Puppies Registration Papers

[SparkyTansy]

Maybe Ellz doesn't see her puppies as merchandise to be sold like you obviously do BB... Believe it or not, there are breeders out there that are breeding to improve the breed, not just pump out puppies to sell to the pet market.

I would happily say to hell with anyone that doesn't understand and accept the processes I choose for MY puppies (and they are my puppies until the money changes hands). I would rather sell a puppy to someone with whom I have a good relationship and a mutual trust than to someone who insists I register their pup early and give them the papers when they pick up the pup or they walk away. i would rather they walk away.

There are some bad breeders out there who will not give out papers despite their promises... and on a forum such as this where people come on asking for advice about their purebred puppies, those situations are going to be noticeable... right so there are two active threads at the moment about people that haven't received their papers. How many purebred dog owners are there on this forum who HAVE papers from their breeders who have had NO need for complaint, even if they didn't get their papers when they picked up the puppy? Certainly more than you would ever be willing to acknowledge BB...

Yes, many breeders do provide the papers at a later date with no issues, but what I am acknowledging is that collecting a puppy without the papers has a risk attached as some have found out. It's no consolation for the buyer that does get duded on their papers to say that the majority are ok and the system is great........does that help the owner with the now unpapered dog because their breeder has disappeared???. Trust systems have their weaknesses and if a breeder couldn't supply my papers when collecting the puppy, I would want some form of guarentee that I will definitely get them.

To assume that getting papers with the puppy doesn't happen and it's all too hard...........I have just collected a puppy 6 weeks ago with the papers, it does and can happen if the breeder tries an bit harder to satisfy their customers

Yes, it has a risk... you know, buyer beware and all that. I would consider the risk higher purchasing a puppy with papers ready to go because they breed only to supply the pet market and could be churning out lesser quality puppies because they aren't breeding to better the breed... but that's just me.

What happened in this situation is unfair... but who is to say that this person isn't at fault for not doing their research on ensuring the breeder was legit? Did they make sure they would get papers when they picked up the puppy? when they initially enquired, did they ask whether the puppy came with ANKC registration papers?

You just don't get it... but thank goodness I'll never be selling you a puppy... I think your ignorance on this topic leaves a lot of us much better off.

What a load of rubbish telling people that breeders who supply papers with their puppies are pet market suppliers...........where did you get that nonesence from People are complaining about not getting papers which is what the thread is all about

You like that BB? You like it when I pick out things and make sweeping statements and assumptions?

Good luck to you all... I'm out... I just thank doG BB isn't in my breed...

Mas - I hope that your friend gets their dogs papers soon. Even though I have been arguing for the breeder who doesn't supply papers with pups pick up, I do know what it is like to wait a few months for papers. Difference being, I knew that the breeder was breeding for themselves and that it was in their interest to register their litter... turns out there were difficulties with the names... another delay that can cause problems with supplying papers when they turn 8 weeks.

[Ozstar]

Heeeeyyyyy Take note of Tansy's breeding perception. Lovely post Tansy, nice to see some "ethical" breeders join the thread. The "ethics" to think about their buyers needs instead how everything effects them

How dare you say I am not an ethical breeder.

Until the day you walk in breeders shoes you should SHUT your mouth.

You don't breed therefore you have no say in how we breeders should do things.

You really have some nerve

here is just one letter of my many satisfied buyers who did not get their dogs papers till a few weeks after they had bought their pup

Firstly thank you so much for allowing my family to love the wonderful little dog, Fudge.” He is everything we had hoped for only better and your professionalism as a breeder is impeccable. We have told everyone we see how unbelievably clean and loved both your kennels and your dogs are and how great your puppy package was and appreciated. We appreciate your knowledge and guidance when we picked him up. Enough of the gush but I had to let you know that we are very impressed.

