Agility Training Talk Thread

[pie]

Very interesting Caffy! I wonder how many people will change to running contacts then. I'd be interested in going to that.

[Kavik]

I think running contacts are more popular overseas than here because you have to actually place for it to count towards your title (Greg Derrett said something to that effect) so speed really counts. In Australia as long as you come in under SCT you qualify and it counts towards title.

I would love my own equipment to improve my contacts but at the moment just not feasible! So expensive and takes up so much space. I do have a seesaw.

[caffy]

Very interesting Caffy! I wonder how many people will change to running contacts then. I'd be interested in going to that.

I can't see me changing to running as I don't have my own gear, but that won't stop me from learning the method especially in person...just something else for the toolbox

[ness]

I told myself second time around I'd just settle for a dog who had a contact behavior that was pretty reliable rather than Ness's hope you have prayed to the right gods this week version of a contact.

[Agility Dogs]

I think running contacts are more popular overseas than here because you have to actually place for it to count towards your title (Greg Derrett said something to that effect) so speed really counts. In Australia as long as you come in under SCT you qualify and it counts towards title.

I would love my own equipment to improve my contacts but at the moment just not feasible! So expensive and takes up so much space. I do have a seesaw.

That's a really good point.

Interestingly though, since I got Xena's AAC title (Aust Agility Champion in ADAA) winning has started to matter. Not because I want to beat other dogs, but because now that we have 'all' our titles (I know I can get multiples) it is a good way to measure our progress.

Divorced from the contact discussion I've started to look for more speed on course - I'm finding that the 'extra' steps Xena takes because of my handling make a MASSIVE difference. eg: 2 steps past a jump, turn, 2 steps back - .8 of a second. Do it 3 times on a course - 2.4 seconds.

That's our goal for the next 12 months - to get rid of all the 'extra' time we lose on courses.

[Agility Dogs]

I told myself second time around I'd just settle for a dog who had a contact behavior that was pretty reliable rather than Ness's hope you have prayed to the right gods this week version of a contact.

That god is cruel and unforgiving. I have forsaken that god for another! They are just not listening yet.

[RallyValley]

I watched the AKC 2010 Nationals last night and only 1 or 2 dogs did 2o2o almost every dog (inclusing the 24" and 26" dogs) had running contacts and the most amazing thing was that only a few dogs missed the contacts.

[Kavik]

I think running contacts are more popular overseas than here because you have to actually place for it to count towards your title (Greg Derrett said something to that effect) so speed really counts. In Australia as long as you come in under SCT you qualify and it counts towards title.

I would love my own equipment to improve my contacts but at the moment just not feasible! So expensive and takes up so much space. I do have a seesaw.

That's a really good point.

Interestingly though, since I got Xena's AAC title (Aust Agility Champion in ADAA) winning has started to matter. Not because I want to beat other dogs, but because now that we have 'all' our titles (I know I can get multiples) it is a good way to measure our progress.

Divorced from the contact discussion I've started to look for more speed on course - I'm finding that the 'extra' steps Xena takes because of my handling make a MASSIVE difference. eg: 2 steps past a jump, turn, 2 steps back - .8 of a second. Do it 3 times on a course - 2.4 seconds.

That's our goal for the next 12 months - to get rid of all the 'extra' time we lose on courses.

For sure once you are doing well, you are going to start to look for placings! And you are going to start getting hungry for placings.

But in order to get titles, while speed is important to an extent as it is not necessary to place, there is not the need to be as fast. I certainly plan on getting faster (me and dog!) and to tidy up those areas where we lose time and ground, but luckily they will not interfere with getting some titles in the meantime. At the moment I am trying to speed up Kaos's dogwalk and get him to go all the way into his 2o2o instead of stopping 4on. At trials at the moment this means actually taking more time and waiting him out until he does his 2o2o while I figure out a strategy for training where he doesn't tend to stop 4on as much.

[piper]

I watched the AKC 2010 Nationals last night and only 1 or 2 dogs did 2o2o almost every dog (inclusing the 24" and 26" dogs) had running contacts and the most amazing thing was that only a few dogs missed the contacts.

