Is Your Dog Stubborn?

[pipsqueak]

How would you define stubbornness in dogs? Do you have a stubborn dog? If so, what makes you think it is stubborn.

How do you tell if a dog is being stubborn, or doesn't know how to behave, or doesn't have a strong enough reward history to overcome the pull of other rewards present? Just as an example.

How do you define stubborness in dogs???

[corvus]

How do you define stubborness in dogs???

I dunno, that's why I'm asking you guys!

One of my dogs has "spitz moments" where you ask him to do something and he just kinda looks at you like "mmmm, nah. Think I'll go over here instead." I don't really consider it stubbornness because he's just weighing up his options and choosing the one that is most rewarding to him at that moment. It just means I have to build up a stronger reward history for things I want him to do. Then he'll do them no questions asked. On the other hand, my other dog gets very routinised. If I suddenly ask something of him in a situation that occurs often in which he is never asked to do that thing he will get this muleish look on his face and just refuse to do it. I guess I consider that stubbornness because it's hard to jolt him out of that mindset. It doesn't really matter much what the reward history for that behaviour I'm asking for is. He's just like "I don't do that here." He can be quite stubborn about his own rules. He makes rules based on what typically happens, so if I don't want him to make rules for situations that he will later stick to very stubbornly, I should vary what happens after what so he can't get into a routine. If that makes sense.

[pipsqueak]

How do you define stubborness in dogs???

I dunno, that's why I'm asking you guys! :D

On the other hand, my other dog gets very routinised. If I suddenly ask something of him in a situation that occurs often in which he is never asked to do that thing he will get this muleish look on his face and just refuse to do it. I guess I consider that stubbornness because it's hard to jolt him out of that mindset. It doesn't really matter much what the reward history for that behaviour I'm asking for is. He's just like "I don't do that here." He can be quite stubborn about his own rules. He makes rules based on what typically happens, so if I don't want him to make rules for situations that he will later stick to very stubbornly, I should vary what happens after what so he can't get into a routine. If that makes sense.

I personally wouldn't call that stubborness, I would consider it an lack of ability to generalise, resulting in confusion.

[corvus]

Well, I think it would be a lack of ability to generalise if it happened first. But it doesn't. It goes like this: I teach him something, say sit. It becomes his favourite thing to do and I ask for sits at the dog park, on walks, before going through doors, before meals, and so on and so on. Several months later when "sit" has been practised in a variety of situations and always results in good things, I might ask him to sit in a situation where he has never been asked to sit before. If it's a situation that doesn't occur often, he sits. But if it's a situation that occurs often and so has a history of its own that does not involve sits, I ask him to sit and he goes "No, I don't have to here." It's not because he's never been asked to sit here before so much as he's done this a million times and sit is not a part of this routine. He gets quite distressed about it. Much nervous lip-licking and averting eyes. Normally if he doesn't know what to do he will just default to a down or he'll poke something. It doesn't bother him much. He really doesn't like breaking a routine, though. Very resistant to it.

[SUGEE76]

My elkhound is stubborn - if I ask him to do something or more often to not do something if he is doing something naughty he will turn around and give me an earful

yes - that's right he argues back - barking loudly Woof! Woof! Woof Woof! Woof!

It is so hard not to laugh at him - my husband tells everyone he has a potty mouth and when he is barking at us like this he is telling us in very colourful language where we can stick it

I have to turn and walk away - it is the only thing that works - once he realises he is not getting a reaction he stops

Then the next time I ask him to do the same thing he will do it perfectly on first command...

[corvus]

My elkhound is stubborn - if I ask him to do something or more often to not do something if he is doing something naughty he will turn around and give me an earful

yes - that's right he argues back - barking loudly Woof! Woof! Woof Woof! Woof!

It is so hard not to laugh at him - my husband tells everyone he has a potty mouth and when he is barking at us like this he is telling us in very colourful language where we can stick it

I have to turn and walk away - it is the only thing that works - once he realises he is not getting a reaction he stops

Then the next time I ask him to do the same thing he will do it perfectly on first command...

Okay, that sounds exactly like Erik. He tells you off. We say he has a potty mouth as well. He swears like a sailor. I always picture one of those obnoxious children that swear at you and kick your shins.

[tez]

If being stubborn is going for a walk with Jane and then she sees someone say...50 metres away and she falls to the ground and lies on her side and refuses to budge until that person has walked up to us.... then Jane is stubborn!

[Mumsie]

My 12 y.o. female JRT is very stubbon, she will turn her face away when I ask her to do something she doesn't want, especially if it involves getting off our bed or the lounge. She also uses "selective" deafness to other commands.