“Fudge” has settled in very well and has now had a change of batteries for the “Eveready Energizer bunny variety!” Lol. Yes I know you told us that. Right now he is having his nightly “skitz” and he is so funny. Yesterday his ears changed and got the “Stafford” crease in them. He has only had about 4 “accidents” and is toilet training well. He loves his toys especially his giant yellow duck that he is chewing right now. We are teaching him not to chew us so hard with his bloody sharp baby teeth!!! Ouch! He now only licks thank god but it is still a bit of a worry during his ‘skitz’ times. It is amazing just watching him discover new things. We just sit and watch and are continually captivated by his innocence. He is so strong already and it is so amazing how quickly he is changing everyday. He now plays for about an hour and a half straight and each time a little faster and adventurous. “Fudge” has no fear and loves to leap, much to our worry. So this means keeping a constant watch on him.

So far we have nearly worn out Louise’s camera and we have hundreds of photos of nearly every thing that has made us go “awwww.” I have sent some photo’s for you to keep track on how he is going. Sadly he sleeps in our bed but we are used to that…. I’ll personally be glad when he stops waking up at 2.00am for a “play” but he is so cute so we tolerate it gladly. The first night he was a bit unsettled so he slept on and off on my chest on the lounge till 4.00am. I think he liked the sound of my heartbeat or something like that.

He is so faithful and never lets us out of his sight. I love that and that was what I was hoping for. That was what I missed when lost “Bozley”. Please let me know what I have to do for this puppy show starting with the date and place so I can see what I can do to have our little dynamo ready to show what the “Ozstar” kennel is all about…. J

Enough of the dribble because we love him so much I will go on all night otherwise. We just simply want to say, from all of us here, a very, very sincere……………………THANK YOU

Leanne

Edited May 29, 2010 by Ozstar Kennels

[RallyValley]

I think we need to make a special topic for people who know everything and call it 'Puppy Buying for the Consumer Market' and the people there can just post thuer idealistic but unrealistic borderline insulting crap to themselves and anyone who cares and bit try to tarnish many highly respected breeders and excellent owners. The forum is for people who are above learning.

Also someone remind me how to block peoples posts again lest they decided to venture out if thief special forum and 'educate' us all.

[Black Bronson]

'Ozstar Kennels' date='30th May 2010 - 12:33 AM' post='4568667']

Heeeeyyyyy Take note of Tansy's breeding perception. Lovely post Tansy, nice to see some "ethical" breeders join the thread. The "ethics" to think about their buyers needs instead how everything effects them

How dare you say I am not an ethical breeder.

Until the day you walk in breeders shoes you should SHUT your mouth.

You don't breed therefore you have no say in how we breeders should do things.

You really have some nerve

I didn't say anyone in particular wasn't an ethical breeder, I made a comment about another breeders perception that I think is delightful. Sorry if my support of another breeders perceptions differ from yours, we can't all like the same things

Edited May 29, 2010 by Black Bronson

[stormie]

So now your judging and criticizing my relationship with my breeder? And calling me untrustworthy?

Orbit was papered accordingly - he was destined to be a pet so he was put on the limited register. Unlike you, I don't glorify papers. I have his pedigree there which proves he is pedigree. I didn't get him so I can stand on a mountain and wave his papers around to everyone to show how awesome my dog must be.

Main reg. means nothing in terms of quality. Perhaps I should show you some pics of some rescued Danes who were put on the Main reg.

I give up on this with you, BB. You're being nothing but insulting and self righteous.

[Jaxx'sBuddy]

Sadly, part of the reason I don't breed a lot and one of the reasons I almost stopped a few years ago was the sheer LACK of suitably qualified caring homes for puppies.

Unfortunately, when you have a breed like the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, everybody thinks that they should own one but the reality is that very few really are "right" for them.

My apologies to the GOOD pet owners and yes, I know they are out there but as a dog breeder, placing puppies in good homes, you are forced to kiss a heck of a lot of frogs before you find the princes!

understood, that is why i could never be a breeder and why i do have so much respect for the people who put their time, energy and emotion into giving me the joy in my life that comes from my dogs.

[Ashanali]

"Never argue with a fool, they will knock you down and beat you with experience."

Mas - I hope your friend gets their papers.

[Kadbury]

Once a decision is made on which pup the breeder is keeping, you can pay extra to get the pups registered within 24 hours.

