Multigeneration Labradoodle?

[kiesha09]

So back on the topic of LD as service dogs... I realise that they failed because they were not of sound temperament and not hypoallergenc. Was this because the 'breed' was underdeveloped which is still the case now?

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

If not what breed that we currently have now could be used in its place or what solution has been come to?

[Nekhbet]

yeah do a quick google, multi gen pups are $2500-$3000 +

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

Why not just use a standard poodle? Oodlies need clipping anyway.

ETA I'm rather annoyed that so many of the big money breeders are saying 'adoption' - it's not adoption when the family has to fork out a few thousand dollars. Bit of an insult to rescue orgs I think.

Edited September 8, 2010 by Nekhbet

[poodlefan]

So back on the topic of LD as service dogs... I realise that they failed because they were not of sound temperament and not hypoallergenc. Was this because the 'breed' was underdeveloped which is still the case now?

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

If not what breed that we currently have now could be used in its place or what solution has been come to?

Standard poodles are used as guide and assistance dogs in other countries.

Edited September 8, 2010 by poodlefan

[kiesha09]

yeah do a quick google, multi gen pups are $2500-$3000 +

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

Why not just use a standard poodle? Oodlies need clipping anyway.

Well this is exactly what I thought and wonder if it has been done, was it successful, if not why not and if so why haven't we heard more about it.

ETA: thanks for clarifying poodlefan. Do you know why they aren't used here in Australia then?

Edited September 8, 2010 by kiesha09

[Nekhbet]

Australia is a little arse about on a few things when it comes to dogs. We should be drawing on international experience and lines not making up our own ideas ... taking the long way round to no guarenteed result.

[poodlefan]

yeah do a quick google, multi gen pups are $2500-$3000 +

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

Why not just use a standard poodle? Oodlies need clipping anyway.

Well this is exactly what I thought and wonder if it has been done, was it successful, if not why not and if so why haven't we heard more about it.

ETA: thanks for clarifying poodlefan. Do you know why they aren't used here in Australia then?

My understanding was that their relatively late arrival at maturity may have had something to do with it. What I will tell you is that it takes a certain type of training to get the best out of one and frankly I think those who've only worked with Labs might have needed to think outside the box and didn't want to. Given the much longer working life you'd get out of an SP - they are long lived for their size - I think they should have been persevered with.

[aussielover]

So back on the topic of LD as service dogs... I realise that they failed because they were not of sound temperament and not hypoallergenc. Was this because the 'breed' was underdeveloped which is still the case now?

In time and with dedicated development with strict criteria could they be bred as service dogs once again if they got the temperaments right? No they won't be hypoallergenic (what dog is) but they could be non-shedding which I believe would be of benefit to those who require a service dog.

If not what breed that we currently have now could be used in its place or what solution has been come to?

depends on what type of service dog you're talking about.

Almost any breed or crossbreed can be trained to be an assistance dog. I believe you can even have your pet dog trained, should you suddenly require an assistance dog.

For guide dogs, the requirements are a bit tougher but currently they are using labradors, golden retrievers, poodles, GSDs, border collies, australian shepherds, probably many other breeds (worldwide, particularly america though).

Even guide dog orgs with their own breeding programs have failure rates of up to 40-50%. A lot of time and money is spent on these programs, so I really doubt that a bunch of random labradoodle breeders could better this. If hypoallergeninc/ low shedding dogs were SO important, surely guide dog orgs would have switched their focus to breeding poodles or perservered with the labradoodle program.

any breed can be used as a sniffer dog, but customs choose to use beagles primarly for their size, they also use labs as they are well accepted as working/service dogs by the public.

So really, i don't see the need for another type/breed of "service dog" to be developed.

[Nekhbet]

bob marley the hearing assistance pit bull

pit bull service dog - who mind you was asked to leave WalMart due to 'children being present'

GSD are also popular guide dogs overseas

GIant Schnauzer

BMD

Many breeds were already bred for assistance roles and to work closely with humans. Other assistance orgs use rescue dogs for some applications as well.

[poodlefan]

You know what I really don't get about the whole Lab/poodle cross thing?

Why take two perfectly good (not identiical in many ways) breeds and think you can improve on them by mixing their genes?

Poodles are not just like Labradors. Labradors are not poodles without the wool coat. Poodles are not just about their non-shedding coats. Those who want a dog with a guaranteed non-shedding coat already have a range of breeds and temperaments to choose from.

So why mix these two breeds with inconsistent results to produce "a great family pet". Poodles and Labradors both make great family pets in the right family.

