New Foster Beagle

[Inka3095]

Hi everyone

I have a new foster girl, a 3yo beagle. I've never owned beagles before, so I'm a little out of my depth trying to work out how her mind works. I'm just wondering about the best way to discipline her. We have a no dogs allowed on beds or couches rule at my place, which I'm trying to teach her.

I just walked into the loungeroom before to find her snuggled up on our good couch. I yelled 'Uh UH!!!' and said 'GET DOWN' and pointed at the ground. Obviously after only 2 days here, she can't know everything I'm saying to her, or know what I wanted, so I picked her up (gently, as she's just been desexed) and put her on the ground saying 'NO COUCH!!'. She stood for a second looking at me, then jumped straight back onto the couch. I firmly said 'NO, DOWN' again, and pointed at the floor, but she just snuggled deeper! Repeated above steps. She looked at me again, and jumped straight back onto the couch.

Am I incorrect in thinking she was being deliberately disobedient? She refused to get down by voice alone. I don't hit my dogs, so I won't hit her, but I've never had a dog like this before! On the third attempt, I think I sounded a bit more mad, because she became all cringy and submissive as she rolled over onto her back (still on my couch!).

I've just had to put her outside for a bit because I don't know what to do regarding punishment! I don't want to lock her away because she sleeps in the spare bathroom at night and I don't want her to associate her bedroom with a naughty corner!

Do beagles respond better to positive or negative reinforcement? Should I have tempted her off the couch with a treat and then praised her? Or should I negatively reinforce that the couch is not ok?

This may be the first of many questions hehe. I've only owned staffies and kelpies before really, this beagle is another kettle of fish!

[wuffles]

I am not an expert but here is my advice anyway! Does she have her own comfy bed on the floor, near the couch? You need to make that a nice place for her to be instead of the couch.

I wouldn't punish her for getting on the couch, just an "uh uh, OFF", preferably while in the act of getting up rather than once she's actually up there! Be consistent with the word you use and give her time to learn what it means. Remove her from the couch if necessary and encourage her to lie on her own bed. Give her a bone or toy or something she enjoys on her own bed. Mine have an "on your bed" command that I taught by luring them to their own bed and giving them a treat. I built up the time they were expected to stay there gradually.

With one of ours, he would always try to take the treat elsewhere, so I had to give him rawhides or other treats I could hold while he ate on his bed. The same boy often gives us that "I don't care what you want me to do" look when he gets told off, positive reinforcement of the RIGHT thing to do helps us deal with this. Our other little puppy only has to be told once!

Hope this helps!

[Kavik]

As wuffles suggested, make sure there is an alternative bed for her to lie on.

Have you tried luring off the couch with a treat in conjunction with your command OFF? And then reward for being on her own bed. Often helps to teach going to their own bed on command as well. This can be done a number of ways, you can lure and treat when on her own bed or clicker train it. Beagles are normally quite food motivated.

ETA: my parents had a rescue Beagle for a while who was very naughty. If you tried to physically take him off the couch he would bite you! If you think she may do this (even if only because she is sore from desexing) I would avoid physically taking her off the couch and either lure with food or attach a lead so you can get her off from a distance.

Edited July 1, 2010 by Kavik

[W Sibs]

my brother's beagle is like that when he stayed with me on the weekend.

What I did with him, was gently push him off the couch and make him sit.. then reward him. and keep repeating him. if he is on the couch, he just going to get pushed off and get nothing. once he is on the floor, he gets a treat (he is a sucker for food) and a huge play sessions and plenty of cuddles (he is a huge sook too).

He learnt that on the couch he won't get food and attention, but if he is on the floor.. he does. So, after a few times, he rather hang out on the floor because that's where the action is

I'm lucky because he only sleeps in his crate..

Edited July 1, 2010 by CW EW

[huski]

As wuffles suggested, make sure there is an alternative bed for her to lie on.

Have you tried luring off the couch with a treat in conjunction with your command OFF? And then reward for being on her own bed. Often helps to teach going to their own bed on command as well. This can be done a number of ways, you can lure and treat when on her own bed or clicker train it. Beagles are normally quite food motivated.

