Podengo Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 Looking at those jumps, if you take the top one off it's roughly the bottom one she'd be jumping! I was watching the video thinking geez she looks the same height as my girl but jumping so much heigher looks like our 600's! Curious why haven't NZ lowered the jump heights? Wow so crazy! How many mm are your tollers? We're actually in the midst of a height review at the moment, it does look like our maxi height will be dropped, so midi will go down a little too... But not as low as some overseas countries. I think micro and mini will stay the same. Our see saws are quite a bit bigger than yours too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyStar Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 she's just coming back from an 18 month break after she injured herself on some dodgy equipment and I'm still paranoid about her fitness. Sorry to hear this This got me thinking, what do people do for fitness for their dogs outside of agility training? Do you have a fitness routine? I'm planning on taking Pippa out jogging with me to increase her fitness, but she's not a swimmer so that is out. Like DD we do LOTS of body awareness/fitball type work. We also stretch every day - but I get the dogs to stretch themselves (bow, nose to tail, extended sits and drops - where they get into postion and I lure them forward, but they are not allowed to move their butt, not where we push and pull them (although there is a bit of that). Hill work and free running is also excellent. We're super lucky - we have a vet who has rehab quals from the US and she gives us a heap of exercises to do with our dogs when they have anything wrong with them. She'll also vet them out VERY quickly so we are managing quite small things so they don't turn into big things. :) Just on running - don't forget to think about how your dogs are 'built'. eg: BC's will run a LONG way, but when you look at how they work/what they are bred to do it is often work/stop/work/stop, not a consistent 5 or 10km. I don't know other breeds so I can't comment, but just something worth thinking about when designing your dogs fitness program. A couple of km's shouldn't be a tough ask for a fit dog, regardless of breed I would think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agility Dogs Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 she's just coming back from an 18 month break after she injured herself on some dodgy equipment and I'm still paranoid about her fitness. Sorry to hear this This got me thinking, what do people do for fitness for their dogs outside of agility training? Do you have a fitness routine? I'm planning on taking Pippa out jogging with me to increase her fitness, but she's not a swimmer so that is out. Like DD we do LOTS of body awareness/fitball type work. We also stretch every day - but I get the dogs to stretch themselves (bow, nose to tail, extended sits and drops - where they get into postion and I lure them forward, but they are not allowed to move their butt, not where we push and pull them (although there is a bit of that). Hill work and free running is also excellent. We're super lucky - we have a vet who has rehab quals from the US and she gives us a heap of exercises to do with our dogs when they have anything wrong with them. She'll also vet them out VERY quickly so we are managing quite small things so they don't turn into big things. :) Just on running - don't forget to think about how your dogs are 'built'. eg: BC's will run a LONG way, but when you look at how they work/what they are bred to do it is often work/stop/work/stop, not a consistent 5 or 10km. I don't know other breeds so I can't comment, but just something worth thinking about when designing your dogs fitness program. A couple of km's shouldn't be a tough ask for a fit dog, regardless of breed I would think No, agreed, even 10k should be OK for a fit dog, but it is just something to keep in mind. Also depends on the surface you are asking them to run on. But I always err on the side of caution. I'm not suggesting you would, but I"ve seen people run dogs way too far just because they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podengo Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 I tend to do about 3km with Elsie to my friends house, then she'll have a rest there while we talk dogs and have afternoon tea, then another 3km back home... She enjoys her little adventure over there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sayreovi Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 Looking at those jumps, if you take the top one off it's roughly the bottom one she'd be jumping! I was watching the video thinking geez she looks the same height as my girl but jumping so much heigher looks like our 600's! Curious why haven't NZ lowered the jump heights? Wow so crazy! How many mm are your tollers? We're actually in the midst of a height review at the moment, it does look like our maxi height will be dropped, so midi will go down a little too... But not as low as some overseas countries. I think micro and mini will stay the same. Our see saws are quite a bit bigger than yours too... Sorry I correct myself, some of the jumps the bottom bar is lower in the video. In the second picture you posted, that bottom bar is roughly the same height our 400s would jump. My 400 is roughly 43cm at shoulder, my boy who is 500 is 50cm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyStar Posted April 13, 2013 Share Posted April 13, 2013 A couple of km's shouldn't be a tough ask for a fit dog, regardless of breed I would think No, agreed, even 10k should be OK for a fit dog, but it is just something to keep in mind. Also depends on the surface you are asking them to run on. But I always err on the side of caution. I'm not suggesting you would, but I"ve seen people run dogs way too far just because they can. I can't even jog 5k yet myself so no issues there I'm building up my fitness alongside the dogs, so wouldn't ever push them straight into something they couldn't do. And any sign of struggling, we walk. It was a bit humid today so walked probably 2/3 of my planned 3k jog as I didn't want to exert Pippa too much in one of her first jogs. I'm aware that pavement/road running is not good on the joints and stuff longterm, but I truly despise grass running, too freakin' hard for myself! So we won't be going hard any time soon. Just not really that creative with other exercises to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted April 13, 2013 Author Share Posted April 13, 2013 Elsie looks great Discodobe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaCharlie Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 