Any Advice For Aggresive Gsd

[mum01753]

Hi im new and this is my first post, im just about at my wits end with my gsd so would appreciate some advice from you guys.

We moved over here two years ago and brought our gsd with us she is a lovely girl and is now 4 1/2years old, we had to live with my sister for eight months and she also has a gsd girl and they both got on really well, so when we moved out we decided we would get another so my girl had company whilst we was at work,

We got charlie out of the paper and she was advertised for $700 with papers, we went and saw her and fell in love with her and took her home she was about 3 months old then the owner had to get rid of her as his older dog attacked her twice. needless to say the papers never came and she is not even a pure breed gsd so ripped off big time called the owner several times and was told they have put the papers in the post blah blah, in the last phone call the owner said if we dont want to keep her then just take her back and we could have our money back, but by this time we are attached to charlie and would not want her to go back there.

So we took her to training classes and found that is she is a reactive dog and we have tried every thing and recently the e collar which seemed to be working, but in the mean time my 4 year old shepherd was starting to learn the bad behaviour. so i thought id put the e collar on the older dog to stop her getting aggresive she is a quick learner and will do anything to please if there is a treat at the end of it so i thought one go round the block with the collar on and she would be cured.

how wrong i was she started barking at this man whom was walking down the street carryin something on his head so the collar gave her a little zap as it was on the lowest level and she just attacked charlie the younger dog i could not get them apart i was shouting at them but neither listen to me they eventually came apart and the younger dog had cuts on her head and neck but no serious damage done and it was weird because the older dog started to lick her as if to feel sorry for her. anyway needless to say i took them both straight home and we havent been out since i feel a bit scared by it all. my husband thinks im being cruel by keep taking them out he says that charlie is too scared to be outside and that we should just leave them at home, we do have a big garden and they have great fun running around chasing each other.

now this morning the younger dog attacked the older dog for going to greet my daughter when she got up from bed. i got out of bed so fast and shouted and pointed out to them both to which they listen and obeyed.

O i should say that charlie is now 20 months old, and they seem so close most of the time grooming each other and meal times they get fed at the same time deff no aggression with food what so ever.

charlie does dig holes in the yard and im trying to stop that by telling her with a firm no whilst im filling them in, but she starts shakin and runs away cowering. we have never hit her and she has only just started to trust my husband when he calls her to him, also she would always pee herself when any men would come around and try to say hello to her. that has now stopped and she seems to be abit more confident in herself.

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

O one more thing both females are desexed.

[poodlefan]

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

No product will assist with this situation. I'd not be using an e-collar in it either.

You need professional help. Without it, I expect you'll have more incidents. No one can give you safe advice without seeing your dogs so the only advice I can give you to help manage the situation is to keep them separate.

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

No product will assist with this situation. I'd not be using an e-collar in it either.

You need professional help. Without it, I expect you'll have more incidents. No one can give you safe advice without seeing your dogs so the only advice I can give you to help manage the situation is to keep them separate.

i totally agree with poodlefan. this is a complex situation. did you receive any training on using the ecollar?

if an ecollar isnt used correctly it can make the situation much worse.

you really need the help of a good trained professional. in the end it will be cheaper than tools that dont work for you or the dog

[sas]

You have to see a Behaviourist, you don't really have much choice and stop using the e-collar until you can get a Behaviourist to train you how to use it because as you jsut discovered incorrect use on a dog can cause more problems.

No one here can ethically give you advice on an aggressive dog.

You have some choices from what I can see

1 - Get in a Behaviourist

2 - Muzzle the dogs

3 - Don't take the dogs out into public

And last of all if you're not prepared to get the help you need to help these dogs then PTS i.m.o as there's nothing worse than an aggro dog that doesn't get help because of the constant messed up state they live in....but you know what....PTS costs more than a Behaviourist in many cases.

[mum01753]

You have to see a Behaviourist, you don't really have much choice and stop using the e-collar until you can get a Behaviourist to train you how to use it because as you jsut discovered incorrect use on a dog can cause more problems.

No one here can ethically give you advice on an aggressive dog.