Were they truly a running contact or were they super quick releases for a 2o2o? For a nationals you may find they were giving a release before the dog had assumed its contact position - at last that is what a US trainer told me they do at big comps a few years back. She said after a Nationals or large regional qualifying event she will then spend a few weeks reproofing the contacts and getting the dog to assume and hold position. The conversation came up as I was at the time trying to convnice trainers at my club to start training a contact behaviour and asked her id she had some videos to show of her dogs using it in comps, but the only videos she had brought with her were nationals videos where she released the dog before it stopped so did not show a solid contact behaviour.

It has been a few years since I have done agility so someone like Vickie will probably be able to clarify/explain that better than me.

[Agility Dogs]

I watched the AKC 2010 Nationals last night and only 1 or 2 dogs did 2o2o almost every dog (inclusing the 24" and 26" dogs) had running contacts and the most amazing thing was that only a few dogs missed the contacts.

Were they truly a running contact or were they super quick releases for a 2o2o? For a nationals you may find they were giving a release before the dog had assumed its contact position - at last that is what a US trainer told me they do at big comps a few years back. She said after a Nationals or large regional qualifying event she will then spend a few weeks reproofing the contacts and getting the dog to assume and hold position. The conversation came up as I was at the time trying to convnice trainers at my club to start training a contact behaviour and asked her id she had some videos to show of her dogs using it in comps, but the only videos she had brought with her were nationals videos where she released the dog before it stopped so did not show a solid contact behaviour.

It has been a few years since I have done agility so someone like Vickie will probably be able to clarify/explain that better than me.

I was going to make the same comment - the dogs may be running through their contacts, but his is because thye have been allowed to do it, not because they have been trained to always run.

I know Linda Orton-Hill and Susan Garrett don't have running contacts, but they will release before their dogs stop if they are looking for super fast times.

[RallyValley]

I watched the AKC 2010 Nationals last night and only 1 or 2 dogs did 2o2o almost every dog (inclusing the 24" and 26" dogs) had running contacts and the most amazing thing was that only a few dogs missed the contacts.

Were they truly a running contact or were they super quick releases for a 2o2o? For a nationals you may find they were giving a release before the dog had assumed its contact position - at last that is what a US trainer told me they do at big comps a few years back. She said after a Nationals or large regional qualifying event she will then spend a few weeks reproofing the contacts and getting the dog to assume and hold position. The conversation came up as I was at the time trying to convnice trainers at my club to start training a contact behaviour and asked her id she had some videos to show of her dogs using it in comps, but the only videos she had brought with her were nationals videos where she released the dog before it stopped so did not show a solid contact behaviour.

It has been a few years since I have done agility so someone like Vickie will probably be able to clarify/explain that better than me.

I was going to make the same comment - the dogs may be running through their contacts, but his is because thye have been allowed to do it, not because they have been trained to always run.

I know Linda Orton-Hill and Susan Garrett don't have running contacts, but they will release before their dogs stop if they are looking for super fast times.

It probably is that. Its just cause the commentator kept saying "This dog has a nice running contact" for almost all the dogs that got the contacts. Agility newbs can get confused.

[kelpiechick]

I think we decided that the first one would be a pass. The back feet hadn't contacted grass first I suppose. It was just one of those very big bounding strides and probably not the safest thing but try explaining that to the dog.

If the dog's front feet leave the obstacle without touching the colour BEFORE the back feet make contact, the back foot/feet touching is classed as 'incidental contact' and can be faulted by a judge if they choose to do so.

I actually had this happen on the A Frame with my young dog a few weeks back - the judge didn't fault me but did call me over afterwards and talk about it and suggested that some other judges may have pinged it. (Always pays not to p**s off judges ;) )

Luckily this is not his usual contact performance and was actually the first time he has done it, but it's certainly not something that I would be accepting in training as it's another of those 'grey' areas that make the judges think. Yep- I also have the problem of 'big, bounding strides' with this dog - the kelpie-giraffe cross who jumps 600 and has the longest legs in the world. I would think it would only be an issue with a running contact - which this dog has on the AF and not on the DW, not necessarily my contact method of choice but too long and involved story to go there.

