Seeking Advice On Selecting A Puppy

[dancinbcs]

The Collie Smooth does still have a double coat so would shed but other than that would suit you perfectly. They are generally more confident and generally a bit tougher than than the Rough variety. Collies are great all round family dogs that should be looked at more by people wanting pets. Just make sure, like with any breed that you only get one from a breeder that is happy to discuss all health aspects.

Ridgebacks are my favourite of the hounds. Responsible breeders have all puppies checked for dermoid sinus and do not sell affected puppies. Traditionally the rigdeless puppies have been pts by most breeders because most buyers that want a Ridgeback will only buy one with a ridge. Some recent genetic studies however have suggested (not sure if it was proven) that if they only ever breed ridged to ridgeless they will never have any puppies affected by dermoid sinus. So if any breeders are trying this approach there could possibly be ridgeless puppies available. Ridgebacks make great guard dogs because their size and deep bark will deter most intruders, but they are generally very friendly gentle dogs.

Whippets are also wonderful pets but do have a need for comfort and warmth, so prefer to be inside dogs. They fit into just about any family but like all hounds are independant enough to not be clingy.

All the Weimaraners I have known have all been very clingy, needy dogs. They are hard work as puppies because they are very demanding of the owners time but more sensible as adults if they have been trained right.

I have never personally known any Pointers so can't comment on them.

For your situation I still think an older dog might be better than a puppy. If you have your heart set on a puppy, than how about an adult Whippet first and then a puppy of one of the other breeds so it would have the Whippet for company. BTW I know of a few breeders that have both Ridgebacks and Whippets, so they are breeds that get along well.

[GoldenWei]

Shortstep, just to reveal my ignorance a bit more, we are talking about the same breed right? I'm referring to the Collie not the Border Collie - I didn't even know there was a difference before.

GoldenWei, I assume its just a matter of training to teach the Weim (or any other dog) that he/she just to say outside the boundary of the kitchen area?

yes, we could teach them not to do it, but they sleep in the kitchen/family room so it makes it difficult. If they are in the way too much we put them in the lounge room, we have baby gates separating areas of our house, one is permanently closed, be the other remains open during the day, and closed at night... so we don't get nightly visitors!

[shortstep]

Shortstep, just to reveal my ignorance a bit more, we are talking about the same breed right? I'm referring to the Collie not the Border Collie - I didn't even know there was a difference before.

Yes 2 different breeds. You mentioned border collies yesterday, that breed I have worked with for many years and I feel is not suitable for you for a multitude of reasons.

Collie is a different breed and we also have a collie, now 15 years old. She is a fine companion, would be lovey with your children, but they do shed and bark which are 2 things you said you wanted to avoid.

Call Weim rescue in QLD, I think they are affilited with the breed club in QLD. Tell them you are interested in learning more about the breed and would like to foster a rescue for a short time if that was possible...take if from there.

[Lambo]

Dancinbcs, in principle your suggestion of an older dog followed by puppy suits me - but I think I might only have one shot at this. Its taken 2 years to convince my other half to even let me have one dog! I think I might be pushing it to get two.

Having said that, whilst my preference is for a pup, I still haven't ruled out rescuing an older dog. But if get an older one, I think I'd be more inclined to get either a Collie or a Whippet, or maybe a Pointer. I figure the Ridgeback and Weim might be too big to risk taking home an older dog that I haven't raised as a pup myself. I'm thinking of my kids' safety here. If fact, its the fear of the unknown history/temperament of an older rescue dog that makes me hesitate going down that route at all.

[shortstep]

Dancinbcs, in principle your suggestion of an older dog followed by puppy suits me - but I think I might only have one shot at this. Its taken 2 years to convince my other half to even let me have one dog! I think I might be pushing it to get two.

Having said that, whilst my preference is for a pup, I still haven't ruled out rescuing an older dog. But if get an older one, I think I'd be more inclined to get either a Collie or a Whippet, or maybe a Pointer. I figure the Ridgeback and Weim might be too big to risk taking home an older dog that I haven't raised as a pup myself. I'm thinking of my kids' safety here. If fact, its the fear of the unknown history/temperament of an older rescue dog that makes me hesitate going down that route at all.

