Dementia

[Tara and Sam]

I am posting here so can get more opinions and advice before getting the vet out

our male dog is 14 yrs old this month

he has HD since 3 yrs old and recent years Arthritis

other than those problems he has been in good health

last year or so he has been loosing his hearing

sometimes he hears us and other times he doesnt

a whistle or clap of hands he can hear if we want his attention

sometimes outside he barks at nothing

this last week he has been barking at night times

over theyears it has been to let us know he wants to go for wee ( he did have a problem with inncontience few months back , that was linked to the HD and back problem and has stopped now )

his barking at night is almost as though he trying to tell us something , but we just cant work out what it is

I took him out three times last night thinking he needed to wee , which he didnt

he also has been coming up to us and just standing there and pushes his nose into my leg or OH"s leg

and wagging his tail for pats or cuddles

I would'nt say he is confused as such or lack of memory

he doesnt seem lost in the house or yard

he does sleep more during the day ( understandable for his age ) and noticed last month or so he is wandering around at night

he doesnt appear to be anxious

eating well and drinking fine

last year or so I noticed he is getting abit narky towards the cocker (who is 13 1/2 years old , deaf and going blind if she happens to walk past him and knocks him ) he jumps up with a bit or growl towards her

It certainly sounds like Dementia

and he acually eats dirt ( connected or not I dont know )

any ideas or tips to advise or has anyone had good results with medications etc ?

Thank you

[~*Shell*~]

He sounds like a normal, aging dog to me. In fact, he sounds just like Caesar, my aunt's dobe when he was getting older. He didn't have dementia, he was just getting older and grumpier.

If his hearing is going, he may not be barking at nothing - he could just be hearing different sounds or things could be sounding different to him. The lack of sound could be triggering him - maybe he wants a response from another dog or he's used to hearing someone make a certain noise when he barks which he can no longer hear. The seasons are changing at the moment and I'm noticing a change in my dog as well. He's only 6 so it's not an aging thing for him. Also, if your boy is sleeping during the day and awake at night, it doesn't surprise me that he wants to be up and out at night. He might not be hearing your other dog or her bumping him could cause him pain which could certainly account for the growling.

Maybe a trip to the vet to see what they have to say. As i said, it doesn't sound like dementia to me but I'm not a vet and I haven't seen what your dog is doing in person.

Edited September 7, 2010 by ~*Shell*~

[Stitch]

Yep, I agree, it does sound like a normal ageing dog.

I was told by the vet that the 'test' for intervention was whether the dog was eating or not - so everything else is just considered 'normal'.

Been through it though and I also think what should be included in the 'test' is behaviour that is detrimental to the dogs health, as in my case the dog was just standing outside in the rain, not knowing where she was. Very sad to see!

[Monah]

I've had a dog go exactly like that too. IMO it's pretty normal for some dogs, my ACD had her faculties until she passed from cancer at 15, but my little swf (rescue) lost the plot around 13 years old and lived another 4 years.. We just managed his 'condition' with common sense like lots of supervision, almost like caring for a pup again except that yes, he slept a LOT. to make sure he did not stay awake etc. at nights, I would try and keep him active for a while during the day. His body clock was all over the place. So like humans!!!!

All the best for your dear old dog.xxxxx

[Christina]

Old age can be so sad. All sounds ok & the usual but maybe take a urine sample to the vet for testing. Maybe a bit of cystitis or similar as it is a bit cold for an old dog to want to go outside in the middle of the night.

[noisymina]

Kaisie is getting on too.

She has been gettting sort of "out ot sorts", whining a lot etc.

Just co-incidentally, I did come across info here and cottoned onto a Tryptophan mix called "Good as Gold". It's actually sold for horses to calm them.

After few small doses of that in her food, she settled qiute a bit. I have stopped it now, but will give more if needed.

I think the barking, attention seeking etc in the older dog is a sign of anxiety, whatever the reason for that anxiety may be.

[Trishm]

One of my whippets, who is 15, does the pacing and staring into space behavours, she is also deaf.

My Vet prescribed Vivitonin for her, it increases the blood supply to the heart and brain. It has not made much difference to her, but I have heard that for some dogs it is very helpful in alleviating some of these things.

She is also on heart meds now too.

She loves her food, and sleeps well at night, but is awake and pacing early in the morning, she still enjoys her little walks.

I just have to be vigilant during the day if it is raining and she is wearing a coat, she doesn't feel the rain and will walk around in it for ages and get wet.

I treasure every day I have with her, it is really just like looking after a puppy again, it is so sad to see them age.

Edited to add that my girl is also on the Hills b/d diet. ( $150 a bag, is pretty expensive I think )

Edited September 8, 2010 by Trishm

[karly101]

Sounds a bit like the symptoms we saw in our older dog... we just supported him as best we could - we had to cover some windows as he started to get agitated and barking at his reflection, keeping all his food/water in same spot, at night he wandered then would sleep all day.

We didn't have this available back then but there is the Hills b/d which might be worth a try... its not expensive and since not a medication it won't have other side effects...

http://www.hillspet.com/precise-nutrition-...rain-aging.html

I think talking to your vet may give some other ideas as well...

[PaddyForever]

This does all sound like the aging process- cruel though it can be. Sometimes, it's as though we now have a different dog, isn't it? And indeed, sometimes, we seem to lose them before we actually do. People can go that way, too. My Grandmother has dementia now. Sometimes she knows us, sometimes she doesn't. Sometimes, she sits and stares into space, and I wonder where she is...Other times, she chats away like a budgie. She can be happy one day, sobbing the next. Sadly, our dogs can be similar as they age. My lovely old boy, Paddy, sounded very much like your dog. He, too, was almost deaf, and starting to go blind. He didn't have HD, but he had a bulging disk in his back, that was affecting a nerve, and made walking difficult. Sometimes, he was grumpy because he was old, and sore...I cared for him, while he still had good days, until there were no more good days...I knew when the time had come for that ultimate last act of kindness, and you will, too... Thinking of you through this difficult time...