You have some choices from what I can see

1 - Get in a Behaviourist

2 - Muzzle the dogs

3 - Don't take the dogs out into public

And last of all if you're not prepared to get the help you need to help these dogs then PTS i.m.o as there's nothing worse than an aggro dog that doesn't get help because of the constant messed up state they live in....but you know what....PTS costs more than a Behaviourist in many cases.

sorry what is pts?

yes i have stopped taking the dogs out and am considering muzzling the dogs. from what i can gather on here an behaviourist costs about $250 an hour or am i wrong any help on this would be appreciated also.

I do love my dogs and want what is best for them.

[aussielover]

Agree with SAS.

PTS- means put to sleep ie. euthanize.

Another possibility is to rehome one of the dogs but considering they are aggressive, probably not an option.

Please don't use the e collar without instruction from a professional, they can be dangerous if you don't know what you're doing.

Muzzle the dogs when they are together.

The current situation of the dogs is quite dangerous imo, I would keep them separated, especially as you have kids. It sounds like they could break into a serious fight anytime now.

Charlie is desperately in need of help from a behaviourist. Please consider seeking help from one, I hope someone here can recommend you a reasonably priced one. Have you enquired at all about trainers and behaviourits? you may find they are a more reasonable price than you would expect.

[sas]

sorry what is pts?

yes i have stopped taking the dogs out and am considering muzzling the dogs. from what i can gather on here an behaviourist costs about $250 an hour or am i wrong any help on this would be appreciated also.

I do love my dogs and want what is best for them.

PTS = Put to Sleep.

You need to call around Behaviourists and make sure they are experienced in Aggression, there's nothing worse than spending money on a person whose not experienced in the area you need them to be, they range in price quite a bit. I've always paid under $200 for a session regardless of how long that session was and that is in Australia's most expensive City.

In regards to rehoming: I say a big fat NO. Aggressive dogs should not be rehomed i.m.o.

Edited August 25, 2010 by sas

[aussielover]

sorry what is pts?

yes i have stopped taking the dogs out and am considering muzzling the dogs. from what i can gather on here an behaviourist costs about $250 an hour or am i wrong any help on this would be appreciated also.

I do love my dogs and want what is best for them.

PTS = Put to Sleep.

You need to call around Behaviourists and make sure they are experienced in Aggression, there's nothing worse than spending money on a person whose not experienced in the area you need them to be, they range in price quite a bit. I've always paid under $200 for a session regardless of how long that session was and that is in Australia's most expensive City.

In regards to rehoming: I say a big fat NO. Aggressive dogs should not be rehomed i.m.o.

I absolutely agree with you SAS, the behaviourist should be experienced with aggressive dogs.

With rehoming I also agree rehoming a human aggressive dog is a big no-no and generally a Dog aggressive dog is a no-no. However, i know a few cases where DA dogs have been rehomed to experienced, responsible people who don't have any other pets or kids and are willing to work with a trainer or keep the dog on their property only. But these sort of people are very rare.

To be totally honest, i wouldn't be comfortable keeping the younger GSD in a house with kids. She sounds like she has a number of issues that need to be professionally assessed.

Obviously no one can make a diagnosis or tell whats really happening over the internet without seeing the dogs in person, so please, please, get the dogs assessed ASAP!!!

[persephone]

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

Sorry , but it is a case of 'have to' ,as your two girls can not just spend the rest of their years in a backyard.. the hole-digging/fighting will worsen. They will probably start to bark , as they desperately try and find something to occupy their minds .They may well go a bit crazy

The money you spend on different collars/mixtures/muzzles could be put toward using someone who can advise you. It DOES need to be a professional behaviourist ..not just a business which guarantees stopping dogs barking/jumping up etc .

It is hard, and I'm sorry.

[Steve K9Pro]

Hi im new and this is my first post, im just about at my wits end with my gsd so would appreciate some advice from you guys.

We moved over here two years ago and brought our gsd with us she is a lovely girl and is now 4 1/2years old, we had to live with my sister for eight months and she also has a gsd girl and they both got on really well, so when we moved out we decided we would get another so my girl had company whilst we was at work,

We got charlie out of the paper and she was advertised for $700 with papers, we went and saw her and fell in love with her and took her home she was about 3 months old then the owner had to get rid of her as his older dog attacked her twice. needless to say the papers never came and she is not even a pure breed gsd so ripped off big time called the owner several times and was told they have put the papers in the post blah blah, in the last phone call the owner said if we dont want to keep her then just take her back and we could have our money back, but by this time we are attached to charlie and would not want her to go back there.