I still maintain that the primary reason a lot of families opt for the mix is because the male of the house thinks owning a poodle will emasculate him. The men need to cowboy up and get past that idea pronto. If they can't then buy a bloody Lagotto or an Irish Water Spaniel or something.

[RallyValley]

http://thepoodleanddogblog.typepad.com/the...-seriously.html

Why do I feel more and more like Australia is losing out to NZ?

ETA- link is a blog article about how NZ is training poodles as guide dogs

Just bringing this up again as it seems more relevant now then a few pages back. Just like there are specially developed Lab lines surely they could specially develop poodle lines

[aussielover]

Poodlefan:

My understanding was that their relatively late arrival at maturity may have had something to do with it. What I will tell you is that it takes a certain type of training to get the best out of one and frankly I think those who've only worked with Labs might have needed to think outside the box and didn't want to. Given the much longer working life you'd get out of an SP - they are long lived for their size - I think they should have been persevered with.

Labs are said to mature at around.... 7years or so

But yes, they are much "easier" to train and do love working.

[Sheridan]

I completely agree with you about the rediculous prices!!! It is astranomical. But I do wonder if it is a matter of economics, supply and demand and all that. They can charge those prices because the demand is so high people are willing to pay any price.

and that exactly shows the mentality of the breeders. If you're outpricing most pedigree recognised dogs with unrecognised crossbreeds obviously your marketing comes before your care for a new breed. What makes an oodle more special then most of the other crosses out there in the pounds - the spin. For one of their multi gen 'breeding' dogs prices I can can get a working line dog that has a use, good pedigree and can go on to contribute to an international gene pool if I so wish it to.

Who buys a dog based on looks alone? what responsible people, i mean?

clueless peope with big wallets

My dad saw his first wheaten and said, 'I want one.' He's neither clueless nor has a big wallet, thanks very much.

[Nekhbet]

My dad saw his first wheaten and said, 'I want one.' He's neither clueless nor has a big wallet, thanks very much.

yes but did he just go out and buy one without giving consideration to the temperament, care requirements etc? That was my point

[Sandra777]

My dad saw his first wheaten and said, 'I want one.' He's neither clueless nor has a big wallet, thanks very much.

yes but did he just go out and buy one without giving consideration to the temperament, care requirements etc? That was my point

I bought my first dog based entirely on a picture in a book. Nope, didn't give any consideration to the temperament, care etc.

Worked out OK for me - happy Birthday Mr P - he'd be 32 years old today, my first Stafford

[Nekhbet]

I bought my first dog based entirely on a picture in a book. Nope, didn't give any consideration to the temperament, care etc.

Worked out OK for me - happy Birthday Mr P - he'd be 32 years old today, my first Stafford

for some it can work - but pounds, rescues and advertisements are full of those who dont.

[Sandra777]

I bought my first dog based entirely on a picture in a book. Nope, didn't give any consideration to the temperament, care etc.

Worked out OK for me - happy Birthday Mr P - he'd be 32 years old today, my first Stafford

for some it can work - but pounds, rescues and advertisements are full of those who dont.

Yes, sorry, should have added but I don't recommend it

[poodlefan]

Other breeds used as guide dogs:

Smooth Collie

Golden Retriever

Dobermann

Flat coated retriever

Edited September 8, 2010 by poodlefan

[~Midniara~]

I bought my first dog based entirely on a picture in a book. Nope, didn't give any consideration to the temperament, care etc.

Worked out OK for me - happy Birthday Mr P - he'd be 32 years old today, my first Stafford

for some it can work - but pounds, rescues and advertisements are full of those who dont.

So did I.

It was a long haul and a huge learning curve for me with my first Belgian but fortunately it worked out and I didn't completely ruin my dog BUT it could've just as easily gone the other way.

[Nekhbet]

great dane x st bernard I think rescue dogs should be another avenue, so many good workers end up in shelters and pounds

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

You know what I really don't get about the whole Lab/poodle cross thing?

Why take two perfectly good (not identiical in many ways) breeds and think you can improve on them by mixing their genes?

Poodles are not just like Labradors. Labradors are not poodles without the wool coat. Poodles are not just about their non-shedding coats. Those who want a dog with a guaranteed non-shedding coat already have a range of breeds and temperaments to choose from.

So why mix these two breeds with inconsistent results to produce "a great family pet". Poodles and Labradors both make great family pets in the right family.

I still maintain that the primary reason a lot of families opt for the mix is because the male of the house thinks owning a poodle will emasculate him. The men need to cowboy up and get past that idea pronto. If they can't then buy a bloody Lagotto or an Irish Water Spaniel or something.

i agree especially with the bolded bit