fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Hi, I have a pet staffy she is nearly 2 years of age. She is my first dog but I've tried my hardest by doing everything right by her. I started training her in obedience at 8 months of age and have progressed to intermendiate on lead. She does occasionally lunge at dogs playfully if eye contact is made, I correct her. However the issue does seem to be ongoing. It won't happen often, maybe 1 or 2 times every 2 weeks, usually when we are doing dog passing dog or figure of eightes. She is desexed, vaccinated etc.... She lives with 3 cats and my OH's chihuahua (x). Apart from hyperactivity she has lived harmoniously with the other animals. Her hyperactive behaviour has prevented her from becoming an indoor dog full time however she does frequently get let in if we are home to supervise. There was in incodent at the dog park today. I had my dog on lead and walked her around for approx 10 minutes, she seemed keen to go play with the other dogs. I didn't see a smaller dog near a bench and not even 10 seconds after letting her off lead she lunged at the small dog and started attacking. It happened in the blink of an eye, all I could hear was a lot of growling and yelping. I grabbed my dog by the collar, thankfully the other dog was unharmed. It was shaken by the event but we throughly checked it and there were no injuries. I am devistated by the event and don't require a lecture on how I could have prevented it. I came home in tears because I knew this sort of problem is beyond my abilities or the ability of the training club to correct. This is the first sign of aggression my dog has ever shown, I've done everything possible to try and correct her hyperactivity and overexitement. I've made the desicion to have her muzzled from now on at training and during walks, I can't afford another accident. I love my dog, but I need to do what's right by the community. Can anybody suggest a professional trainer that might be able to help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parkeyre Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Have her fitted for a muzzle that doesn't bother her. Then you've got the protection there should she snap again. No trainer advice from me sorry, just good vibes and hopes it was a one off. Seriously think you should consider then muzzle though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 The incodent didn't happen that long ago so I'm still pretty shaken about it myself. My eyes are still red, I can hardly see what I'm typing. I just got her muzzle, I've never needed one before. I just don't know what else to do. I really don't want to be walking her around with a muzzle on for the rest of her life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parkeyre Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 The incodent didn't happen that long ago so I'm still pretty shaken about it myself. My eyes are still red, I can hardly see what I'm typing.I just got her muzzle, I've never needed one before. I just don't know what else to do. I really don't want to be walking her around with a muzzle on for the rest of her life. Greyhounds do. Maybe call your vet and see if they can recommend anyone? Has your dog been upset/sick or anything lately? ..I really don't have any advice, but I'll try and offer what i can anyway :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 I know they greyhounds do. Isn't that a regulation of some sort, not because they are typically aggressive or dangerous? It does tend to send the wrong message to the community about certain breeds of dogs. I know for mine it's necessary till I can address the problem. She's not typically aggressive, there is obviously something I'm overlooking as to what's triggering her bevaviour problems. Not only this case but her hyperactivity which I think is possibly linked to this incodent. I will have a talk with the vet and see what they can recommend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 (edited) Hi :D Firstly - no good getting angry at her- or anything now- it's done - and she is still the same dog you greeted this morning ;) Take some deep breaths - she is a dog - and , - sometimes these things will happen.It is distressing , and you will feel guilty ..BREATHE! ;hug: What type of muzzle did you buy? Your dog needs to be correctly fitted with a 'basket' muzzle - one with strong plastic or wire mesh - and one which allows the mouth to open fully for panting /drinking. Any muzzle which prevents her opening her mouth is dangerous- the dog can overheat very quickly :D Where are you situated? if you give us a city/area I'm sure someone will recommend a trainer for you to chat to - a one-to-one session with a trainer will help explain things to you, and give you the confidence and 'tools' with which to manage your walks etc . I will have a talk with the vet and see what they can recommend. and a lot of vets won't be terribly helpful in this regard ,unfortunately Edited July 18, 2010 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parkeyre Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Hi :D Firstly - no good getting angry at her- or anything now- it's done - and she is still the same dog you greeted this morning :D Take some deep breaths - she is a dog - and , - sometimes these things will happen.It is distressing , and you will feel guilty ..BREATHE! ;hug:What type of muzzle did you buy? Your dog needs to be correctly fitted with a 'basket' muzzle - one with strong plastic or wire mesh - and one which allows the mouth to open fully for panting /drinking. Any muzzle which prevents her opening his mouth is dangerous- the dog can overheat very quickly Where are you situated? if you give us a city/area I'm sure someone will recommend a trainer for you to chat to - a one-to-one session with a trainer will help explain things to you, and give you the confidence and 'tools' with which to manage your walks etc . +1. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 I'm near Campbelltown. I bought a Kra Mar muzzle. It is a mesh one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 (edited) http://www.australianexplorer.com/shop/tra...ets/muzzles.php like this? THESE are different types of secure, well fitted and SAFE basket muzzles. The muzzle needs to be for the type of dog, and needs to have plenty of room in it, plus be fairly solid . Edited July 18, 2010 by persephone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 (edited) Yes it's the Kra Mar quick fit mesh one. BTW: I will be asking for advice at the dog club too. The basket one isn't going to suit training as it would be difficult to give her a treat reward. The KraMar one will have do to for the moment. Edited July 18, 2010 by fuzzy_dragonfly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra777 Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 (edited) The main thing you need to remember is that she is a DOG. Dog's settle disputes with ritual displays and if this doesn't work they fight or run away. They are animals, not little furry people. Sorry, but if your dog had intended to actually harm the smaller dog she probably would have done so. You did not see the "fight" start? You did not see the body language displayed by the other dog? (or your own?) How do you know the other dog didn't attack your dog and she was only defending herself? The other dog was perhaps overwhealmed by being suddenly approached by a dog it didn't know so reacted defensively, if the other dog was near it's owner it may have been defending it's "pack". Without all this information there is no way you can categorically state your dog attacked another dog so there is no absolute reason for you to feel guilty or afraid. Yes, it is scary and makes the old heart work hard when something like this happens, but there is no reason from what you have said for you to think she has a "behaviour problem." If you approach the incident as if you have the problem and need to fix it you could well do much more harm than good. I would be seeking the advice of someone who understands dog behaviour - not necessarily a trainer (some of them are totally ignorant of normal dog behaviour), not necessarily a trained behaviouralist (nothing you have written suggests to me that you actually have a major problem in need of high powered professional help) but an experienced person who understands dog body language and who can help you learn to read situations better. Hopefully someone here will be able to help. In the mean time I don't see any problem in walking her in a muzzle and I would recommend you keep away from dog parks (I dislike dog parks at any time, full of dogs from different packs - like that is a natural place for dogs to feel comfortable!) but this is more for your benefit than anything else. You need to regain your confidence, so don't set yourself or your dog up for failure until you've got a better grip on what she is actually "telling" you. Edited cause my keyboard can't spell today Edited July 18, 2010 by Sandra777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 You must have the same brand of keyboard I do LOL. I think the real issue is her being hyperactive. I was frightened that it may have esculated to aggression. If it was getting worse rather than better I was concerned the situation was now beyond what I could do to help her. She's always had an issue of jumping up on visitors or people that try to pet her. I'd love her to be perminantly indoors but it gets overwhelming to have a dog that runs on energizer batteries. At training we've only done the stand for examination twice sucessfully. The 99 other times she jumped up and started licking the trainer trying to examine her. It is quite possible the other dog was being defensive, it was near it's owner. I did consider this because it wasn't typical behaviour from my dog. She usually is submissive to large dogs but can be a bit dominant to smaller dogs, never aggressive. The owner did grab their dog and Sui did not bite the other owner when he did this. I didn't get bitten when I pulled Sui off the other dog either. We literally seperated them about 5 seconds into the dispute. The issue was between the two dogs. Yes I know my dog is quite capable of delivering a fatal injury to a small dog in that time, or even mistakingly bitten one of us seperating the dog fight. But the fact the dispute started at all has me concerned. I don't ever want to give her the chance to accidentally bite. Nevertheless it's something I can't afford happening again. It's not an issue I have the knowledge or experience to deal with on my own. I want to be confident that I can trust her without a muzzle. Yes the dog park is out of bounds unless we are the only ones there, I've already come to that conclusion. It's a shame so many people were there today, she loves using the agility style equipment. I really do feel I need help. If anybody can recommend someone who can help with a hypo staffy ... PLEASE! I need her to be calmer around other strange dogs and people. It's not always apparent because she does walk on lead well, she has a pretty impressive list of tricks she can do, she's even pretty good at training, she picks up new activities fast and remembers activities she hasn't done in a while. She's a smart dog, but in certain situations she gets really