It is just the opposit. If you work with a good rescuer, they know the dogs well before they place them. You will know exactly what you are getting. That is why the failure rate on placements with a good rescue group is usually very low.

Raising a pup anything can happen. How many pups have you raised?? It is not easy, and if you have limited time at home it will be very difficult indeed. I would never place a pup with you, as I think the likelyhood of failure is too high. I do not think you are a bad person, I just think you have no idea what you are taking on. That is not to say you could not work your way through it. You may also change some of your expectations as you live with the pup. I still am very unclear on how many hours in a 24 hour day the pup will be alone. 8 hours when you sleep and you said 10 for work. Then there is diner time and kids activities, so I am guessing you have a few hours a day to spend with the pup??

[Lambo]

Stortstep, I'd allow say 10 hours for work and 5 hours sleep (I rarely sleep longer than this). Allowing for personal time, I reckon I'd spend around 6-7 hours with the pup/dog each week day. That's me personally of course. It'd have my OH has company during the 10 hours I'm at work. And my kids would spend time with it too. Then there's the weekend.

I appreciate that raising a pup will be time consuming and hard work. However, I'm also well aware that a colleague of mine is in exactly the same boat as me and has been able to raise a Staffy puppy quite successfully. She spends even more time away from home than I do because she lives two hours (each way) away from where we work and hence leaves her buddy alone for longer. Having said that, I gather that her hubby gets home about 5 hours before she does. But because he's a brickie and starts work really early, I understand that they both go to be quite early - like 7 or 8pm. I'm rarely in bed before midnight.

I know everyone's circumstances are different, and that each dog will react differently, but I figure if she can do it surely I could too?

[~Shepherd~]

Stortstep, I'd allow say 10 hours for work and 5 hours sleep (I rarely sleep longer than this). Allowing for personal time, I reckon I'd spend around 6-7 hours with the pup/dog each week day. That's me personally of course. It'd have my OH has company during the 10 hours I'm at work. And my kids would spend time with it too. Then there's the weekend.

I appreciate that raising a pup will be time consuming and hard work. However, I'm also well aware that a colleague of mine is in exactly the same boat as me and has been able to raise a Staffy puppy quite successfully. She spends even more time away from home than I do because she lives two hours (each way) away from where we work and hence leaves her buddy alone for longer. Having said that, I gather that her hubby gets home about 5 hours before she does. But because he's a brickie and starts work really early, I understand that they both go to be quite early - like 7 or 8pm. I'm rarely in bed before midnight.

I know everyone's circumstances are different, and that each dog will react differently, but I figure if she can do it surely I could too?

of course you can, most of the dog owning population works

[Monah]

Stortstep, I'd allow say 10 hours for work and 5 hours sleep (I rarely sleep longer than this). Allowing for personal time, I reckon I'd spend around 6-7 hours with the pup/dog each week day. That's me personally of course. It'd have my OH has company during the 10 hours I'm at work. And my kids would spend time with it too. Then there's the weekend.

I appreciate that raising a pup will be time consuming and hard work. However, I'm also well aware that a colleague of mine is in exactly the same boat as me and has been able to raise a Staffy puppy quite successfully. She spends even more time away from home than I do because she lives two hours (each way) away from where we work and hence leaves her buddy alone for longer. Having said that, I gather that her hubby gets home about 5 hours before she does. But because he's a brickie and starts work really early, I understand that they both go to be quite early - like 7 or 8pm. I'm rarely in bed before midnight.

I know everyone's circumstances are different, and that each dog will react differently, but I figure if she can do it surely I could too?

Yes of course you can, I didn't realise your OH would be at home a lot too.

And also, whenever the pup drives you crazy you can come on here and vent. I'm sure nearly all of us have had times when we've thought What was I thinking???????? (re puppies!) :D

and, If we can just get through this period, we'll be fine!! xxxx

Edited June 5, 2010 by Monah

[Sheridan]

Stortstep, I'd allow say 10 hours for work and 5 hours sleep (I rarely sleep longer than this). Allowing for personal time, I reckon I'd spend around 6-7 hours with the pup/dog each week day. That's me personally of course. It'd have my OH has company during the 10 hours I'm at work. And my kids would spend time with it too. Then there's the weekend.