I don't think it would be possible to get this type of scenario with a stopped contact, unless you had a dog that was leaping into the 2020 position from a long way up, which I have never seen.

[GoldenGirl85]

What do you guys mean by running contacts?

I started teaching Lexi 2o2o today, she is starting to catch on! the only problem is that she knows she has to drop, but doesnt realise she needs to be on the board when she drops, I wonder if I should put the board on a slant like I had to for Tess, that way when she slips off she will realise that she needs to be on the board

[caffy]

Cosmolo I was considering teaching running contacts, but you have to have your own, full size equipment. Silvia Turkjman (I think, i can't google at work ) a famous Slovenian with world champ dogs teaches them and explains her method on her website.

Perth is hosting Daisy Peel in May next year.

She has a successful running contact and will be covering running contacts at her seminar.

http://www.daisypeel.com/?page_id=172

Here are more details for Daisy's seminar.

Follow the link..

http://www.agilityclubwa.com/

[RubyStar]

OK so I understand the gist of a 2o2o contact, and thought I knew what a running contact meant but from the posts here, apparently not

Can someone please explain the difference between a true running contact and a dog just running through its contact?

Thanks

[Agility Dogs]

What do you guys mean by running contacts?

I started teaching Lexi 2o2o today, she is starting to catch on! the only problem is that she knows she has to drop, but doesnt realise she needs to be on the board when she drops, I wonder if I should put the board on a slant like I had to for Tess, that way when she slips off she will realise that she needs to be on the board

Taught properly running contacts mean that the dog knows to drive for a spot at the bottom of the contact and then keep on going with no thought of a stop. Exactly as it sounds - they 'run' the contacts.

How are you teaching your 2o2o contatcts at the moment?

[caffy]

OK so I understand the gist of a 2o2o contact, and thought I knew what a running contact meant but from the posts here, apparently not

Can someone please explain the difference between a true running contact and a dog just running through its contact?

Thanks

This is video of someone who re trained from a 2on/2off dw to a running dw.

[RubyStar]

Cosmolo I was considering teaching running contacts, but you have to have your own, full size equipment. Silvia Turkjman (I think, i can't google at work ) a famous Slovenian with world champ dogs teaches them and explains her method on her website.

Perth is hosting Daisy Peel in May next year.

She has a successful running contact and will be covering running contacts at her seminar.

http://www.daisypeel.com/?page_id=172

Here are more details for Daisy's seminar.

Follow the link..

http://www.agilityclubwa.com/

Followed your links, found her youtube channel, found this gem http://www.youtube.com/user/cflyrun#p/u/7/oJmlvoZNNoI

[RubyStar]

OK so I understand the gist of a 2o2o contact, and thought I knew what a running contact meant but from the posts here, apparently not

Can someone please explain the difference between a true running contact and a dog just running through its contact?

Thanks

This is video of someone who re trained from a 2on/2off dw to a running dw.

Interesting Being so new to agility, I still don't know how to handle contacts correctly. I've attemtped to try 2o2o, and my progress to date is that Millie knows she has to stop somewhere down the end, so she tears up and across it, then slows on the way down almost to a crawl and offers a 4o Not pretty! I'd like to learn how to teach a proper running contact as the speed is impressive, but no idea how! Maybe I need to attend this seminar

Edited August 1, 2010 by RubyStar

[GoldenGirl85]

What do you guys mean by running contacts?

I started teaching Lexi 2o2o today, she is starting to catch on! the only problem is that she knows she has to drop, but doesnt realise she needs to be on the board when she drops, I wonder if I should put the board on a slant like I had to for Tess, that way when she slips off she will realise that she needs to be on the board

Taught properly running contacts mean that the dog knows to drive for a spot at the bottom of the contact and then keep on going with no thought of a stop. Exactly as it sounds - they 'run' the contacts.

How are you teaching your 2o2o contatcts at the moment?

Walk along a plank and drop at the end with 2 feet off, progress to putting the plank on a slant, then progress to lowered contacts

With Tess I was never able to get a proper 2o2o, but she will go to the bottom of the contact which Im happy with