ETA: my parents had a rescue Beagle for a while who was very naughty. If you tried to physically take him off the couch he would bite you! If you think she may do this (even if only because she is sore from desexing) I would avoid physically taking her off the couch and either lure with food or attach a lead so you can get her off from a distance.

I agree with Kavik!

Things that worked for me were:

- Giving her a crate/bed/mat that she could lie on instead. So instead of just telling her to get off the furniture I was showing her where she could sit instead.

- Teaching the off command instead of just saying it or getting cross with her. Beags are stubborn and Daisy would take my up on my challenge if I growled at her or directly confronted her. They are also 'what's in it for me' dogs and won't do anything unless they see a point... so I would be teaching the off command and rewarding with a treat, or you could teach an 'in your crate' or 'on your bed' command and reward the dog for lying on it's bed or getting in it's crate. So when she's on the couch you can say 'in your crate' or 'on your bed' instead of off.

Edited July 1, 2010 by huski

[megan_]

If you give her the off command and then treat, won't it just be teaching her to get onto the couch (so she could get off and get a treat). After all, not getting onto the couch = no treats??

[huski]

If you give her the off command and then treat, won't it just be teaching her to get onto the couch (so she could get off and get a treat). After all, not getting onto the couch = no treats??

Depends how you do it! It's how I trained the off command, I phased out the treats pretty quickly and would also reward her for getting in her crate. It's not just about rewarding the dog, but teaching them what 'off' means. I haven't rewarded it with more than verbal praise for years now and Daisy still responds to it well. Physically moving her off the couch wasn't working as she would growl and if I vocally corrected her, she'd escalate the behaviour and would retaliate with more growling/biting (yes... Daisy was a difficult adolscent LOL). I can now pick her up and move her off any piece of furniture without any growling or challenging from her side.

Edited July 1, 2010 by huski

[Kavik]

I've taught all of mine to get off furniture by using treats and haven't encountered them getting on it on purpose to get told to get off

You could start by teaching the off command on something less valuable at first if you want (off a step outside or something) to give them the idea but I've never had a problem.

[skip]

I was going to ask how long you have had her for until I saw "2 days". First you must be sure she knows what you mean. Otherwise telling her to get off the lounge had no meaning to her.

If you don't know her past she may have been a dog allowed inside and on beds/lounge etc? Imagine then why she would be confused. If she is new and doesn't know off and on (or whatever words you use) she would be very confused. She needs time to be taught the "rule".

On another object, maybe outside, see if she knows a command to get up or down. Otherwise teach her this, I use food /positive myself. If not this could be her first lesson.

Until you know she understands you I would also avoid letting her on the louge/bed. Either restrict her access to the lounge or put something on the lounge that prevents her getting up comfortably when you are not there. Once she has adapted you remove the stuff naturally.

This is just my opinion. My adopted dog was so scared when I got him that he would have nearly wet himself if I was in any way negative or stern. Althou all dogs are different, yours could be a different kettle of fish altogether like you said. I don't think she would be "deliberately disobedient", more likely she is behaving as she has in the past, in a way that must have worked for her.

And as others advised - get her a dog bed (or a crate ) and reward her for "on your bed".

Photo's please? :D Let us know how she goes?

[huski]

Photo's please?

Photos are a must :D

[Inka3095]

Thanks so much everyone

Photos! I only have iphone ones at the moment! I will definitely take some tomorrow, she is absolutely stunning in my opinion!!!

We had a training session today with 'sit' and 'come' where I tried to remember everything the dog trainers taught me many, many years ago. Abby will do anything for chicken! She's now sitting at every opportunity lol. When I'm in the kitchen cooking, every time I look at her, she sits. Every time we carry something in our hands, she'll run in front of us then sit. It's hilarious! She either already knew sit from her previous life, or she's a really fast learner.

I've been given the advice that you really must be firm with beagles, and never let them get away with stuff even as a once off, because as you guys pointed out, they can be stubborn creatures. So now I'm not sure whether I should go soft on her because she is new here and doesn't know my rules and my phrases/terms, or whether I should just go hard right from the start and hope she picks it up.

I definitely got the feeling she was asking 'what's in it for me' a few times today... though, once chicken was involved, all her questions were answered!