Is this is OH who isn't keen on dogs?

[Lambo]

I didn't mean to imply she'd be home all the time - My OH does of course have a social life of her own. The only "problem" is that she's not really a dog person. That said, I figure a puppy would have a fair chance of melting her heart.

ETA: Nor did I mean to imply that my OH would necessarily be as interactive with the puppy as me. But I understood Shortstep's question to be directed to how long the pup would be left at home by itself. If my OH is at home then it won't be alone will it? It will have company, just probably not as many hugs and treats as when I'm at home.

Edited June 5, 2010 by Lambo

[~Shepherd~]

The Collie Smooth does still have a double coat so would shed but other than that would suit you perfectly. They are generally more confident and generally a bit tougher than than the Rough variety. Collies are great all round family dogs that should be looked at more by people wanting pets. Just make sure, like with any breed that you only get one from a breeder that is happy to discuss all health aspects.

Ridgebacks are my favourite of the hounds. Responsible breeders have all puppies checked for dermoid sinus and do not sell affected puppies. Traditionally the rigdeless puppies have been pts by most breeders because most buyers that want a Ridgeback will only buy one with a ridge. Some recent genetic studies however have suggested (not sure if it was proven) that if they only ever breed ridged to ridgeless they will never have any puppies affected by dermoid sinus. So if any breeders are trying this approach there could possibly be ridgeless puppies available. Ridgebacks make great guard dogs because their size and deep bark will deter most intruders, but they are generally very friendly gentle dogs.

Whippets are also wonderful pets but do have a need for comfort and warmth, so prefer to be inside dogs. They fit into just about any family but like all hounds are independant enough to not be clingy.

All the Weimaraners I have known have all been very clingy, needy dogs. They are hard work as puppies because they are very demanding of the owners time but more sensible as adults if they have been trained right.

I have never personally known any Pointers so can't comment on them.

For your situation I still think an older dog might be better than a puppy. If you have your heart set on a puppy, than how about an adult Whippet first and then a puppy of one of the other breeds so it would have the Whippet for company. BTW I know of a few breeders that have both Ridgebacks and Whippets, so they are breeds that get along well.

In my experience I think Whippets get on well with everything. They are also a good antidote for a high maintenance dog, she is such a calming influence on my GSD and the GSD really doesn't bark as the whippet doesn't. The whip has excellent house manners and the younger Shep copies. Shes a good mentor

[Sheridan]

I didn't mean to imply she'd be home all the time - My OH does of course have a social life of her own. The only "problem" is that she's not really a dog person. That said, I figure a puppy would have a fair chance of melting her heart.

ETA: Nor did I mean to imply that my OH would necessarily be as interactive with the puppy as me. But I understood Shortstep's question to be directed to how long the pup would be left at home by itself. If my OH is at home then it won't be alone will it? It will have company, just probably not as many hugs and treats as when I'm at home.

The puppy will be alone if your non-dog liking OH doesn't want to take care of it. Frankly, getting a dog when your OH isn't keen and assuming that she'll become an instant fan is assuming much.

[~Shepherd~]

Dancinbcs, in principle your suggestion of an older dog followed by puppy suits me - but I think I might only have one shot at this. Its taken 2 years to convince my other half to even let me have one dog! I think I might be pushing it to get two.

Having said that, whilst my preference is for a pup, I still haven't ruled out rescuing an older dog. But if get an older one, I think I'd be more inclined to get either a Collie or a Whippet, or maybe a Pointer. I figure the Ridgeback and Weim might be too big to risk taking home an older dog that I haven't raised as a pup myself. I'm thinking of my kids' safety here. If fact, its the fear of the unknown history/temperament of an older rescue dog that makes me hesitate going down that route at all.

It is just the opposit. If you work with a good rescuer, they know the dogs well before they place them. You will know exactly what you are getting. That is why the failure rate on placements with a good rescue group is usually very low.

