Sparring Breeds In The Show Ring

[angelsun]

Many years ago, I watched the terrier group being judged. As they come in alphabetically, the airedale was examined, moved and gaited to the end of the line. At the end waited the little white westie who spun around on heel and took his 'sparring' stance. On the toes, neck arched beautifully, tail straight up and quivering. They were about three feet or more apart. The airedale responded also rolling up on his toes and tail up and neck arched. They stood there like statues and never a sound from either of them. They eyeballed each other, neither of them attempting to lunge or bark and both of them showing themselves off. The judge unfortunately was busy with the rest of the dogs in the line up and missed this show.....we the crowd watched it with glee and when the dogs finally broke off the stance....the crowd burst into applause. The judge looked around wondering what happened, and we all have the image of the king of terriers staring down at the cocky westie who wanted to be the king. No blood, no sound, no damage done. Both in the hands of very experienced handlers who kept a taut lead and knew what they were doing. Unlike so many that spar now, beleiving that it is nose to nose....it's not....the distance creates the spark to show off. We spar to show off the best of our dog, not to start a fight.

I was fortunate to also be at the largest terrier show in the USA (Montgomery County in Pennsylvania) when Ms.Sandra Goose-Allan was judging the airedales and watched something I had never seen done before during the best of breed judging.

Normally, a judge will bring out three boys to the centre of the ring and with distance and control, these boys will do their thing....we knew the ropes and we knew how to handle these big terriers safely. This day, we watched in awe as Ms.Allan instructed a female and a male to come out into the centre and spar. Four rows of spectators around the ring raised their eyebrows at this. The female came trotting out and saw the male....she tossed her head and began to flirt, showing her lovely neck and the tail up and quivering. The male saw the female and rolled up on his toes, puffing himself up to impress her and a few scratches on the grass thrown in for good measure. The spar only lasted 20 seconds or so, but I still get goosebumps thinking about it. Both dogs showing off what they had, no growling, no aggression. Experienced handlers making sure that everyone got a show, but that their dogs performed.

Sparring is not done much anymore because of a number of things...the handlers can't do it/don't know how to do it and the judges (unless they are terrier specialists) don't know what to look for if they ask for it. It's unfortunate and a shame to see such an art dying off. It's not aggression, it's not fighting and it doesn't create a hidden monster in a dog. The terriers I showed KNEW when it was show time and in the ring, they KNEW when to turn it on and when to switch it off. Welsh, Airedale, Westie, Wire Fox...didn't matter....these dogs all played outside the ring with other terriers or anything else for that matter, but they knew when it was time to work and they did it beautifully. Credit to the handler? I'd like to think I had a part of that, but more credit to a great bunch of breeding programs to instil stability in the dog and enough brains to know how to turn on and off. I watch dogs today being bred without the drive to rat, or hunt, or handled a gunshot. Dogs that can't retrieve anymore or are terrified of sheep or cattle so couldn't herd. Having dogs that knew how to spar goes back to solid breeding programs and this doesn't include breeding an aggressive dog simply because it's a terrier and people accept them to be snot bags....no, I don't accept that, not for a moment.

[Sheridan]

From what you have said here, it sounds like sparring is just an excuse to show off an DA dog and blame it on the breed characteristics. is this really the type of temperament that should be being bred (when most will end up in pet homes), no wonder dogs of today are more 'flat' then days of yore.

What utter rubbish.

[merijigs]

From what you have said here, it sounds like sparring is just an excuse to show off an DA dog and blame it on the breed characteristics. is this really the type of temperament that should be being bred (when most will end up in pet homes), no wonder dogs of today are more 'flat' then days of yore.

What utter rubbish.

+1

[LizT]

I see more exhibitors sparring then dogs.

Ain't that the truth!

[LizT]

By definition isn't "sparring" the same as "feinting". As in Bluff?

[SpikesPuppy]

Have had a handful of judges try and spar Borders : have also had my dogs or seen other Borders put down for not showing enough spark in the ring. Sure it looks impressive, but they should not ark up at another dog, especially when 'working' (and these days, I consider being in the ring a form of work, ie; the dog must behave appropriately).