Thanks for your help everyone, I promise some photos tomorrow

[huski]

I wouldn't go 'hard' on her - you can be firm but fair. It's not fair to come down hard before she knows the rules, but that doesn't mean you have to be soft. Have you ever heard of nothing in life is free (NILIF)? Any time she wants something make her 'pay' for it first - pats, attention, food, toys etc by asking her to sit (for eg). If you google NILIF you'll find some good articles.

I don't hope my dogs pick stuff up - I set them up to win, not fail, so I teach them the behaviours I want to see.

[Inka3095]

Yep, Tam from Beagle Rescue Victoria (crazy beagle lady) has been amazing, giving me all sorts of advice and help. This isn't even one of her rescues, so I'm so lucky she's been around to help out. I just don't want to bug her with every little question, so came to bug DOL instead hehe.

I think I'll have a look at this NILIF, sounds interesting. I don't want to come down hard on her at all, I really just want her to be happy.

[huski]

Here's one article about it, if you are interested

http://k9deb.com/nilif.htm

[beagie]

Hi everyone

I have a new foster girl, a 3yo beagle. I've never owned beagles before, so I'm a little out of my depth trying to work out how her mind works. I'm just wondering about the best way to discipline her. We have a no dogs allowed on beds or couches rule at my place, which I'm trying to teach her.

I just walked into the loungeroom before to find her snuggled up on our good couch. I yelled 'Uh UH!!!' and said 'GET DOWN' and pointed at the ground. Obviously after only 2 days here, she can't know everything I'm saying to her, or know what I wanted, so I picked her up (gently, as she's just been desexed) and put her on the ground saying 'NO COUCH!!'. She stood for a second looking at me, then jumped straight back onto the couch. I firmly said 'NO, DOWN' again, and pointed at the floor, but she just snuggled deeper! Repeated above steps. She looked at me again, and jumped straight back onto the couch.

Am I incorrect in thinking she was being deliberately disobedient? She refused to get down by voice alone. I don't hit my dogs, so I won't hit her, but I've never had a dog like this before! On the third attempt, I think I sounded a bit more mad, because she became all cringy and submissive as she rolled over onto her back (still on my couch!).

I've just had to put her outside for a bit because I don't know what to do regarding punishment! I don't want to lock her away because she sleeps in the spare bathroom at night and I don't want her to associate her bedroom with a naughty corner!

Do beagles respond better to positive or negative reinforcement? Should I have tempted her off the couch with a treat and then praised her? Or should I negatively reinforce that the couch is not ok?

This may be the first of many questions hehe. I've only owned staffies and kelpies before really, this beagle is another kettle of fish!

I am like you the proud owner of a Beagle only mine is a pup now just five months, I have always had gundogs before i.e. GSP's and GWP's

is the training any differant I don't think so, I asked lots of questions about Beagles before I bought my boy, I started off with the magic clicker

I call it magic, because if I want him to do anything come to me drop something get his nose off the ground when heeling the clicker does the

trick. Now what I will say to you is Beagles can be very stubborn, but then I had had this experience with my GWP although they are oposite

in their reactions to stubborness, my GWP is very soft, the Beagle is a lot harder, they will both shut down to negative treatment. I would put

in the time to clicker train your Beagle when fully understood and used it is the best thing since sliced bread. Also Beagles are food driven

so you have got it made. Liken them to gay and happy little hounds, my experience (and I have been training him since ten weeks) negative

is just like year right go away and does not solve the problem. This morning he ran out the front door being so young I grabbed the clicker

clicked and he was straight back to me. Getting off the couch you are going to have to train this with positives, I have found with my boy once

he gets the concept of what I am asking he will do it. I get a great thrill when I see has grasped the idea of what I want, I will never remove that

nose but I do know when I say heel up comes the head. The other thing I have noticed is he responds very well to lots of luv and atention.

good luck Beagie

[Nekhbet]

she doesnt know what you are commanding her to do, just that you are angry at her.

grab her collar and help her down gently, give her an alternative bed to lie on. Praise her for getting down. You will need to repeat until she understands and if she tries again just 'Ahhh No' and take her back to her bed with a treat.