Raising a pup anything can happen. How many pups have you raised?? It is not easy, and if you have limited time at home it will be very difficult indeed. I would never place a pup with you, as I think the likelyhood of failure is too high. I do not think you are a bad person, I just think you have no idea what you are taking on. That is not to say you could not work your way through it. You may also change some of your expectations as you live with the pup. I still am very unclear on how many hours in a 24 hour day the pup will be alone. 8 hours when you sleep and you said 10 for work. Then there is diner time and kids activities, so I am guessing you have a few hours a day to spend with the pup??

you dont have to have experience in raising a pup to do an excellent job. Think about women, they are all first time mums. There is NO step by step manual on how to do it. SOme of the best dogs I know a raised by first time puppy owners and some of the worst are owned by "been there done thats".

[persephone]

Mmmm.. I am also feeling a bit for the non-doggy OH.... left alone with a puppy who , as we all know, can make anyone's life miserable at times whining/barking/toilet troubles/illness/chewing.... it is fine when you love your puppy and know what to expect, but for someone who is tolerating a dog for her family ..and is home with it a lot ,alone, things may be a bit ermmm uncomfortable.

[shortstep]

Stortstep, I'd allow say 10 hours for work and 5 hours sleep (I rarely sleep longer than this). Allowing for personal time, I reckon I'd spend around 6-7 hours with the pup/dog each week day. That's me personally of course. It'd have my OH has company during the 10 hours I'm at work. And my kids would spend time with it too. Then there's the weekend.

I appreciate that raising a pup will be time consuming and hard work. However, I'm also well aware that a colleague of mine is in exactly the same boat as me and has been able to raise a Staffy puppy quite successfully. She spends even more time away from home than I do because she lives two hours (each way) away from where we work and hence leaves her buddy alone for longer. Having said that, I gather that her hubby gets home about 5 hours before she does. But because he's a brickie and starts work really early, I understand that they both go to be quite early - like 7 or 8pm. I'm rarely in bed before midnight.

I know everyone's circumstances are different, and that each dog will react differently, but I figure if she can do it surely I could too?

Oh yes I am sure it can be done and really I am not saying you can not do it. If you research raising the pup like I think you will do, that will be a big plus in your favor. However I think you would save yourself and your family over a year of stress by finding a young adult dog that was suitable for your family and lifestyle.

Edited to add, I think a puppy would be far more likely to put your wife in to melt down! A nice young dog that knows how to take a crap outside, who comes when called and does not chew up her new lounge would be far more likely to melt her heart.

Edited June 5, 2010 by shortstep

[shortstep]

you dont have to have experience in raising a pup to do an excellent job. Think about women, they are all first time mums. There is NO step by step manual on how to do it. SOme of the best dogs I know a raised by first time puppy owners and some of the worst are owned by "been there done thats".

Well looking at the animal shelters tells me that even though it may be possible, a lot of people fail to see it through sucessfully.

I do admire lambo for trying to reserch this before jumping in iwth both feet.

[dancinbcs]

Dancinbcs, in principle your suggestion of an older dog followed by puppy suits me - but I think I might only have one shot at this. Its taken 2 years to convince my other half to even let me have one dog! I think I might be pushing it to get two.

Having said that, whilst my preference is for a pup, I still haven't ruled out rescuing an older dog. But if get an older one, I think I'd be more inclined to get either a Collie or a Whippet, or maybe a Pointer. I figure the Ridgeback and Weim might be too big to risk taking home an older dog that I haven't raised as a pup myself. I'm thinking of my kids' safety here. If fact, its the fear of the unknown history/temperament of an older rescue dog that makes me hesitate going down that route at all.

That is why I suggested earlier that an older dog from a breeder might suit rather than a rescue. Then you know the exact background of the dog and where it has come from. Many breeders have kids and a retired show dog is well socialised and trained already. They also have access to dogs they have sold that may need to be rehomed for a varity of reasons. I do agree though that an adult Whippet or Collie would probably be the safest option with kids as a general rule.