Edited May 30, 2010 by Kadbury

[Troy]

The breeders who are posting in this thread have ethics and not sending papers to the puppy buyers probably wouldn't even come into their thinking.

From running this site though, I can see both sides of the coin. I deal with puppy buyers who have trouble getting papers for their puppy .... thankfully it doesn't happen often, but telling a puppy buyer that they are just one of the unlucky ones and should have done their research better doesn't help their situation. Not every puppy buyer is an expert and there are some bad breeders out there unfortunately. A flashy web site does wonders for credibility.

Black Bronson, whilst I agree with some of your statements, your comments that every puppy needs to go on the main register (and the buyer needs to get papers straight away) is misguided. It is quite normal to not get registration papers when collecting the puppy. If you do not agree with this then by all means keep searching for a breeder that will give you what you want but quit telling others that if they do not get papers straight away or get it on the main register, they have a bad breeder as this is not the case. Also not every buyer's motives are clear when purchasing a puppy and some can be good at deception (as many a breeder will tell you).

In the end, both sides just one want thing .... a good experience for both parties.

I will admit that due to the growth of our site over the past few years especially, we have had trouble keeping up with who is listing with us. We are currently doing a re-write of the backend code of our site to better help us monitor what is going on. This should have been finished at the start of the year, but obviously that didn't happen.

So as to not side-track this topic, I will start a topic in the next day or 2 to get some input from people here on what they would like to see us do.

Anyway can we quit with the arguing please.

[Bilbo Baggins]

I got my pups papers the day we collected him, he is on the limited register. If a breeder wants to they can then upgrade the dog to the main register.

Exactly Papers are better in the hand than chasing a breeder who's phone is disconnected

I agree and from his papers we can see who his parents are and that they have been hip scored etc, if you are not given those papers you have no proof of who the parents are etc. Personally i would not leave with the puppy if I didnt have the papers.

A GOOD breeder will have already given you a pedigree in lieu of the outstanding registration papers with a promise to forward the papers when they arrived from the controlling body. In addition, you would have had copies of parents hip scores and health testing ALREADY in a folder or booklet and THESE would have been given to a purchaser at the time the puppy left home.

For example. My litter of 9 Staffordshire Bull Terrier puppies started leaving home at the age of 10 weeks. Their registration papers were not back from the Tas Canine Association BUT they left home with a 50 page folder full of dietary information, a TEN generation pedigree, photocopies of their parents health tests, their microchipping paperwork and assorted other information. Their papers were forwarded as soon as they arrived back.

Does that make me a bad breeder? Or somebody who is deliberately withholding papers or do I hang onto the puppies until 13/14/15 weeks of age and THEN let them go to their new homes with their pedigree papers which are apparently THE most important thing about the puppy? I think not. Because if I hang onto my puppies for that long, the next thing you'll read is the new owner coming onto DOL (or similar forums) with behavioural problems because their puppy is no longer a malleable baby and they are having trouble trying to settle it into its new home.

Damned if you do or damned if you don't.

How long does it take for the papers to come back???. My puppy was registered on the 31st of March with Dogsvic and the papers were back by the 14th of April when collecting the puppy. That's 14 days on the outside, but you can't get it done in 10 weeks

I chose NOT to get it done in 10 weeks. I register everything except what I keep for myself on Limited Registration. They are my puppies and I choose what I keep first. I am in no particular hurry to get it done and as I have already said, ANKC rules say that it can be done up to 18 months of age. Either a puppy purchaser trusts me, or they go somewhere else. Simple as that.

Editing to add: And once again, as I have said from a previous thread. If you insist upon just selecting bits and pieces from people's responses, then please do them the courtesy of doing so in context rather than just selecting ONE sentence that appeals to you and ignoring the relevant information from around it.

You are being deliberately obtuse and it is very little wonder that your responses receive very little respect from other posters.

Argumentative for the sake of being argumentative.

Many have already explained that they do not register til the pups are of an age to make a final decision on what they are keeping.

So, I'm not the only one that whenever I see a post by BB, I roll my eyes?? .... and I don't mean you Bilbo Baggins ;)

;) ;) ;) ;) Thanks Dyz.