K9: In hindsight her being attacked twice tells us that, she either has the issue that causes the fights or she has one now after being attacked.

So we took her to training classes and found that is she is a reactive dog and we have tried every thing and recently the e collar which seemed to be working, but in the mean time my 4 year old shepherd was starting to learn the bad behaviour. so i thought id put the e collar on the older dog to stop her getting aggresive she is a quick learner and will do anything to please if there is a treat at the end of it so i thought one go round the block with the collar on and she would be cured.

how wrong i was she started barking at this man whom was walking down the street carryin something on his head so the collar gave her a little zap as it was on the lowest level and she just attacked charlie the younger dog i could not get them apart i was shouting at them but neither listen to me they eventually came apart and the younger dog had cuts on her head and neck but no serious damage done and it was weird because the older dog started to lick her as if to feel sorry for her. anyway needless to say i took them both straight home and we havent been out since i feel a bit scared by it all. my husband thinks im being cruel by keep taking them out he says that charlie is too scared to be outside and that we should just leave them at home, we do have a big garden and they have great fun running around chasing each other.

K9: The e collar is a fabulous tool, used correctly, but without any foundation training on the e collar it is simply a sharp poke in the neck, which can be a stimulating correction to a dog going into an aggressive mode.

I would stop using the e collar at once, on both dogs. It sounds like your trying to use supression as a total cure when there will be a number of processes required to reduce / eliminate the aggression.

now this morning the younger dog attacked the older dog for going to greet my daughter when she got up from bed. i got out of bed so fast and shouted and pointed out to them both to which they listen and obeyed.

K9: This time...

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

K9: First I would play it safe and separate both your dogs when ever they are not supervised (directly).

Next I would not walk them together at all until you have good improvement in their behaviours and they would get no off leash time anywhere.

I would not let your dogs interact with each other when your children are around.

Finally whether you can afford it now or in a month, you will need to get help from a professional.

This problem is psychological, no different than if one of your dogs was sick and you were having trouble scraping together the vet fee, it is a medical emergency now or at least it soon will be.

[mum01753]

Thank you all for you replies.

There seems to be a bit of confusion, i dont have small childen youngest is 17yrs, and the both dogs are not people aggressive.

It really seems that the younger dog is tryin to dominate the older one. and when they was out they acted as a pack kind of ganging up together.

Anyways in the last year and half this has only happend twice they have always been fine before that in the house sleep together eat together play together in the garden.

Deff not using the e collar anymore.

Have not taken them out for walks since and i have never let them off the lead either.

Do you think i could go through my pet insurance for a behaviourist/trainer?

And i would never rehome charlie it would deff have to be put to sleep as a last resort.

How do i go about looking for a behaviourist? and would they give me a price first? i reallly do not have spare money at the moment.

Thanks

[beagie]

Hi im new and this is my first post, im just about at my wits end with my gsd so would appreciate some advice from you guys.

We moved over here two years ago and brought our gsd with us she is a lovely girl and is now 4 1/2years old, we had to live with my sister for eight months and she also has a gsd girl and they both got on really well, so when we moved out we decided we would get another so my girl had company whilst we was at work,

We got charlie out of the paper and she was advertised for $700 with papers, we went and saw her and fell in love with her and took her home she was about 3 months old then the owner had to get rid of her as his older dog attacked her twice. needless to say the papers never came and she is not even a pure breed gsd so ripped off big time called the owner several times and was told they have put the papers in the post blah blah, in the last phone call the owner said if we dont want to keep her then just take her back and we could have our money back, but by this time we are attached to charlie and would not want her to go back there.