Some examples:

Several years ago I had one of my puppy buyers ask me to help her rehome the dog I had sold her. The owner had cancer and was unable to cope with her four dogs. She decided it would be easiest to rehome the one with the best temperament - the 4 year old fully trained female Border Collie that came from me. At the time my boss's daughter was newly married to a man who did no ever want to own a dog. She finally talked him around by telling him about this dog needing a home. She then asked if she should hold out for a puppy but I told her that could undo everything if the puppy turned out too boisterous or destructive. She took my advice, gave this lovely 4 year old BC a home and within a month reported her husband was cuddling the dog on the loungeroom floor. 12 months later her husband rang me to ask if I thought they would be able to take the dog with them to Canada for a year. They had both been offered contracts for positions that were once in a lifetime opportunities, but neither would contemplate going unless I thought the dog would be ok to accompany them. She was one of the most stable dogs I had ever known so I gave them my blessing and off they all went to Canada for the year before returning home and starting a family.

Some years later I met a Ridgeback breeder that owned 22 dogs. He loved the dogs and had fallen into the trap of keeping two from every litter until he had all these dogs he didn't know what to do with. He didn't believe anyone would want an adult Ridgie so felt he was stuck with them all. The dogs were all healthy, socialised, trained and had lovely temperaments so I suggested he advertise that he had some available and see what happened. He was inundated with enquires and was able to weed out several wonderful homes including one as a therapy dog in a nursing home. The dogs he placed all fitted in beautifully to their new homes and the breeder managed to reduce his numbers a bit to allow more time for the ones he kept.

So there is a difference between a dog from a breeder that needs a new home and a true rescue. The older dog from a breeder is more of a known quantity but is not a true rescue because it is not in danger of being pts. The breeder simply keeps the dog until the right home comes along, however long that takes.

BTW, I have never known Collies (Rough or Smooth) as a breed to be barkers. Some are but most are pretty quiet dogs. Bearded Collies on the other hand are notorious barkers. Border Collies are generally not barkers either but it depends on the lines. A few are famous for it.

[Gayle.]

My son got an ex-show dog from a breeder. He didn't think his lifetyle was compatable with raising a pup as he's an army officer and lives a fairly unpredictable lifestyle. He checked the listings on DOL for older dogs and found a lovely 19 month old English Setter. The dog was young enough to easily adapt, but old enough he'd pretty much outgrown the puppy silliness and he fitted in right away.

There are lots of pedigree dogs in the 1-3 year age group looking for good homes and it's often an ideal choice if you're not too sure about whether a puppy will suit, or if a particular breed is the right one for you.

[Lambo]

Despite appearances, I should probably make clear that I'm not going into this thing on blind faith - we all know that assumptions make an ass out of u and me.

I am talking through the issues being raised on this thread with my OH, and making clear what would be required of her so as to determine whether or not I am asking too much. So far her reactions seem positive, but I don't want to push my luck. For that reason, I guess I am starting to lean toward getting a more mature (say a 1 or 2 year old) Weim or Ridgeback - either from a breeder or as a rescue. And of these two, I'm getting the sense that maybe the Ridgeback will tick more of the right boxes.

The Collie would probably be better than the Ridgeback - but I'm turned off by the shedding. If it's a barker too, that just makes things worse.

Although the Whippet is growing on me, I'm still more partial to the larger breeds.

I'm note sure where the Pointer sits in my order of preference at the moment.

That said, I'm still not certain about abandoning the puppy idea altogether.

[shortstep]

My son got an ex-show dog from a breeder. He didn't think his lifetyle was compatable with raising a pup as he's an army officer and lives a fairly unpredictable lifestyle. He checked the listings on DOL for older dogs and found a lovely 19 month old English Setter. The dog was young enough to easily adapt, but old enough he'd pretty much outgrown the puppy silliness and he fitted in right away.

There are lots of pedigree dogs in the 1-3 year age group looking for good homes and it's often an ideal choice if you're not too sure about whether a puppy will suit, or if a particular breed is the right one for you.

Great idea both of you have. Just took a look at the DOL adults dogs page

http://www.dogzonline.com.au/breeds/dogs.asp

Several really nice Whippets, a couple of smooth collies and lots of other really nice dogs....take a look lambo