Teaching A Dog Left And Right

[corvus]

Interesting! So do you think he has a "preferred" side that he defaults to when he's not sure which way to go?

I'll have to talk to my fellow postgrad student who has been studying laterality in dogs for the last 3 years. My feeling is both dogs default to their preferred side and to override that preference they have to actually stop and think about it. The exercise I was teaching them had no input from me beyond telling them when they could approach the setup. I tried a few things, like placing the choices farther apart and starting my dog from farther away from them and double-checking that he was aligned right in the middle so one choice wasn't closer than the other. Nothing seemed to make much difference.

Because the task I had them learning had minimal input from me and all the consequences came from the choice they made, it might be that I was seeing a preference for one side over another where in a training exercise where I would be aiming to cue my dogs directly and interacting with them more I wouldn't see that preference. So basically ktb has to sate my curiosity by telling me if Elbie shows a preference. :) It won't mean much, just interests me. :D

[Staranais]

Interesting! So do you think he has a "preferred" side that he defaults to when he's not sure which way to go?

I'll have to talk to my fellow postgrad student who has been studying laterality in dogs for the last 3 years. My feeling is both dogs default to their preferred side and to override that preference they have to actually stop and think about it.

Rather like us, then.

[Aidan3]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm guessing Corvus and Staranais might find this interesting:

http://statisticallysignificantscience.wor.../03/barley-mow/

[koalathebear]

The results of day 2 of Elbie's Left/Right training is

. Corvus the answer to your question is within ... although notwithstanding the video evidence, part of me still thinks that Elbie has a tendency to want to go to alternating sides. :D

But the first few times I lured her for a right spin, she was so awkward she nearly fell over backwards. She was so used to doing it the one way that she couldn't get her head (or body) around the idea of spinning the other way round.

Yes!!! That happened to Elbie yesterday when we tried making him spin the other way. He got all spazzy and almost fell over

Thanks JulesP! Elbie does all the hard work! Do your girls know left from right and how long did it take for them to learn?

paddles: thanks for the tip - sounds a bit like Erny's one so we'll try that as well to reinforce Elbie's sense of direction! Did it take long to 'stick'?

Given that you will only be able to go so far with paper towel rolls now is probably a good time to change the target items too.

Thank you! We have switched to small hankies for now that he can just paw at because we already have far too much dog-related laundry. My problem right now is that he could work on his tricks forever but we don't want to overfeed him so we do his training at meal-times, doling out 1-2 bits of kibble at a time. It means that he trains for almost 20 minutes at a time and it's clear he could work longer - we just run out of kibble and don't want him to turn into a chunky monkey. ;) He will work for tug and toys - but doesn't have the same degree of motivation.

We also think he's cute even though to many he's just a mutt Teaching him tricks is fun because he seems to really enjoy learning. Usually, the difficulty we have is trying to let him know what we want him to do - once he figures it out, he's always extremely happy to oblige.

Edited September 8, 2010 by koalathebear

[koalathebear]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm guessing Corvus and Staranais might find this interesting:

http://statisticallysignificantscience.wor.../03/barley-mow/

I would never consider it 'hijacking'. I welcome all interesting information! :D

Edited September 8, 2010 by koalathebear

[corvus]

The results of day 2 of Elbie's Left/Right training is

. Corvus the answer to your question is within ... although notwithstanding the video evidence, part of me still thinks that Elbie has a tendency to want to go to alternating sides. :D

Woot! Curiosity sated. He may not have a preference. Some dogs apparently don't. Or it may be something that isn't as obvious in training. The literature says that dogs sometimes prefer different paws for different tasks. And there was that really cool paper about dogs tending to turn left when presented with an emotional stimulus on both sides at once, and there was another one about the way tails wag for emotional and non-emotional stimuli. Laterality is super interesting.

I think it was me that kind of hijacked the thread. ;) Aidan, I remember seeing Andrew Denton interview a fellow who was born believing his foot was not his foot. He hated it so much he tried to freeze it and cut it off. In the end, they eventually amputated it for him purely because it seemed like he would do himself serious damage if they didn't. The day he woke up without that foot was the happiest day of his life. He said it was a huge relief and he felt whole for the first time in his life. Hard to wrap your mind around, but pretty amazing.

