow I can't believe how many ceasars the breeder on that second link has had! I would have thought giant breed = easier whelping. I guess not.

[TsarsMum]

any update

[Missymoo]

I dont undestand why YOU have to pay for the hipscoreing?? Thats rediculous!

[♪♫LMBC♫♪]

I really don't understand why you would even consider this.

You will basically be babysitting someone else's dog, and paying a small fortune for the privilege.

If you want a pet dog, you are going to be far better off finding a breeder who will sell you the pup outright, in your name.

[Kustali]

It can work both ways, under the right agreement. The buyer gets a quality dog of which they may not be able to get otherwise and the breeder can continue with the line if they wish

However, i do think that It is only fair if the breeder wants to use this dog that they must pay for all the health testing and any costs associated with any breedings done, after all you are not interested in breeding him and only want him for a pet.

Co-owning the dog under an agreement is a wise idea, that way you both have your names on the dog.

It needs to be reasonable, and i kept my agreements reasonable with my puppy buyers, i would not put them through anything i would not be happy doing myself.

Edited September 11, 2010 by HANNAH

[Mystiqview]

any update

There also seems to be another thread by the OP. Where they laid a deposit down with this breeder in July. What I don't understand is why they think if they take a pup now on their "breeders terms" they will be entitled/expecting to a free or heavily reduced pup in the future??

[TsarsMum]

yes i read that also. hmmm oh well sometime people need to learn the hard way.

[Puppoochi]

This week I was contacted by a person wanting a show quality pup from me, she was from QLD. She didn't care be dog or bitch, just something nice to show. I do have a boy available (Jackpot grandson). As I do not wish for the lines to go out to unscrupulous breeders, and I don't know her from Adam, I said that I would want to co-own, she was all for it until she saw my contract which I had to draft very quickly for her. She wanted to buy the dog outright and said she could get a dog for show for $800-$1000. I think that she's only started to look as I don't think my contract is all that bad. What do you all think?

POODIFUL KENNELS CO-OWNERSHIP CONTRACT

This agreement is between Elle Robinson, POODIFUL KENNELS (hereafter referred to as "the breeder") and ______________________ (hereafter referred to as "the co-owner") ________________________(hereafter refered to as "the dog").

The breeder of the dog will retain full breeding rights and co-ownership of the dog.

The breeder reserves the right to not allow the dog out at public stud.

If the breeder deems the dog fit for breeding, the breeder reserves the right to choose a bitch for the first mating.

The breeder reserves the right to allow the dog out at public only after the dogs has been proven to be fertile.

If there is an interest from another breeder to use the dog for stud services.The co-owner will notify the breeder, by telephone on 0413 768 692 and/or email [email protected] with the breeder's first preference being telephone.

The breeder reserves the right to refuse stud services.

The breeder reserves the right to decide the price of the stud fee, subject to current price trends.

The co-owner shall receive 65% .of all stud service fees, the breeder shall receive 35% of all stud service fees.

The co-owner will allow the breeder unrestricted access to the dog for breeding.

The co-owner will be responsible for all vaccinations (excluding first puppy shots), veterinarian expenses, registration, and all day-to-day expenses for food and care for the life of the dog.

The. Co-owner shall not neuter the dog without permission of breeder.

The co-owner will be responsible for all show entries and grooming fees.

If this contract is breached in any manner by the co-owner, the breeder has the right to terminate this contract and repossess the dog.

Duty of care

The co-owner will be solely responsible for the actions of the dog while in his day-to-day care. The dog is to be an (indoors) house pet, and not to spend its life as an outside dog. The dog is to live day-to-day with co-owner.

The dog is never to be allowed to roam at large.

Right of placement clause

For the life of the dog, the co-owner will not re-home or give the dog away to anyone with out the permission of the breeder.

For the life of the dog, if the co-owner can not keep the dog, the co-owner will return the dog to the breeder.

Health problems

If the dog shows commonly known genetically-related health complications pertaining to the Toy Poodle, the dog will be returned to the breeder and the breeder will either replace the dog within 12 months or give a one thousand ($1,000.00) refund. The co-owner may also decide to keep the dog and all medical expenses will be incurred by the co-owner.

Death by misadventure

In the event of death of the dog by misadventure whilst in the care of the co-owner, the co-owner will agree to pay the breeder one thousand dollars ($1,000.00) being two thousand dollars ($2,000) price of the dog, less one thousand($1,000) of original purchase price of co-ownership.

[D & D]

This week I was contacted by a person wanting a show quality pup from me, she was from QLD. She didn't care be dog or bitch, just something nice to show. I do have a boy available (Jackpot grandson). As I do not wish for the lines to go out to unscrupulous breeders, and I don't know her from Adam, I said that I would want to co-own, she was all for it until she saw my contract which I had to draft very quickly for her. She wanted to buy the dog outright and said she could get a dog for show for $800-$1000. I think that she's only started to look as I don't think my contract is all that bad. What do you all think?

Death by misadventure

In the event of death of the dog by misadventure whilst in the care of the co-owner, the co-owner will agree to pay the breeder one thousand dollars ($1,000.00) being two thousand dollars ($2,000) price of the dog, less one thousand($1,000) of original purchase price of co-ownership.

This is the first co-ownership contract I have ever seen, so I don't know what's common.

The death by misadventure part shocked me. What do you class as misadventure? Car accident? Dog attack? Snake bite?

So, not only do you lose your beloved pet, you then have to pay his breeder $1000? Seems a bit harsh to me.

I had a co-owned dog, the agreement was verbal. It was originally stated by the breeder that she would transfer him into my name after 12 months (as long as I was doing the right thing by him). He's now in my name.