excited and it's difficult to have any controll, that's where I need help the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 I would contact K9pro, I know they are recommended here by DOLers (I haven't personally used them myself though), they are situated nr richmond I think, which is a bit far from campbelltown, but hopefully worth it. They have experience in dealing with aggressive dogs. There is also a vet behaviourist at seaforth vet clinic who you could contact. Did the other dog provoke your dog? If the other dog wasn't hurt, that is a good sign Because I am sure your dog probably could have done some serious damage to a chihuahua, perhaps even killed it had she wanted to. You are doing the right thing, seeking help before the problem could potentially escalate so good on you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Absolutely seek professional help - it is amazing what a good trainer can help you do. I also recommend Steve from K9 Pro http://www.k9pro.com.au/index.php I wish I had seen a professional trainer as soon as my dog had started showing aggression. I had some bad advice to wait it out and keep socialising him with other dogs and that just made it worse - you are doing the right thing by seeking help now before the problem gets more out of hand. Dog aggression is a very common problem and if you get good help it's amazing the turnaround you can have with the right support and guidance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristineX Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Hi Fuzzy Dragonfly First, we definately need a picture of her!! Secondly, she sounds more reactive than agressive. (coming from someone who attends classes for their reactive dog). However, the muzzle may well have an additional benefit, others keep their dogs clear of you, including the type who say 's/he's just saying hi!! while their dog aggressively eyeballs you. Thirdly, please do get in touch with K9Pro - they know what they are doing, and will be able to tell you if it is aggression, reactivity or otherwise, and help with managing/handling and settling the problem down. You can improve matters. If it helps, when I got Duke, he got aggressively bailed up 4 times by different maltese crosses. He tried to play, but of course its 'your dogs aggressive, it needs a muzzle' etc etc etc, given that his play style was to hold on to the other dog. What he needed was people obeying the law and keeping their dogs on leads in the street! This led to Duke being extremely reactive to all other dogs (he also has a few other problems that fed in). Because of this, it took us 2 years of work to be able to join the obedience class (our club is extremely supportive), and the first time we got a recall through a parrallel line of dogs we got a standing ovation (pretty much). And remember, we are always here if you need some support. ChristineX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzy_dragonfly Posted July 18, 2010 Author Share Posted July 18, 2010 I doubt Sui's a pure staffy although she was given to me as a pure staffy .... the breeder wanted me to breed from her .... IDIOT! The other dog was a mongrel fluffy malteesy looking thing probably one of those *oodle - schmoodle dogs .... I don't know, people have crossed them so badly even the best couldn't tell what breed they are any more. It's was about the size of a toy poodle, bigger than a chihuahua. I know the fact we weren't bitten by either dog is a good sign too. I believe is really bad dog fights it's never wise to step in a seperate them because you could put yourself in harms way. My OH has two chihuahua (x) dogs and they always growl at Sui to show her who's boss but she never attacks, she does sometimes get a but boisterous but the chihuahua's usually put her back in her place: She's never hurt our cats or small animals ... that could be because she sees them as part of her pack. Yes I was looking at K9Pro, I hadn't realised they'd changed from K9Force. I did get a suggestion of anothe place to so I'll be looking into all the suggestions to see which one would suit us best. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumabaar Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Hi FD, Just want to check- you go to Deerbush dont you? I would not ask for recomendations there- they are alright as trainers for normal dogs but yes I do believe that you and Sui would get further with some one on one proffessional attention . I wish I had done it earlier with my dog because once you have some good advice I believe you will be able to do great wotk with her. I have been to K9 pro and he would def be able to harness excitement. But go with a trainer that you will feel comfortable with and who has professional delt with this type of problem in the past. I listened to alot of well meaning instructors etc and it just confused my dog further as I was treating the actual problem and I have had to retrain him out of some of the stuff that I was advised to do!! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Another vote for K9pro and that is such a cute photo!! Do staffords come in spots? I have no idea- could she be part Dalmatian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WreckitWhippet Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Ticking is very common in white SBT's. Although she doesn't look like a pedigree dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
persephone Posted July 18, 2010 Share Posted July 18, 2010 Ticking is very common in white SBT's. I've not ever seen any white ones - thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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