As they were bred to run with the Hounds, an aggressive or even confrontational Border would not last long- a hound certainly wouldn't put up with it!!!

Did have one judge though, a Canadian, who brought all the dogs in the challenge line up into the centre of the ring. There was a collective groan as we reluctantly obeyed. However, he did not want to spar the dogs, he wanted to see how they interacted and got along. They weren't required to be happy happy but more just ignore each other and not fuss.

I enjoy watching certain breeds sparred but hate when it's done incorrectly or it's done to my dog in a line up without my consent.

[RoxyNHemi]

I can see the merits of sparring, as well as the people that abuse it. It is a very intersting topic.. thanks for starting it.

[suezija]

Many years ago, I watched the terrier group being judged. As they come in alphabetically, the airedale was examined, moved and gaited to the end of the line. At the end waited the little white westie who spun around on heel and took his 'sparring' stance. On the toes, neck arched beautifully, tail straight up and quivering. They were about three feet or more apart. The airedale responded also rolling up on his toes and tail up and neck arched. They stood there like statues and never a sound from either of them. They eyeballed each other, neither of them attempting to lunge or bark and both of them showing themselves off.

(It was this stance that caused the Westie to be excused from the ring in Qld recently. Obviously not a terrier person. PS he looked good, certainly not over the top)

Now that is sparring, no aggression, just showing off, daring the other dog.

I was very disappointed with the lack of attentiveness shown by the Kerries at this year's Westminster, although the judge brought them out two at a time, replaced one or both. Some showed the Kerry "disciplined gameness" as required but such a few.

Standards of quite a few terriers says, "on the tiptoe of expectation" or similar words and meaning.

That's what you should expect.

Unfortunately so many consider a terrier who is showing that beautiful stance to be aggressive.

And also so many are very inconsiderate of the little toys in front and fail to leave enough space and then there are the ones behind the terrier group who think they will use the terrier to "spark" their dog or run so fast into the line-up that they run into the terrier. And the terrier is at fault.

You do need to be confident in your own dog's body language and only leave it as long as they are in control. The minute you feel the need to break it off, then you get your dog's attention with something else. Mine is "lolly", a bit of bait. You are still in control and so is your dog.

Not all terriers are required to show off.

Sparring is not done much anymore because of a number of things...the handlers can't do it/don't know how to do it and the judges (unless they are terrier specialists) don't know what to look for if they ask for it. It's unfortunate and a shame to see such an art dying off. It's not aggression, it's not fighting and it doesn't create a hidden monster in a dog.

[Mollabru]

I have seen and heard of a similar tactic being used when judging Bichons - referred to as "facing up".

The judge will bring the exhibits into the centre to watch their reaction. A typical Bichon will be up on it's toes, neck arched with tail quivering and dying to be let of the lead to play.

It is done not to determine/view aggression but alertness and social traits.

As I understand it - not a common practice whilst judging today but if you come accross a "true breed specialist" - there is a good chance it will be done.

But I do agree that using another person's dog to bait yours - is just down right dirty tactics.

[Jibba]

if you are in vic and want to see sparring at its best, come to the fox terrier specialty held on the first weekend of the royal at KCC park, they have the foxy specialty then the foxies are on at the royal a day or so later. I havent been to a foxy specialty yet that they havent sparred, and as all the handlers are OLD they know what sparring is and how to spar their dogs, it is amazing to watch.

[Ceilidh]

I never thought of myself as OLD but well never mind. There are two foxies shows on this Sat 18th, the Fox Terrier Club of Vic starts at 10am and the Fox Terrier (Smooth) show starts not before 1pm. Then the foxies are on at the Royal on Mon 20th.

[Jibba]

Lol i mustnt have met you then, but i was frowned on and the only thing i can work ou tis cause im not OLD.