So we took her to training classes and found that is she is a reactive dog and we have tried every thing and recently the e collar which seemed to be working, but in the mean time my 4 year old shepherd was starting to learn the bad behaviour. so i thought id put the e collar on the older dog to stop her getting aggresive she is a quick learner and will do anything to please if there is a treat at the end of it so i thought one go round the block with the collar on and she would be cured.

how wrong i was she started barking at this man whom was walking down the street carryin something on his head so the collar gave her a little zap as it was on the lowest level and she just attacked charlie the younger dog i could not get them apart i was shouting at them but neither listen to me they eventually came apart and the younger dog had cuts on her head and neck but no serious damage done and it was weird because the older dog started to lick her as if to feel sorry for her. anyway needless to say i took them both straight home and we havent been out since i feel a bit scared by it all. my husband thinks im being cruel by keep taking them out he says that charlie is too scared to be outside and that we should just leave them at home, we do have a big garden and they have great fun running around chasing each other.

now this morning the younger dog attacked the older dog for going to greet my daughter when she got up from bed. i got out of bed so fast and shouted and pointed out to them both to which they listen and obeyed.

O i should say that charlie is now 20 months old, and they seem so close most of the time grooming each other and meal times they get fed at the same time deff no aggression with food what so ever.

charlie does dig holes in the yard and im trying to stop that by telling her with a firm no whilst im filling them in, but she starts shakin and runs away cowering. we have never hit her and she has only just started to trust my husband when he calls her to him, also she would always pee herself when any men would come around and try to say hello to her. that has now stopped and she seems to be abit more confident in herself.

I cannot afford and trainer or behavioust so relying on help here and maybe some products i could buy?

hope i havent rambled too much

but dont know what elser to do.

O one more thing both females are desexed.

I have recently been reading a book called control unleashed, I think you will find most of your answers there. The next thing I will say if you have a GSD

club in reach go to it, they are qualified to deal with the breed. I know you need to mix with other breeds also however your own breed club should

have a wealth of knowledge. Your dog is being reactive because it has been allowed to flip the barriers of being on a high, it needs calming down

sit down massage the dog talk to it and get it into a calm state before you try to do aything with it. Then commence your training or whatever ten

minutes a day can make big improvements. sit quitley in front of you click treat click treat watch for the dog to go into a calm state and relax

there is very little point in putting the dog into a down if it is all tense and ready to spring into action at the slightest movement. Training takes

time and patience. I have three dogs two older and a pup now seven months old, how the dinamics have changed since bringing in the pup who is

a smaller breed, I could not even begin to describe. I have put hours and hours into this pup, not because he is stupid but so I go back to having

a nice calm household again. I have just started him at club, I thought he would be a brat, it was amazing how well he behaved he was

and coped

Walk your dogs seperately if you are not realy able to deal with two at once I walk all three of mine however the two older ones are very well

trained, and very well behaved pup is still learning but getting there, I would never walk them together if I could not control them it is arecipe

for disaster. You should be setting your dog up for success not failure, when first working with your new dog you need to work with it at home

in an enclosed space until you get at least a bit of control. Being afraide of men tells me something but I won't go into it here, you have a

protection breed you need to learn to deal with that. Beagie

[Steve K9Pro]

I have recently been reading a book called control unleashed, I think you will find most of your answers there. The next thing I will say if you have a GSD club in reach go to i , they are qualified to deal with the breed. I know you need to mix with other breeds also however your own breed club should have a wealth of knowledge.

K9: I am sorry but this is bad advice.

Number 1, no one is going to read any book and be any where near qualified to deal with aggression from any dog.

Number 2, most clubs are staffed by volunteer instructors, not behaviourists and they are not qualified to deal with aggression, nor is what clubs or breeds clubs are designed for.

Your dog is being reactive because it has been allowed to flip the barriers of being on a high, it needs calming down

sit down massage the dog talk to it and get it into a calm state before you try to do aything with it. Then commence your training or whatever ten

minutes a day can make big improvements.

K9: Beagie there is no way you can diagnose what is going on with this dog, at best it is a guess, I would also suggest it is a bad guess.

There is safety and welfare of people and dogs at stake in this thread, I would warn you not to give advice your not qualified to give, you could get someone badly hurt.

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

I have recently been reading a book called control unleashed, I think you will find most of your answers there. The next thing I will say if you have a GSD club in reach go to i , they are qualified to deal with the breed. I know you need to mix with other breeds also however your own breed club should have a wealth of knowledge.