One of the biggest observations that the Kiwis made last year was that people with slower, small dogs were encouraging their dogs to be slow. These were the dogs that were carried to the startline and plonked on the ground (no attempts made to get them excited about running), handlers were plodding around a course not trying to engage their dogs in the "game of chase" which resulted in dogs that just plodded along beside them giving the appearance that they didn't even necessarily want to be there, then at the end of the run the handler would stop, call the dog to them and wait for the dog to stop, then give them a pat and a little piece of food. Then the dog would be cuddled all the way back to their crate (or to somewhere where the handler could sit with the dog on their lap). The biggest advice they had for someone with a small dog is to treat it like a working dog, or at the very least an agility dog. No more molly-coddling, no more stationary rewarding, and to start getting the dog excited about the sport of agility- make it fun for them! Make running the course the highlight of their day, instead of the cuddling with mum/dad before and after the run. The biggest advice they had for Australian handlers in general, particularly those with fast, driven dogs was to put it more effort and stop being so lazy. They were blown away by how LITTLE some of our top competitors actually do out there. As far as they were concerned, these dogs were giving 110% out there and handlers were not coming anywhere close to matching that. If you are perfectly able-bodied why stand in the middle and point and direct if not to show off your wonderful distance skills to those watching? Why stand and do a stationary rear cross when you could get there for a front cross? Why make the dog do all of the work and put in all the effort if it is supposed to be a team sport? It is something I know I am incredibly guilty of, I rely on having a fast dog that will do it regardless and don't necessarily match their effort out there on course. Definitely gave us some food for thought. Yes, yes and yes. It simply blew me away how lazy I was on course when I started running some of their quicker dogs. They aren't any more able than our dogs, they are just trained to drive HARD. I don't think it is only our small dogs we molly coddle. Most of the working dogs in agility circles are treated the same way in Aus. They don't treat their dogs badly, they just have criteria and stick to it. The best analogy I can think of is that I want my dogs running as hard on course as they do when they are chasing something that (invariably) they shouldn't be. It's really hard to describe unless you've 'felt' it though. Hopefully with more Aussies going to WAO, FCI worlds and IFCS events we start to see more and more dogs running at that level over here. Its my main goal with my new puppy Shock. I've tried to implement it with Whip and Delta (I don't run Charlie, Tailwag does) and I am definitely seeing huge improvements with Delta and I am getting a lot more speed out of her than I used to. Whip on the other hand is not doing as well with it, well to be more precise I am not doing as well with it and he is suffering :laugh: I am getting caught up in the "drive to the next jump" mentality and failing to adequately cue him to decel (something he isn't great at at the best of times). He is also a dog that prefers to be at a distance from me and if I push to close I push him out around jumps. I'm trying to do a lot of short drills with him (alphabet drills etc) that are quite close together so I can get a feel for that balance between pushing for maximum speed while still maintaining spot on cues. The poor boy is trying his heart out but I just can't seem to get it right, which leaves me then reverting back to the stand and point handling that works. Delta is much more forgiving (and experienced) so I can get away with not being as accurate, plus she is loving being driven harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vickie Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 I think there are a couple of prerequisites to being able to drive hard around a course. One is that it relies heavily on being able to read your dogs commitment to lines & obstacles. Mostly we tend to hang on, well after our dog is committed, allowing them to jump long or wide. The thing is, the harder you drive, often the earlier their commitment is. Pair that with a large striding dog and it can get difficult. The other is how much your dog actually understands your cues. I find that the harder I drive, the more I need to exaggerate the turning cues. With my young dogs, I often need to stop and reward their response to a cue, such as decel, recall to hand etc. then when we put it back together it seems to work better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kavik Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Those are good points Vickie. I know Kaos could be quicker around a course, and I am trying to work out best how to accomplish that and actually get him to turn :laugh: Certainly I learned a good lesson at training last week - that I have been neglecting training my turning cues lately (in favour of other training with Recallers etc) and he did not read my pull through cue at all, so I know what we will be working on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tassie Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 I think there are a couple of prerequisites to being able to drive hard around a course. One is that it relies heavily on being able to read your dogs commitment to lines & obstacles. Mostly we tend to hang on, well after our dog is committed, allowing them to jump long or wide. The thing is, the harder you drive, often the earlier their commitment is. Pair that with a large striding dog and it can get difficult. The other is how much your dog actually understands your cues. I find that the harder I drive, the more I need to exaggerate the turning cues. With my young dogs, I often need to stop and reward their response to a cue, such as decel, recall to hand etc. then when we put it back together it seems to work better. Thanks Vickie ... that makes really good sense. I think that's what I'm finding with Rory, who although he's 4, is a youngster in terms of agility. He seems to have plenty of drive, and is quite long striding, so that makes it really imperative for me to be early (but not too early :) ) and clear .. and yes, I do need to stop and reward as you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaCharlie Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 One thing I am becoming very aware of