[angelsun]

BTW...people should remember that you CAN refuse to spar if asked. Some think that will kill you in the competition, but not so. As well, a number of breeds are not sparred and in one example (Manchester Terrier) it states in the breed standard that they are not a sparring breed. I was asked one time to spar and refused....I got put up anyway and the judge when handing me the rosette asked why I did not comply. I told him the standard said clearly we were not to be sparred...he flushed and redfaced apologized for asking me to do so, and said he would not make that mistake again!

You see....it's never too late to learn something!

[Trisven13]

I never thought of myself as OLD but well never mind. There are two foxies shows on this Sat 18th, the Fox Terrier Club of Vic starts at 10am and the Fox Terrier (Smooth) show starts not before 1pm. Then the foxies are on at the Royal on Mon 20th.

I was going to comment earlier Ceilidh to say that I "think" I've seen sparring (to a degree at least) particularly when you were showing Feargal Fartbucket. I will never forget the way he jumped up on his toes and had that amazing look and it was normally when he was very keen to play with another dog. When I was reading the description described earlier Feargal jumped immediately to mind as he always had that "tightly wound spring" look about him - in a good way if that makes sense. Its just how Marie looks when she sees a chook - so tempted to have one on the side of the ring

[BittyMooPeeb]

I have seen an exhibitor do what people have described as sparring, but with a dog outside the ring. A cohort brings the other dog to ringside in a position that faces the terrier in the General Specials line up and they become alert and eyeball each other etc.

It would be interesting to know if this is allowed, or if it is double handling?? It is very unnerving being the toy between two terriers who are doing this!! Especially when the terrier exhibitor keeps moving right up behind the toy, forcing them forward, so that the two terriers can get closer together.

[Sheridan]

I'd call that double handling.

[SpikesPuppy]

I'd call that double handling.

And plain rude :shakehead:

Whenever I'm in a line up and my dog (terrier) is excited or interested in the toy in front of it (some of them can be damn feral little things themselves!) or even the gundog behind, I always speak to the other exhibitor and try and work out what's okay and what's not with them. If for eg they have a nervy dog, I take extra care to have my dog calm or leave a larger space between the two, my dogs are very good, but at the same time, I try and be a considerate handler. But then, some of the toy exhibitors have actually wanted their dogs to play with mine to get them sparked up LOL. Didn't appreciate the Lab pup that was allowed to jump all around my puppy though :shakehead:

[Lowenhart]

I have seen an exhibitor do what people have described as sparring, but with a dog outside the ring. A cohort brings the other dog to ringside in a position that faces the terrier in the General Specials line up and they become alert and eyeball each other etc.

It would be interesting to know if this is allowed, or if it is double handling?? It is very unnerving being the toy between two terriers who are doing this!! Especially when the terrier exhibitor keeps moving right up behind the toy, forcing them forward, so that the two terriers can get closer together.

I've experienced the same thing, lucky my dog was using the outside terrier as 'sparking' material as well. It is double handling.

The same person kept crowding me in the line up, I kept moving up and they did too. In the end I had to tell them to back off, even AFTER I stood between my dog and theirs. They are a serial offender!

[t-time]

Probably the same person who does it to me

[Ceilidh]

I never thought of myself as OLD but well never mind. There are two foxies shows on this Sat 18th, the Fox Terrier Club of Vic starts at 10am and the Fox Terrier (Smooth) show starts not before 1pm. Then the foxies are on at the Royal on Mon 20th.

I was going to comment earlier Ceilidh to say that I "think" I've seen sparring (to a degree at least) particularly when you were showing Feargal Fartbucket. I will never forget the way he jumped up on his toes and had that amazing look and it was normally when he was very keen to play with another dog. When I was reading the description described earlier Feargal jumped immediately to mind as he always had that "tightly wound spring" look about him - in a good way if that makes sense. Its just how Marie looks when she sees a chook - so tempted to have one on the side of the ring

Absolutely, the Fartbucket is excellent at sparring! As is Finn, especially when he sees his girlfriend, Izzy the whippet. I have threatened to buy him a pair of point shoes as he stands right up on the tip of his toe nails. I love watching him 'on the edge of expectation'.