Inspiring Confidence

[Vickie]

How do you deal with students/training partners/friends that (in training)

a.) constantly put themselves down

b.) constantly put their dogs down

or c.) both

Why do you think they do it & how do you help them get over it?

The people thing I think is often related to either genuine low self esteem or a form of attention seeking.

The dog thing I just don't get at all.

I know a few people who do both. Every now & then they forget themselves & forget that "they have a crap dog" and things go brilliantly. i just wish I could video those moments to show them how it could be all the time...if they just modified their attitude.

[Kavik]

This is a good question and I am interested in the responses. I know a couple of people who do both as well. I am not sure how to approach it, especially when they are more experienced than me.

[poodlefan]

Vickie I think Step 1 is to make people aware that they do it.. because in my experience a lot aren't.

For people, I try to encourage them to find the positives in what they can do and to view any shortcomings as just areas to work on.

My pet hate is handlers who blame their dogs for their own lack of training and poor handling.. and I usually succumb to the overwhelming urge to point that out.

But only in very positive and caring way of course.

ETA: I can recall one handler who took a succession of drivey happy dogs through to slow, unwilling agility dogs with her negativity towards herself and them.. very hard to watch but in the end you tend to give up trying to coach when nothing you say or do changes their attitude.

Edited June 17, 2010 by poodlefan

[Vickie]

Vickie I think Step 1 is to make people aware that they do it.. because in my experience a lot aren't.

yes that is true...although some you can tell again & again with no change.

someone recently pointed out something to me about the way I come cross. It is a minor thing but something I was unaware of & needed to see it from an outsiders view to be able to recognise that I need to work on it. I am grateful to be told.

For people, I try to encourage them to find the positives in what they can do and to view any shortcomings as just areas to work on.

That sounds good, I think helping them form a plan to work on is a good idea too.

My pet hate is handlers who blame their dogs for their own lack of training and poor handling..

ME TOO!!

and I usually succumb to the overwhelming urge to point that out. But only in very positive and caring way of course.

of course Edited June 17, 2010 by Vickie

[Aidan]

CBT?

[Vickie]

CBT?

Definitely. I think those of us who know people like this do attempt this in a informal manner but it is interesting to consider making it more of goal oriented process. This has given me a lot to think about. thanks

also made me reflect on situations where peope have used CBT on me

Edited June 17, 2010 by Vickie

[RubyStar]

How do you deal with students/training partners/friends that (in training)

a.) constantly put themselves down

b.) constantly put their dogs down

or c.) both

Why do you think they do it & how do you help them get over it?

The people thing I think is often related to either genuine low self esteem or a form of attention seeking.

The dog thing I just don't get at all.

I know a few people who do both. Every now & then they forget themselves & forget that "they have a crap dog" and things go brilliantly. i just wish I could video those moments to show them how it could be all the time...if they just modified their attitude.

Bolded bit I think applies to putting themselves AND the dog down. Putting the dog down (not in the literal sense!) is a reflection of how they feel about their own training ability, it's not really about the dog. I believe this because I am one of those people who is a bit negative, but it's usually about most things in life. It's just me I do have low self esteem and that is the contributing factor.

I have to try and remember not to be so negative around others because I know it's a downer on those you train with. Noone wants to train with the negative sourpuss

Edited June 17, 2010 by RubyStar

[pie]

Very interesting topic. I've been guilty of doing this before (putting myself & my dog down and putting myself down), sometimes I get frustrated for whatever reason but a strategy that helps me is focusing on the positives. I know that sounds cliché but sometimes we forget to do this and it is rare to find no positives at all.

I'm quite self conscious and have caught myself in the past being negative when talking to other people about my dog's progress because they are experienced and perfect and their dogs are so clever and my dog and I are nervous hopeless wrecks Thankfully I snapped out of that one because it doesn't take long to see that NOBODY is perfect, every dog and handler is different. There's no point comparing my dog to others in WA because there is no other dog like mine, nothing even close really.

I have some great people around me who are very encouraging and have given me some good tips along the way and pointed out positives that I hadn't even thought of. I try and do the same where I can. I think everyone needs a bit of a confidence boost every now and then, particularly when starting out, it feels like such a long time training your first agility dog and it's easy to get disillusioned but I try and keep the encouragement going with people less experienced than me and not let them quit!

I think some things to help confidence are:

- Writing down positives after a run / training session and also writing down 'things to work on' (not labelled 'negatives')

- Keeping a journal with goals and then looking back on it to see progress (one I intend to start doing)

- Filming runs / training sessions to look back on and compare to see improvements

- Reminding people that it is supposed to be FUN for both you and your dog! (I have to be reminded of this to sometimes )

I think people who constantly put their dog down but do not put themselves down are achieving nothing and shirking responsibility, it is better to seek help and try a different strategy to train it that will make the dog understand the task better / respond to the handler better because something obviously isn't working (and it is more than likely the handlers fault).

Sorry that turned out to be a bit of a waffle

[Mas1981]

I think I am guilty of maybe having no confidence in myself, I think my dog is brilliant and he is very smart, my problem is that I know that I am lacking in handling knowledge and experience, my dog is sharp, and if someone shows me how to train something he gets it quickly, I take longer then him to learn stuff ( such as foot work and hand signal/ footwork co-ordination if you know what I mean).

RS i dont know about you but I dont think I am negative its more a confidence thing? I battle to imagine myself being really good at something and I think its a big issue for me.

[huski]

My pet hate is handlers who blame their dogs for their own lack of training and poor handling.. and I usually succumb to the overwhelming urge to point that out.

I can't stand that either!

