Agility Training Talk Thread

[Sayreovi]

For those of you who won't have dogs on lead at all for agility, what do you do to mitigate the runaway risk? Are your training areas all fully fenced?

Some of my training areas are, others aren't. I've got dogs that don't have 100% perfect recalls but don't run away, I do walk around the area I am in though to reduce them wanting to go sniff and pee everywhere else and it serves as a warmup as well. I attempt to make myself the best thing there and use very high value treats as I have food orientated dogs.....helps that they are a trainable breed that wants to stick around though

Edited February 15, 2011 by tollersowned

[poodlefan]

Our club training rings are fully fenced.

However, our issue with offlead reliability relates less to dogs 'running away' and more to dogs interfering/distracting other dogs during training. We don't seem to get a lot of bolters but even with intake testing we do get zoomies. Fortunately changes to our intake testing seem to have pretty much resolved the occasional aggression issues we were experiencing some years back.

[megan_]

Where I train beginners are on leash but we do a lot of foundation exercises and only introduce equipment slowly and not at full height, so the risk of tangles is very small . We learn the slanty poles weaving method which is easy to do with a leash. We have some reactive dogs who could not be off leash when we started. If they had trained at a club that insisted that they were off leash they wouldn't be doing agility and that would be a real pity. In less than 6 months they are all doing full off leash runs and are focused on the job at hand. They are also alot more comfortable around the other dogs while they're not running a course.

Personally I like the idea of on leash until the dog and owner prove focus and recall. As the owner of a focused, non- reactive dog I'm not at all worried about my boy running off- but I do worry about a larger, hyped up dog having a go at my little one.

If reactive, non focused dogs are given the option of participating on leash in a safe manner then I think everyone wins in the end. One of the reasons that I train where I do is that I didn't need to go through multiple levels of obedience( including auto sits etc) in order to do agility. I find obedience at the clubs ive been to mind numbing and both my dog and i have been bored. What i love about our agility class is that aLl dogs can participate without safety being compromised.

Edited February 15, 2011 by megan_

[Cosmolo]

I guess the other thing too is that although we don't take overtly reactive dogs into class, many dogs become more reactive when highly aroused and thats a concern for me also with runaways. But i will try some snub leads at the next workshop and see how we go- hopefully that will meet in the middle and satisfy safety for both issues.

[poodlefan]

I guess the other thing too is that although we don't take overtly reactive dogs into class, many dogs become more reactive when highly aroused and thats a concern for me also with runaways. But i will try some snub leads at the next workshop and see how we go- hopefully that will meet in the middle and satisfy safety for both issues.

I'd suggest shorter weave poles (1m is usually plenty) for dogs onlead and shorter jump uprights to to lower the risk of tangling.

Never seen a handler who could resist steering or pulling the dog with the lead though.

Edited February 15, 2011 by poodlefan

[Cosmolo]

PF, do you think you would be as comfortable when instructing if you had an unfenced area? Do you think snub leads are an acceptable alternative or would you still not start them at that point?

PF- the weavers are pretty short- i'd be suprised if they were any taller than 1.20 and any others i have seen have been bigger Links for metal bases or other alternatives welcome!! OH is going to work on the bases and see if that makes a difference. Where would you get shorter jump uprights? Or would you just cut the existing ones?

Edited February 15, 2011 by Cosmolo

[poodlefan]

PF, do you think you would be as comfortable when instructing if you had an unfenced area? Do you think snub leads are an acceptable alternative or would you still not start them at that point?

If I was genuinely concerned that dogs would bolt off, I'd not have them in class. Its hell for other handlers and a risk to the safety of the dog if its in an unfenced area.

I'm happy for dogs to be onlead between exercises (in fact we insist on it) but whilst on equipment, the lead shouldn't be in the handlers hand. If they have it, its almost always in play (usually without them realising) and most tend initially to hold the lead with the hand closest to the dog when that's the hand they need to be signalling with.

Enter the agility tab or the telephone cord style ones. There's plenty for a handler to grab when the dog finishes and that's when the normal lead can be clipped on.

Dogs can wear both at the same time. The tab or short leads shouldn't reach below the dog's chest. Any el cheapo lead can be cut down to the right length - send your handlers to a Reject Shop or similar and they can cut them down. A knot in the end is useful.

We do a lot of luring and rewarding with toys too - they are great for toy motivated dogs to build drive after obstacle completion. For use in class though dogs need to be under control.

[Vickie]

Mostly I just want to line him up straight before he goes, and as far as I'm aware that was the purpose for doing it at training. But considering how leery he was of it I decided the best way to get him to both drive forwards

I think you can both the drive forward & the straight angle just by teaching a position by your side.

