Feeling Disheartened About Puppy School Experience

[Magstar]

We had our first puppy preschool class with Oscar yesterday, and now I know why there are some people who are against puppy preschools..

I think we just had a lot of bad luck with the range of puppies that were in the class. There were 5 puppies in total. One puppy turned out to be quite aggressive towrads any puppy that went anywhere near it, one puppy just wanted to chase the other puppies, one puppy was from a very bad background and was extremely timid and scared of people and the other puppies, and the final puppy was a cute little pug that was the size of a guinea pig.

The aggressive puppy was the first dog that Oscar had an intereaction with. He growled and snapped at Oscar, which made him scared and uneasy for the rest of the class. He was then also chased by the other puppy which made things worse. The poor pug got hammered by those 2 as well, but was a real trooper! The only puppy that was approachable was the pug...but he was a bit small for Oscar!

The only reason we were attending puppy preschool was for the socialisation aspect, but I feel that it actually would have made things worse for him rather than better! We still have 3 more weeks to go and I'm wondering if it would be worth going back! I feel like it should have been a lot more controlled.

The problem is that I don't really know any other dogs to socialise Oscar with that I trust to be a good influence on him. My friend's dogs are all a bit wild,and my only family member that has a dog is an ex puppy farm dog and has issues, so I am really stuck on trying to socialise him! He has our older dog to play with, but I know that's not enough. I feel like I am failing him.

At least the pug was friendly!

[Jumabaar]

We had our first puppy preschool class with Oscar yesterday, and now I know why there are some people who are against puppy preschools..

I think we just had a lot of bad luck with the range of puppies that were in the class. There were 5 puppies in total. One puppy turned out to be quite aggressive towrads any puppy that went anywhere near it, one puppy just wanted to chase the other puppies, one puppy was from a very bad background and was extremely timid and scared of people and the other puppies, and the final puppy was a cute little pug that was the size of a guinea pig.

The aggressive puppy was the first dog that Oscar had an intereaction with. He growled and snapped at Oscar, which made him scared and uneasy for the rest of the class. He was then also chased by the other puppy which made things worse. The poor pug got hammered by those 2 as well, but was a real trooper! The only puppy that was approachable was the pug...but he was a bit small for Oscar!

The only reason we were attending puppy preschool was for the socialisation aspect, but I feel that it actually would have made things worse for him rather than better! We still have 3 more weeks to go and I'm wondering if it would be worth going back! I feel like it should have been a lot more controlled.

The problem is that I don't really know any other dogs to socialise Oscar with that I trust to be a good influence on him. My friend's dogs are all a bit wild,and my only family member that has a dog is an ex puppy farm dog and has issues, so I am really stuck on trying to socialise him! He has our older dog to play with, but I know that's not enough. I feel like I am failing him.

At least the pug was friendly!

Where are you located- there may be some recomenations for an obedience club or a small get together!!

ETA-It probably isnt worth going back- it would almost be better for him not to have contact with any dogs in comparison to having contact with dogs that are going to scare him!!

Edited June 20, 2010 by woofenpup

[Magstar]

I'm located in the Macarthur region (near Camden). As far As I know there aren't any obedience clubs around here that do classes for puppies. If somebody knows otherwise then I would love to find out!

[Sandra777]

He has our older dog to play with, but I know that's not enough. I feel like I am failing him.

Can't offer any recommendations, but a normal, friendly older dog (assuming this describes yours ) is more use in teaching him dog manners than a bunch of unruly pups.

[Magstar]

Well I don't know about normal ...but she is definately friendly! I'm worried that she is a little too tolerant though.

I've been thinking maybe we could ask the instructor if we could possibly change to a different class with different bunch of pups. My OH thinks we should give it one more week and see how it goes., but I don't know if that is wise.

[oakeydoak1]

If you can not change classes maybe ring around some vets there may be other classes around that you can attend. I probably wouldnt go back either.

[Dogsfevr]

Well I don't know about normal ...but she is definately friendly! I'm worried that she is a little too tolerant though.

I've been thinking maybe we could ask the instructor if we could possibly change to a different class with different bunch of pups. My OH thinks we should give it one more week and see how it goes., but I don't know if that is wise.