Maybe her behaviour is learnt because when she is naughty I "withdraw" eye contact when she comes sooking up to me after she has been in trouble

[♪♫LMBC♫♪]

Darcy is very stubborn. If he gets caught doing something naughty, he gets told off, stops doing it until whoever told him off is not looking, then goes right back to what he was doing So we need to try to distract him from the thing he is doing, otherwise he just won't stop.

His other thing is to drop his ball at my feet for me to throw. If I don't, he picks it up and drops it again, or pushes it at me with his nose. He will repeat these things a few times and if that still doesn't work, he tries them again but they are accompanied by little yappy whiny barks. I have to either throw the ball for him, or leave

[Staff'n'Toller]

Yes.

When I ask her to do something, she looks at me with that look that says 'go on, make me!'... I know she knows what I am talking about because as soon as I bribe her, she does it.

There's nothing stubborn about that.

She has you well trained.

[OSoSwift]

My old Stafford quite often needs to be asked more than once. One reason is his dad trained him that way and the other is he is not the sharpest tool in the shed, so once he has figured out what you mean he will happily do it. Lovely dog, not much upstairs.

[jacqui835]

My elkhound is stubborn - if I ask him to do something or more often to not do something if he is doing something naughty he will turn around and give me an earful

yes - that's right he argues back - barking loudly Woof! Woof! Woof Woof! Woof!

It is so hard not to laugh at him - my husband tells everyone he has a potty mouth and when he is barking at us like this he is telling us in very colourful language where we can stick it

I have to turn and walk away - it is the only thing that works - once he realises he is not getting a reaction he stops

Then the next time I ask him to do the same thing he will do it perfectly on first command...

Okay, that sounds exactly like Erik. He tells you off. We say he has a potty mouth as well. He swears like a sailor. I always picture one of those obnoxious children that swear at you and kick your shins.

Sometimes my dog does that sort of thing. I will be trying to tell him to do something he doesn't want to do, like maybe go upstairs for a bath or go to bed etc. He really doesn't want to hear it, so he starts half moaning over me. Stops making noise every time I do, but starts up again the second I try to get a word in edge ways. He doesn't do this often, and only when I sort of indulge him on it - like if I say bath, now, he runs, tail between his legs kinda thing. But if I'm like, oh please won't you go and have a bath? You know you have to and easier just to get it out of the way etc etc he just keeps on howling over me, with an extremely pained expression on his face. Don't know if I'd call that stubborn, he just likes to protest sometimes lol.

[tikira]

Trust me, it is easy to tell when Tippy (Jack Russell) is simply being stubborn. He gets a look that says- "uh oh, no way, not today Mum".

He is well trained, food orientated and intelligent and STUBBORN, although these days we know how to handle it.

Di

[SUGEE76]

My elkhound is stubborn - if I ask him to do something or more often to not do something if he is doing something naughty he will turn around and give me an earful

yes - that's right he argues back - barking loudly Woof! Woof! Woof Woof! Woof!

It is so hard not to laugh at him - my husband tells everyone he has a potty mouth and when he is barking at us like this he is telling us in very colourful language where we can stick it

I have to turn and walk away - it is the only thing that works - once he realises he is not getting a reaction he stops

Then the next time I ask him to do the same thing he will do it perfectly on first command...

Okay, that sounds exactly like Erik. He tells you off. We say he has a potty mouth as well. He swears like a sailor. I always picture one of those obnoxious children that swear at you and kick your shins.

Gold! So glad we are not the only people with a dog like that.

Machida goes to obedience class every Sunday and whilst he is doing exercises he is 100% switched on alert and obedient. If the instructor needs to talk to another handler or tell a story he starts barking and I swear he is saying "Lady give it a rest - I am over hearing your stories give me something fun to do- NOW!"

His bark is so piercing and loud - the poor people in the class must hate him. I have offered to bring them all earplugs. (Ironically the trainer is partially deaf so for her it is not as irritating as for the rest of the class.)

We are doing clicker training at the moment so we are working on ignoring him when he barks and clicking once he sits quietly. It is tough going but it does appear to be working...slowly

it is so hard to do!!

[Akayla]

I think both my dogs have "stubborn moments". Blaez though is a good example. I say come on come in and either stands and stares a me or barks then takes a step back. The moment I go to go inside though he runs in (usually). If I say dinner time he goes "no Im not hungry" as soon as I go to take the food away he wants it.

Ive never gone outside and chased him but I know thats what he is pushing for. Ill go inside and come back after a while to see if he is ready to come in yet He gets rewarded if he comes straight inside. Still we play this game every time i ask him anything.

Unless....

We are out, if we are out some where he is suddenly very obedient

[nickyp]

Em is incredibly stubborn when she has her mind fixed on something. One of her regular habits is to clean out the cat's bowl in the laundry. If for some reason she can't get to it when she comes in after dinner (eg. if the door is shut), she will go back again and again until she gets to it.