It is possible to build anticipation on the flat with a toy.

Dog is only released when they focus ahead. Using this method it is easy to put a jump or a weave entry in front for the to drive through & be rewarded.

I do lots of restrained recalls as well but find the above exercise builds as much anticipation & drive as the rr does.

[poodlefan]

I had my weave pole bases made at a metal work place.

For jump uprights, shorter training ones might be the go. If the dogs are unlikely to be jumping competition height, you don't need them particularly tall anyway.

How do you get handlers to keep their dogs jumping fit and lean if they only participate occasionally?

[ness]

Not sure if he still makes them but I got a set of base plated weavers through Murray Tyler in Victoria. They are certainly heavy enough to not move around to badly when not pegged but also can be pegged when used outside.

[Cosmolo]

The dogs are all weight checked ( we never let overweight dogs participate) and we give people ideas for conditioning dogs at the park (we have a number of parks with a few permanent pieces of agility equipment) or on their regular walks. Its not perfect and not as good as weekly agility but its managable and i haven't had a dog show up not physically suited as yet.

[Cosmolo]

Do you have a contact number by any chance ness?

[megan_]

The dogs are all weight checked ( we never let overweight dogs participate) and we give people ideas for conditioning dogs at the park (we have a number of parks with a few permanent pieces of agility equipment) or on their regular walks. Its not perfect and not as good as weekly agility but its managable and i haven't had a dog show up not physically suited as yet.

Ooh where are the parks with the fixed equipment ?

Edited February 15, 2011 by megan_

[Vickie]

Cosmolo, the running off is an issue for sure.

I think that is one of the benefits of true foundation training. When you are only doing one thing at a time & your sessions are short & you are doing 3 times the amount of rewarding & play as actual exercises, it is much easier to keep a dogs focus.

Even in a fenced area, if the dog is distracted or running off, the exercises need to be quicker & simpler & the rewards need to be higher & more frequent. I never let a dog do 3 obstacles if it can't do one with enthusiasm & focus. It's amazing how quickly things move when you get it right to start.

I set up a complex drill today for a young dog. I had planned to work on it over the next few weeks, but the owner had done some homework. We started just rewarding a few times before the first jump, then a few times after, then we did 2 jumps. From there we were able to do 6. Had we tried to start with 6, it would have started ugly & probably stayed ugly.

It's not quite perfect, but by the end of the session it was damned close!

Same with weaves. I do all my work on 3 poles. 3 to 5 over a couple of weeks & they're ready for 12. Entries are done and they are independent. There is still proofing, but the time spent breaking it down initially & getting the dog to think makes things go very fast.

[Cosmolo]

Vickie, how often do your clients come to agility training with you?

I have some different exercises in my head for future reference, will be interested to see how well received they are.

ETA Megan- there is one in Clarinda, one in Mordialloc and someone was telling me about another one on the weekend, will have to find out what suburb that was in.

Edited February 15, 2011 by Cosmolo

[poodlefan]

Vickie, how often do your clients come to agility training with you?

I have some different exercises in my head for future reference, will be interested to see how well received they are.

Your clients can practice lead outs and sending ahead to a target between visits. With those two skills you can do quite a bit.

[Cosmolo]

They are given exercises to do between visits- evening the dogs up left vs right is the major one as most of them have only ever worked on the left.

[Staff'n'Toller]

Number for Murray Tyler. http://www.aussieagility.com.au/equipment.htm

[Vickie]

Vickie, how often do your clients come to agility training with you?

I don't have clients, I have a few fellow triallers who ring me up when they have a problem or want to start pups off, to ask if I will help. some come once, some a few times. Last year I was sent a number of problem dogs from trainers & clubs who needed some one on one help before they were ready for class situations.

It's just me helping people I know or know of. I'm not doing it this year, it's rewarding but I can't justify doing it every day for nothing and I don't want a business.

[corvus]

Mostly I just want to line him up straight before he goes, and as far as I'm aware that was the purpose for doing it at training. But considering how leery he was of it I decided the best way to get him to both drive forwards

I think you can both the drive forward & the straight angle just by teaching a position by your side.

It is possible to build anticipation on the flat with a toy.

Dog is only released when they focus ahead. Using this method it is easy to put a jump or a weave entry in front for the to drive through & be rewarded.

I do lots of restrained recalls as well but find the above exercise builds as much anticipation & drive as the rr does.

Thanks. I'll talk to my instructor about it. It might be a better option for him.