You shouldnt have to change class if the instructor was on the ball,

The instructor should have taken more control & used the situation as a teaching tool not allow what has happened ,idoes the same trainer teach the other classes?

[Magstar]

Yes, the same instructor takes the other classes.

I think there is a class (different instructor) starting tomorrow night at another vet clinic. Maybe if I'm lucky they will have a spot left. I don't like my chances though!

[oakeydoak1]

Maybe explain to them what happened. I may help?!

[Magstar]

Worth a try I guesss.

Maybe I'm being too negative about the situation because I had this image of a group of puppies running around having fun with each other, and then that didn't happen.

The instructor did make some attempt to control the situation. She made the owner pick up their pup whenever it had a go at any of the others and make it settle, and then tried to make the pup that was frightened by it feel at ease with treats etc. It just didn't seem to have any effect. The same thing just kept happening. Oscar wouldn't take any treats when he was frightened.

[wuffles]

Meeting a range of different puppies at our puppy preschool (big and boisterous, small and timid, dominant, submissive, bossy, indifferent) helped Ava a lot with her socialisation. However, she has a fairly confident nature, and the instructor didn't just stick them all in together and let them run amok. If you can't get in anywhere else, maybe try to make the most of it - make sure your introductions are controlled and avoid the aggressive pup (although one snappy pup in our class taught Ava her first lessons in personal space ).

Edited to add: Sticking a bunch of puppies together and expecting them to have fun might not be the most realistic expectation In my experience, puppies are better paired with either one similar puppy or an older dog - they just don't have the social skills early on to take each other's differences into account.

Edited June 20, 2010 by wuffles

[Magstar]

Meeting a range of different puppies at our puppy preschool (big and boisterous, small and timid, dominant, submissive, bossy, indifferent) helped Ava a lot with her socialisation. However, she has a fairly confident nature, and the instructor didn't just stick them all in together and let them run amok. If you can't get in anywhere else, maybe try to make the most of it - make sure your introductions are controlled and avoid the aggressive pup (although one snappy pup in our class taught Ava her first lessons in personal space ).

Edited to add: Sticking a bunch of puppies together and expecting them to have fun might not be the most realistic expectation In my experience, puppies are better paired with either one similar puppy or an older dog - they just don't have the social skills early on to take each other's differences into account.

I'm hoping that if he gets over the frightened stage then it will be a good learning experience for him dealing with a range of different types of pups. I should add that he wasn't extremely frightened, mostly just uneasy and just tried to keep away from the others. But he was definately a bit stressed by the whole thing.

So in your class were only a couple of puppies let off together at the same time?

[alpha bet]

Your instructor should take charge.... thats their job.....

Assuming as you are at the vet puppy class - then your pup must be around 10 weeks. This is definately an age you need to take care with you pup. If you don't have faith in the instructor you are better to find another class.

The social aspect is very important. It doesnt have to mean social classes with pups, perhaps you know some people with calm steady adult dogs. Perhaps if you go to the park and see people with lovely calm dogs who play well, ask if its possible to interact your pup with their dogs.

[Magstar]

Your instructor should take charge.... thats their job.....

Assuming as you are at the vet puppy class - then your pup must be around 10 weeks. This is definately an age you need to take care with you pup. If you don't have faith in the instructor you are better to find another class.

The social aspect is very important. It doesnt have to mean social classes with pups, perhaps you know some people with calm steady adult dogs. Perhaps if you go to the park and see people with lovely calm dogs who play well, ask if its possible to interact your pup with their dogs.

The classes are held at the vets, but are run by a dog training company. Oscar is 12 weeks. I would have liked to start him earlier, but I wasn't organised enough and then had to wait to get into fresh classes.

I might have to go dog stalking to find some nice calm dogs! But then is that a risk because he is not fully vaccinated yet?

[spirrall]

Hi!

Puppy classes are good if you're a first time dog handler. Also if you want to socialise your dog, go to an off leash park.

[Elsha_UK_AU]

I took Porthos to Dog Training from around 12 weeks. He just graduated Puppy Training last weekend (he's now over 5 months old). There are around 30 pups in our class so they usually have 2 trainers and split into 2 groups - there are pups of all sizes and it can be abit unruly at times but inbetween training (sit, heel, halt, down being some of the training we've done) the pups mingle, we swap pups, someone brings in children to mingle around the pups and so on.