K9: I am sorry but this is bad advice.

Number 1, no one is going to read any book and be any where near qualified to deal with aggression from any dog.

Number 2, most clubs are staffed by volunteer instructors, not behaviourists and they are not qualified to deal with aggression, nor is what clubs or breeds clubs are designed for.

Your dog is being reactive because it has been allowed to flip the barriers of being on a high, it needs calming down

sit down massage the dog talk to it and get it into a calm state before you try to do aything with it. Then commence your training or whatever ten

minutes a day can make big improvements.

K9: Beagie there is no way you can diagnose what is going on with this dog, at best it is a guess, I would also suggest it is a bad guess.

There is safety and welfare of people and dogs at stake in this thread, I would warn you not to give advice your not qualified to give, you could get someone badly hurt.

x1000

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

I have recently been reading a book called control unleashed, I think you will find most of your answers there. The next thing I will say if you have a GSD

club in reach go to it, they are qualified to deal with the breed. I know you need to mix with other breeds also however your own breed club should

have a wealth of knowledge. Your dog is being reactive because it has been allowed to flip the barriers of being on a high, it needs calming down

sit down massage the dog talk to it and get it into a calm state before you try to do aything with it. Then commence your training or whatever ten

minutes a day can make big improvements. sit quitley in front of you click treat click treat watch for the dog to go into a calm state and relax

there is very little point in putting the dog into a down if it is all tense and ready to spring into action at the slightest movement. Training takes

time and patience. I have three dogs two older and a pup now seven months old, how the dinamics have changed since bringing in the pup who is

a smaller breed, I could not even begin to describe. I have put hours and hours into this pup, not because he is stupid but so I go back to having

a nice calm household again. I have just started him at club, I thought he would be a brat, it was amazing how well he behaved he was

and coped

Walk your dogs seperately if you are not realy able to deal with two at once I walk all three of mine however the two older ones are very well

trained, and very well behaved pup is still learning but getting there, I would never walk them together if I could not control them it is arecipe

for disaster. You should be setting your dog up for success not failure, when first working with your new dog you need to work with it at home

in an enclosed space until you get at least a bit of control. Being afraide of men tells me something but I won't go into it here, you have a

protection breed you need to learn to deal with that. Beagie

beagie i really disagree with the advice you have given i feel it is dangerous and it could lead to a disaster.

i am concerned that without seeing this dog you feel qualified to give out advice which is extremely concerning.

to the OP K9Pro is a qualified and excellent behaviouralist/trainer and i would be listening to his advice above others.

[Animal House]

There will be someone from WA on here who can recommend a qualified behaviorist that deals with aggression.

Maybe sell the E collar to get the money?

[Animal House]

Sorry, double post.

Edited August 26, 2010 by Cazablanca

[Animal House]

There will be someone from WA on here who can recommend a qualified behaviorist that deals with aggression.

Maybe sell the E collar to get the money?

[SkySoaringMagpie]

Thank you all for you replies.

There seems to be a bit of confusion, i dont have small childen youngest is 17yrs, and the both dogs are not people aggressive.

Sorry if this feels a little like us stacking on, but it's only because we know how badly these situations can go and are concerned.

You can still be hurt if you get in between two fighting dogs - particularly dogs like GSDs that have power behind the bite. Dogs are incredibly fast, and whether or not the dog is human aggressive, the chance of a human injury is still a very real possibility.

My OH once had to break up a fight between dogs - one was a Bull Arab, the other was a DA boxer/ridgeback cross. Two kids under 10 were walking the Bull Arab in front of our house. The kids were screaming and if OH had not been around there's a very good chance one of the kids would have been bitten in their panic about their pet. The DA one was a complete pussy cat with humans, but that didn't mean he wasn't a menace in the neighborhood. I mention the breeds too because society is very intolerant of aggression in large dogs, including GSDs.

Agree with the others that you need someone who really understands aggression - if you post your location perhaps people here can suggest a good behaviourist.

[charlie mouse]

Good Luck it will seem like a lot of hard work now but it will be rewarded a million fold when you have a peaceful home and happy relaxed dogs

Edited August 26, 2010 by Muckypup