And can I just say that I'm wild about Elbie and he looks like a whole world of fun to train. Look at the attentiveness! Why do I like spitz breeds again?

[koalathebear]

Woot! Curiosity sated. He may not have a preference. Some dogs apparently don't. Or it may be something that isn't as obvious in training. The literature says that dogs sometimes prefer different paws for different tasks. And there was that really cool paper about dogs tending to turn left when presented with an emotional stimulus on both sides at once, and there was another one about the way tails wag for emotional and non-emotional stimuli. Laterality is super interesting.

I'll observe him for other things. I think he prefers the left paw for high five and shake and we have to tap his right paw if we want him to use that one but I think that I might have been the one who conditioned him because I started with his left paw and so he developed a habit. Similar with his "wave". He learned wave because I held up my right hand and jokingly said: :"We come in peace". I did it twice and then he stared at me and copied me. Made me howl with laughter. Thereafter he usually uses his right paw. Since you seem to know about such things - is it normal for a dog to learn tricks by copying human gestures? That's how Elbie learned high five, wave and high 10. Our life would be so much easier if he could learn all his tricks by imitation. At obedience, I pointed at the GSD next to us and said: "Elbie - crawl like her!!!" It didn't work.

I remember seeing Andrew Denton interview a fellow who was born believing his foot was not his foot. He hated it so much he tried to freeze it and cut it off. In the end, they eventually amputated it for him purely because it seemed like he would do himself serious damage if they didn't. The day he woke up without that foot was the happiest day of his life. He said it was a huge relief and he felt whole for the first time in his life.

Ahhh ... Body Integrity Identity Disorder... I've seen that on House and maybe CSI NY or one of those sorts of shows. I think sometimes they can convince the people to strap up their arm or leg rather than actually amputate but some people desperately want it amputated ... It sounds so strange to me but the human mind is a random and strange thing sometimes.

And can I just say that I'm wild about Elbie and he looks like a whole world of fun to train. Look at the attentiveness!

Elbie has an intense stare like Paddington Bear. He can sit and stare for ages and ages and when he wants to, he can concentrate. Usually I do a lot of the tricks training at home where his concentration is good and my husband handles him at obedience class where his concentration starts out bad because of the distractions but then improves. It's going to be tricky this week and next though ... my husband has to fly back to Toronto on Friday for a couple of weeks because of family reasons. My right hand is still a bit weak from recent hand surgery so I'm not sure if I'm up to handling Elbie's boisterous tugging on the way to obedience - if the dog fails bronze assessment it will be my fault ;)

Why do I like spitz breeds again? :D

You like challenges and you like to ponder the complex psyche of the spitz? As for me, I would love a shiba inu but they're too much dog for me ... wilful and I'd probably go bonkers. Elbie's very lively and hyper sometimes but he does have an off switch and as you say, he IS a lot of fun.

Oh by the way - Elbie still attacks his leash on the way home but the other day a funny thing happened. My husband set out for a walk with Elbie, Elbie did an incredibly big, stinky poo and my poor husband had to do the rest of the walk carrying a bag of poo because there was no bin nearby. Approaching the house, Elbie turned to do his usual leash-attack, saw the bag of poo dangling from my husband's hand, recoiled and then walked home placidly.

Edited September 8, 2010 by koalathebear

[sheena]

I just posted this in the Tricks forum:-

First you teach the dog to spin

To teach dog to spin, first get her to tug, then while tugging gently spin her around. This is the method Greg Derret uses to teach right & left turns.

Spin one way a few times then the other. Then as you spin to the left, give a name to it (I use back) as you spin to the right put a name to it (I use close), soon you will be able to just give the command & maybe an arm movement & the dog will spin either to the left or to the right. This comes in handy on the agility course when working at a distance & you want the dog to turn left or right. (I'm still working on that one ) If I had my time over, I would have used the words left & right (not sure why Greg uses back & close)