[Tara and Sam]

Thanks for the replies much appreciated

always good to hear other opinions

Our Vet is away today so will get a appointment tomorrow for him and our girl ( they are both due for their vax's )

I mentioned Demntia as it came up in comversation last visit for our girl

she doesnt bark much but her whining is getting so bad since her hearing has gone

she is food obsessed and always whinged for food

Good point Shell about the lack of sound

he use to run up and down the fenceline with our side neighbours dog and they would bark with each other ( they did this together for about 13 years )

since she passed away about 8 months ago I have noticed he kept looking at the fence for her

he even lays on the lawn faceing the fence just "watches" it

( 2 dogs at the back of us are annoying barkers most of the day, been there about 18 months , he has nver been interested in them and cant get to the back fence as I placed a inner fence as their dogs keep trying to get under the fenceline )

Seasonal change also may be a idea as noticed also this last 2 weeks he laying on the damp lawn or a damp hole he has in the shadehouse like he does in summer

so maybe his body clock or he is getting hot

yes I always have a fresh urine sample for vet when he comes so can be tested

my 2 dogs have always loved the rain and would lie out there if I let them

we all love our dogs and is sad to see them as they get older

yes Paddy forever my nan was like that also , so sad

Sam had a problem with a disk in his back which the meds seemed to help and also stoped the weeing inside , apparently that was all combined

Thanks for the replies , knew I could count on some other suggestions as to what it could be

[MavericksMission]

My old girl was labeled with "Dog Dementia" she was almost 14 years at the time.

The vets wanted me to give her 4 tablets twice daily and a special diet (hills b/d) for the rest of her life.

I declined the medication and purchased a small bag of the prescription food. The food did not make much of a difference (in my opinion)

She then went on to live another 2 years happily, we then had to have her put to sleep early this year, due to muscle wastage.

I didn't feel right forcing her to have all those medications at her age that "may not make a difference"

Anyway, point being, I think it is something that comes with aging. Just keep them comfortable, loved & warm

[Christina]

Edited to add that my girl is also on the Hills b/d diet. ( $150 a bag, is pretty expensive I think )

Go to Pets Domain. They have the Hills & other premium foods on special every second week, big savings. If not in stock they may be able to get it in for you.

One at Gepps Cross, Gawler & not sure where else, google ?

[Trishm]

Edited to add that my girl is also on the Hills b/d diet. ( $150 a bag, is pretty expensive I think )

Go to Pets Domain. They have the Hills & other premium foods on special every second week, big savings. If not in stock they may be able to get it in for you.

One at Gepps Cross, Gawler & not sure where else, google ?

It is a prescription diet though, so I don't think they would sell it, you can only get it through a Vet. I will certainly check it out though, cos' my greyhound is on RC Low Fat Digestive (because of pancreatitus) it is also a prescription diet. They keep me poor.

Thanks

[becks]

Can't you get a prescription for the food and then buy it from an online retailer? This is possible in the UK.

[corvus]

There is a DOLer that is an expert in dementia in dogs. They wrote a bit about it in this thread: http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?showtopic=200259

The vocalising might be due to changed sound perception, but I understand it, along with being wakeful at night, is quite common in dogs with dementia. We were fortunate I guess in that our old girl didn't have those symptoms, but she did stare into space and she would get increasingly anxious as she stood there. Her behaviour became ever more unusual for her until I felt like there wasn't much of my girl left in there. It's a very sad thing to go through. My aunt had a dog that went quite senile and in the end she fell into a small garden pond and drowned. It was a pond she could get out of, so they didn't realise it was dangerous. I found with my girl I was constantly having to reassess risks. She would do inexplicable things like run into the surf at the beach or follow complete strangers. It became necessary to keep her on leash most of the time because we just didn't know what she was going to do.

[poodlefan]

Edited to add that my girl is also on the Hills b/d diet. ( $150 a bag, is pretty expensive I think )

Go to Pets Domain. They have the Hills & other premium foods on special every second week, big savings. If not in stock they may be able to get it in for you.

One at Gepps Cross, Gawler & not sure where else, google ?

A friend of mine swears that the Hills B/D made a huge difference to the life of her aging Border Collie.

I won a bag of it at my vet's seminar on old dogs last year. My old boy certainly liked it. My vet said that it wouldn't help my younger boy Darcy in the IQ area though..

ETA: Vet Products Direct sell it direct to the public for around $90 a bag. No idea on delivery costs though.

Edited September 8, 2010 by poodlefan

[Trishm]

Edited to add that my girl is also on the Hills b/d diet. ( $150 a bag, is pretty expensive I think )

Go to Pets Domain. They have the Hills & other premium foods on special every second week, big savings. If not in stock they may be able to get it in for you.

One at Gepps Cross, Gawler & not sure where else, google ?

A friend of mine swears that the Hills B/D made a huge difference to the life of her aging Border Collie.

I won a bag of it at my vet's seminar on old dogs last year. My old boy certainly liked it. My vet said that it wouldn't help my younger boy Darcy in the IQ area though..

ETA: Vet Products Direct sell it direct to the public for around $90 a bag. No idea on delivery costs though.

Thanks, I just looked at the VPD website and the $90 bag is only 8kgs, I buy the 12kg bag, but they don't deliver to SA anyway, so I guess I just keep buying it from my Vet.

Thanks for the suggestion anyway.