Porthos thinks he's a big dog when in actual fact he is one of the smallest (barring a pug) there. He runs up to the big pups and jumps onto his hind legs to get to them. Of course, a few snap so he is now noticing this and can be a little fearful at times but this hasn't put him off. His little girlfriend dog is a American Bull Dog who is just beautiful and twice his size - they both go all gooey when they see eachother - it is so funny

Maybe stick it out for another class and see how it goes and if it's not for you, try finding another training/puppy class to take your little one along to.

Susan

[wuffles]

I'm hoping that if he gets over the frightened stage then it will be a good learning experience for him dealing with a range of different types of pups. I should add that he wasn't extremely frightened, mostly just uneasy and just tried to keep away from the others. But he was definately a bit stressed by the whole thing.

So in your class were only a couple of puppies let off together at the same time?

There were 9 puppies in our class, for off leash time we were usually divided into small/big with a few exceptions depending on personalities. We had some big bruisers in our class (our aussie, a lab, a staffy, a GS) so letting them run free with the littlies (maltese, cavalier, pug, mini schnauzer, low chen) would have been a disaster! They did get to meet all the other puppies on lead, and by the end of the classes most were confident and big enough to have short off leash time with the big pups.

[corvus]

It can be a bit of a balancing act. My family had a puppy at one stage that was terrified of puppy class and the class instructor insisted that he be put on the ground and expected to get over it. It was the worse thing for that puppy and the damage that was done was never overcome. I do believe he was always going to be particularly sharp, as he was very shy and had a very low bite threshold and a rigid, aggressive coping style from the day he got home at 8 weeks old, but he became outright dangerous to people and other dogs by the time he was 12 months old. A lot of work was done to try to overcome that early experience and get him on the right track with socialisation, but it was an exercise in futility. He was scared of everything new and his response was always aggression. It was impossible to control the environment to the extent that he needed it controlled.

When I got Erik at 9 weeks, I saw in him echoes of this earlier pup. He was a little timid and there were indications that he wouldn't hesitate to use his teeth if pushed. So I never pushed him. He went to puppy school and didn't want to interact with the other dogs. I didn't make him. We stayed in a corner away from them and he was okay. In later weeks he gradually came out of his shell, but he never did play with any of the other puppies (although he roundly told off the Leonberger puppy for trying to take his pig snout). I took him to the dog park a lot and he didn't play with any of the dogs there either, and that was fine. It wasn't until he was 6 months old and had met my mum's Sheltie and had fun with her that he suddenly decided other dogs were fun. Now he's a year old today and he's very social, plays with any sized dog and behaves very appropriately all the time. I can safely push him a little bit, now, and I'm proud as punch at how far he has come and how well balanced he is.

So to make a long story short, I think there are benefits to be had from being exposed to other dogs even if the puppy doesn't want to interact. It's good for them to learn that they don't have to interact. It's not necessarily a terrible thing to learn that some puppies are mean, as long as it's balanced with learning that most puppies and other dogs are not mean. If it were me, I would probably use it as an opportunity to teach my puppy that he needn't interact with any dogs he doesn't want to interact with and keep him on the periphery well within his comfort zone.

[sas]

I'm located in the Macarthur region (near Camden). As far As I know there aren't any obedience clubs around here that do classes for puppies. If somebody knows otherwise then I would love to find out!

One of the best Puppy Schools is only 20kms from you in Austral. Luci Ellem's puppy pre-school: http://www.camarna.com/main.htm

The puppies learn to be around one another and just ignore one another and focus on what they're meant to be doing.

Alot of people think puppy schools are where puppies should play and interact, this isn't the case and it shouldn't be because there will always be dogs that aren't suitable to be with your puppy, you're at puppy school to learn together with your puppy and hopefully create a more neutral grounding for your puppy around other dogs rather than them finding them a high value item.

[sas]

Hi!

Puppy classes are good if you're a first time dog handler. Also if you want to socialise your dog, go to an off leash park.

That can be one of the wost things you could possibly do especially if you're a newbe.

Not all dogs at dog parks are well socialised. If your puppy gets hammered at a dog park especially during a fear period then it can be all over rover....fear aggression can take hold.