[Puppoochi]

This week I was contacted by a person wanting a show quality pup from me, she was from QLD. She didn't care be dog or bitch, just something nice to show. I do have a boy available (Jackpot grandson). As I do not wish for the lines to go out to unscrupulous breeders, and I don't know her from Adam, I said that I would want to co-own, she was all for it until she saw my contract which I had to draft very quickly for her. She wanted to buy the dog outright and said she could get a dog for show for $800-$1000. I think that she's only started to look as I don't think my contract is all that bad. What do you all think?

Death by misadventure

In the event of death of the dog by misadventure whilst in the care of the co-owner, the co-owner will agree to pay the breeder one thousand dollars ($1,000.00) being two thousand dollars ($2,000) price of the dog, less one thousand($1,000) of original purchase price of co-ownership.

This is the first co-ownership contract I have ever seen, so I don't know what's common.

The death by misadventure part shocked me. What do you class as misadventure? Car accident? Dog attack? Snake bite?

So, not only do you lose your beloved pet, you then have to pay his breeder $1000? Seems a bit harsh to me.

I had a co-owned dog, the agreement was verbal. It was originally stated by the breeder that she would transfer him into my name after 12 months (as long as I was doing the right thing by him). He's now in my name.

I know it may seem harsh but the dog is in their care, why should I personally lose out, in the event of an accident? They are after all getting it for half the going rate, less than what I would charge for a pet.

[Cosmolo]

I wouldn't like that co ownership contract. The death by misadventure part surprised me too. Yes the dog may have been cheaper initially, but the breeder also gets some stud fees and other rights etc which IMO compensate for this.

[Puppoochi]

I wouldn't like that co ownership contract. The death by misadventure part surprised me too. Yes the dog may have been cheaper initially, but the breeder also gets some stud fees and other rights etc which IMO compensate for this.

What if the dog dies two days after it was sent to them? Or before it was ever used at stud? Also you gotta remember that I have never met the person and the dog will be 2000 km away. Why should I pay for someone else's negligence. I have never had a dog die from misadventure, because I take care. I would expect the same.

Edited September 12, 2010 by poodiful1

[Gayle.]

I would not like that contract if I were paying for the dog, however I might agree to it if the dog were given to me to care for and show.

[Parkeyre]

I wouldn't like that co ownership contract. The death by misadventure part surprised me too. Yes the dog may have been cheaper initially, but the breeder also gets some stud fees and other rights etc which IMO compensate for this.

What if the dog dies two days after it was sent to them? Or before it was ever used at stud? Also you gotta remember that I have never met the person and the dog will be 2000 km away. Why should I pay for someone else's negligence. I have never had a dog die from misadventure, because I take care. I would expect the same.

I would not agree or encourage that contract due to the misadventurous death part.

However; I would rather see it stated that the co-owner would agree to pay for pet insurance against accidents and death; where the insurance company will refund cost price, and you could have 50% of that sent back if you so feel you deserve it. All you'd need to do is provide a receipt.

Edited September 12, 2010 by Parkeyre

[D & D]

I wouldn't like that co ownership contract. The death by misadventure part surprised me too. Yes the dog may have been cheaper initially, but the breeder also gets some stud fees and other rights etc which IMO compensate for this.

What if the dog dies two days after it was sent to them? Or before it was ever used at stud? Also you gotta remember that I have never met the person and the dog will be 2000 km away. Why should I pay for someone else's negligence. I have never had a dog die from misadventure, because I take care. I would expect the same.

Negligence and misadventure are two different things.

Many DOL dog owners have lost a beloved pet through misadventure. A few recent housefires spring to mind. I would hardly call these owners negligent. Accidents happen, and all the 'taking care' in the world will not prevent this.

Negligence is a whole other thing. Maybe a change of contract wording would help? Don't mean to sound pushy, but you did ask for opinions

At the end of the day, they are your puppies and you need to be happy with where they go.

[*Lolapalooza*]

This may not apply to Berners in Australia, but in the states (OFA)

they have a fairly high rate (16 out of every 100 scored) hip problems

and a very high rate of (30 out of 100 scored) that had elbow dysplasia.

Make sure in writting they pay for the xrays and you may want to know what they will do if you pup has hip or elbow dysplasia.

She has already stated that the pups all stay in her name until 12months old or until we fulfill the terms of the contract, including that we pay for the hip/elbow xrays & grading.

If you're paying for the health tests, you should be getting the stud fees.

This deal sounds mighty one sided to me - and its not on your side.

Ditto on that!

I have heard a breeder say re one sided terms contracts presented to the people on day of purchase 'people will sign anything once they see that puppy'

[RubyStar]

I wouldn't like that co ownership contract. The death by misadventure part surprised me too. Yes the dog may have been cheaper initially, but the breeder also gets some stud fees and other rights etc which IMO compensate for this.

Ditto. I got to the death part and went Wouldn't be signing that myself. The rest sounded reasonable, though. Being cheaper initially should be for the breeders "unrestricted access" to this dog for stud duties and for the co-owner housing and feeding this dog while the breeder retains the rights to breed from it if they so wish.

Why should I pay for someone else's negligence. I have never had a dog die from misadventure, because I take care. I would expect the same.

Not every accident is due to negligence of the owner. Sometimes, sh*t happens, that is life. Painful for the owner, then a double whammy that they have to cough up money back to the breeder because a freak accident occurred. If you can prove it's by negligence or the owner mistreating the dog, you might have a case, but accidents quite frankly do just happen whether you're the most diligent owner or not.