is the fact that I wait for my dogs WAAAYYY too much. I will signal a tight turn then wait until they have landed before I take off which puts me on the backfoot and frustrates the hell out of them. What I am finally starting to realise is that I can take off running as soon as they are committed to the jump which puts me much further ahead and drives them faster out of tight turns. Particularly with Charlie, which I suspect is why he hates running with me and prefers to run for Tailwag. He is capable of so much more speed than I have ever got out of him, and a huge part of that is due to me "babying him" and waiting for him too much instead of just running. Then he gets annoyed with me and decides he doesn't want to be there anymore. Even Whip, who has a long stride and turns like a mack truck is starting to give me some really nice tight work when I get my cues in on time. Trying to drive the dogs more is teaching me to pay more attention to my cues and timing and the faster and/or longer striding the dog the more accurate you need to be as you have less time to play with. I have a very long way to go but I like to think I am heading in the right direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agility Dogs Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Great post Vickie. The other thing I would add (from personal experience) is that it is too easy to forget to teach the dogs to blast by getting too hung up on getting them to turn tight. My young dog has super tight turns, but I haven't taught her to open up. It's now a work in progress. My word for the year is balance - need to make sure we teach all parts of the puzzle, not just what we missed in the last dog!! Also....just thought I'd add a pic of the puppies doing their fitness work this morning. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tassie Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 :laugh: AD - her big brother came with 'blast' fully installed and operational - steering on the other hand is a work in progress. Their breeder actually said that the blast likely comes from mum - Dad was apparently a bit more concerned about getting things right - interesting, isn't it. Rory is concerned in that way round the house - but not out on course - or should I say, on a course. :D You're right - balance is important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame ryder Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Just a question for you agility people out there... The club I train don't allow the dogs to do agility wearing a harness or slip collar. Fair enough but now they make me take off the little bell attached to his collar (which is difficult to remove) and also make me take off his little t-shirt. He is a chinese crested hairless dog and his clothes are often a necessity. I think they are going too far sometimes. Their argument is they are afraid this stuff will get caught on the equipment. If I could see a risk of this actually happening there's no way I'd allow my dog to be at risk. I think there would be more chance of me winning lotto than seeing these items get caught up. They seem to be taking all the fun out of it. They need to realize that we (the owners) do have some degree of responsibility and aren't stupid. So my question is...is this normal or are they being too strict? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pie Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) I think it's fair enough with the coat - I have a very bald dog who may as well be hairless - lol - she spends the entire winter coated - what I do at training is keep her in a coat that is easy to remove, quickly whip it off before her go / run, then put it back on straight after. if she is doing a fair bit of activity she can get warm enough to keep it off between exercises but usually if she is stationary for a minute she is cold again. ETA: you may not think they will get caught but it's best to be safe - I have seena video of a dog get its flat colar caught on a jump wing and the whole jump fell on the dog and terrified it Edited April 15, 2013 by pie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flame ryder Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 This looks more risky than clothes or collars...an image I'm sure you've all seen before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussielover Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 The biggest advice they had for Australian handlers in general, particularly those with fast, driven dogs was to put it more effort and stop being so lazy. They were blown away by how LITTLE some of our top competitors actually do out there. As far as they were concerned, these dogs were giving 110% out there and handlers were not coming anywhere close to matching that. If you are perfectly able-bodied why stand in the middle and point and direct if not to show off your wonderful distance skills to those watching? Why stand and do a stationary rear cross when you could get there for a front cross? Why make the dog do all of the work and put in all the effort if it is supposed to be a team sport? It is something I know I am incredibly guilty of, I rely on having a fast dog that will do it regardless and don't necessarily match their effort out there on course. Definitely gave us some food for thought. Agree. My favourite handlers are those that actually run with their dogs no matter how well trained and experienced they are. I also have lots of admiration for those handlers who are physically unable to run but are still able put in bloody good performances through awesome distance work! In terms of a win out system, I guess I would feel its a bit unfair having a slower dog myself. I know that she could be faster than what she is with better training and handling etc but honestly she can't keep up with a kelpie or BC on the flat in a straight run let alone when you add in jumps or turns :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podengo Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 weaved twelve poles tonight, with difficult entries and speeeeed! YAY! It's all coming together! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeebie Posted April 15, 2013 Share Posted April 15, 2013 Looking for a home for an awesome 2yr old KelpieX who has already started some basic agility training -> this was a rescue dog currently in a multi dog foster home and urgently needs to be placed. fantastic temperament. http://youtu.be/grKn2FbXOqY http://www.petrescue.com.au/listings/216484 Very happy to report this girl has now gone to an adoring new home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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