I can be a bit negative sometimes, but I tend to joke about it more than I mean it seriously. The problems we have are handler related, not dog related

Another pet hate of mine are people who are really up themselves and think they are the best thing since sliced bread and constantly talk themselves up, but when it comes to delivering, they aren't actually that crash hot.

CBT?

What does that stand for?

[Erny]

CBT?

What does that stand for?

Cognitive Behavioural Therapy, I think. It's about teaching/encouraging people to focus on positive things rather than on negative things.

Edited June 17, 2010 by Erny

[poodlefan]

Observations from training handlers:

* Dogs don't care how good a trainer/handler you are provided you don't frustrate the pants off them or abuse them. Most dogs want to be with their handlers and please them. How well the team performs tends to matter more to the handler than the dog. If the dog has a good time, that's enough for them.

* Handlers who start the first sentence after you explain something to them with "I can't" or "yeah but", sometimes have to be encouraged to suspend doubt or criticism and simply TRY what you are suggesting. As a handler I have to remember this too. Provided the suggestion isn't dangerous or damaging, trying won't hurt. Sometimes those who think they can't do something can surprise themselves.

* Know all handlers are the worst of all to try to teach. When people continue to argue or refuse to take guidance from me, I stop trying to coach them and focus on those willing to have a go. Instructing handlers is a relationship - it doesn't work when one side of the team refuses to cooperate.

* Handlers who act out their frustrations on the dog need a time out.

[SkySoaringMagpie]

I try to remember that I'm a dog obedience instructor, not a shrink paid $150 an hour to work out that person's issues. So I don't get personal.

However, I think genuine praise for good work helps. So like I would with a dog, I try to catch them doing the right thing, and I point it out.

The other thing is that I give all my guys a short speech about what "impresses" me because i think a lot of this stuff is done for the benefit of other adult humans who are watching, not for the person or their dog. So I say that if their dog does not do what is required, I will not be impressed by anyone acting tough or putting themselves or their dog down, and that what I want to see is people stopping and thinking constructively about how to fix the problem - that's what is impressive to me as an instructor. So explicitly give them permission to fail so long as they use the failure as an opportunity to learn.

[Amerykus]

I think I am guilty of maybe having no confidence in myself, I think my dog is brilliant and he is very smart, my problem is that I know that I am lacking in handling knowledge and experience, my dog is sharp, and if someone shows me how to train something he gets it quickly, I take longer then him to learn stuff ( such as foot work and hand signal/ footwork co-ordination if you know what I mean).

RS i dont know about you but I dont think I am negative its more a confidence thing? I battle to imagine myself being really good at something and I think its a big issue for me.

GREAT Topic Vickie...

I agree with you Mas1981, as i too Lack Confidence, I TRY hard but sometimes I can be a bit slow picking things up too, and wish i had someone who'd be willing to TRAIN me

Ive fumbled my way to get my dog into masters agility , but I , myself, NOW lack the ability to handle a Masters course, which is sad as i LOVE agility

[Erny]

Ive fumbled my way to get my dog into masters agility , but I , myself, NOW lack the ability to handle a Masters course, which is sad as i LOVE agility[/color]

I think it is no mean feat to get yourself and your dog to Masters Agility level.

Well done.

You're obviously doing something right.

[Mas1981]

I think I am guilty of maybe having no confidence in myself, I think my dog is brilliant and he is very smart, my problem is that I know that I am lacking in handling knowledge and experience, my dog is sharp, and if someone shows me how to train something he gets it quickly, I take longer then him to learn stuff ( such as foot work and hand signal/ footwork co-ordination if you know what I mean).

RS i dont know about you but I dont think I am negative its more a confidence thing? I battle to imagine myself being really good at something and I think its a big issue for me.

GREAT Topic Vickie...

I agree with you Mas1981, as i too Lack Confidence, I TRY hard but sometimes I can be a bit slow picking things up too, and wish i had someone who'd be willing to TRAIN me

Ive fumbled my way to get my dog into masters agility , but I , myself, NOW lack the ability to handle a Masters course, which is sad as i LOVE agility

Masters agility, wow I would be proud of that! I have to get my dog to pass the offlead assessment before I can even join the beginners agility training group lol

[RubyStar]

RS i dont know about you but I dont think I am negative its more a confidence thing? I battle to imagine myself being really good at something and I think its a big issue for me.

For me, it's both. I have never had confidence, big issue for me, and due to that, I can be quite negative. But working so hard with my girls, when things finally come together, it really is quite a confidence boost and I start feeling more positive!

Sounds like I need some of that CBT stuff that was mentioned if it is in fact therapy to help people be more positive :D

Edited June 17, 2010 by RubyStar

[The Spotted Devil]

There's also what is called in psychology, the fundamental attribution error, where people tend to over value personality based explanations for the observed behaviours for others whilst under valuing situational explanations. When examining their own behaviour, there is a tendency for people to attribute the causes to situation stimuli rather than personality traits. This leads to the so called "actor-observer bias" i.e. attributional bias.

I try to simply focus on my relationship with the dog - supporting him, communicating with him and giving him confidence. If you just keep on working on that, the rest seems to flow.

[Aidan]

Thanks Erny, CBT does indeed stand for Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. Whilst I wouldn't suggest that a dog trainer should ever hang up a shingle and offer CBT as part of the service, the principles are worth paying attention to. Encouraging positive thoughts and behaviours and drawing attention to the good things that a person does can make a difference. Look objectively for what increases the responses.

Tag Teach might be a good proxy for dog trainers.

[Vickie]

I have to try and remember not to be so negative around others because I know it's a downer on those you train with. Noone wants to train with the negative sourpuss

if it's any consolation rs, i have never particularly noticed you being negative on DOL .

Don't try for others..try for yourself