Is An American Staffordshire Terrier A Pitbull?

[APBT]

http://www.workingpitbull.com/amstaffpit2.html

[chrisjc]

what idiots do to cheat the law is up to them just because a council reg says amataff instead of pitbull doesnt mean they are the same dog.

too some people an amstaff is the same as a pitbull, as lopan said amstaffs were from the pitbull gene pool. but pitbulls are not amstaffs..

thats simple enough i think ive written my opinion on this subject about twenty times.

ADBA, American dog breeders assos.

AST, American staff terrier.

APBT, American pit bull terrier.

just to confuse you a bit more, my dogs ped doesnt have a single AST in it.

Some of the dogs in my dogs ped are in everysingle AST in existence if you can look back far enough, but 120years is a long time in dog years.

[jackie_a1]

I like the references on the second page about other similar dog breeds really interesting!

[jackie_a1]

The dog on the right is from Susan Butcher's yard. She won the Iditarod race four times. The dog on the left is an AKC Siberian husky. No serious racers use purebred AKC siberians anymore. The AKC huskies are pretty, but they are not as fast or tough as the dogs now called "Alaskan husky" to differentiate them. They show husky would be laughed off the sled dog track, the working husky would be thrown out of the show ring. Same breed?

I still think they are the same breed because technically they are, however they are just bred for different uses. Regardless of what they are able to do they are technically the same breed.

[tdierikx]

Different lines of a single breed... one is bred for "working" and the other for other things like showing and pets...

DNA results will be identical for both strains of the breed - but they are different in more ways than that...

T.

[BoStoNmAdNeSs]

An American Staffordshire Terrier is an American Pitbull Terrier. Anyone that says otherwise is wrong, it's not debatable.

They did not come from a "similar" gene pool, they came from the same gene pool. AST's were bred from pedigree APBT's and nothing else.

Also the AST has not been bred exclusively along AST lines for 75 years, its been bred that way for about 40 at best. The AKC re-opened its stud books to UKC APBT's as recently as 1973.

Are they the same breed ? The answer to that is "sometimes". That is, an American Staffordshire Terrier is an American Pitbull Terrier, but an American Pitbull Terrier is not necessarily an American Staffordshire Terrier.

Its actually not something that is up for 'vote' Facts are facts. Lo Pan pretty much hits the nail on the head here. If you're not discussing this issue in the same ballpark that Lo Pan is in - then you've probably got no idea on what you're talking about. Sorry, but dems da facts

[Bullbreedlover]

Its actually not something that is up for 'vote' Facts are facts. Lo Pan pretty much hits the nail on the head here. If you're not discussing this issue in the same ballpark that Lo Pan is in - then you've probably got no idea on what you're talking about. Sorry, but dems da facts

yep

[jackie_a1]

Tdier calling it a different line is much better than calling them completely separate breeds. A working german shepard of course is different to a show shep but are they not still GERMAN SHEPARDS? That's what I'm trying to say. Same breed different purpose.

[jackie_a1]

And Bully the vote was to see people's opinions and what they thought.

[TessiesTracey]

An American Staffordshire Terrier is an American Pitbull Terrier. Anyone that says otherwise is wrong, it's not debatable.

They did not come from a "similar" gene pool, they came from the same gene pool. AST's were bred from pedigree APBT's and nothing else.

Also the AST has not been bred exclusively along AST lines for 75 years, its been bred that way for about 40 at best. The AKC re-opened its stud books to UKC APBT's as recently as 1973.

Are they the same breed ? The answer to that is "sometimes". That is, an American Staffordshire Terrier is an American Pitbull Terrier, but an American Pitbull Terrier is not necessarily an American Staffordshire Terrier.

Its actually not something that is up for 'vote' Facts are facts. Lo Pan pretty much hits the nail on the head here. If you're not discussing this issue in the same ballpark that Lo Pan is in - then you've probably got no idea on what you're talking about. Sorry, but dems da facts

Well now I'm confused...was always under the impression that the AST was 'developed' from the SBT, as opposed to the APBT.

[Bullbreedlover]

Tdier calling it a different line is much better than calling them completely separate breeds. A working german shepard of course is different to a show shep but are they not still GERMAN SHEPARDS? That's what I'm trying to say. Same breed different purpose.

Same breed different purpose but still only one standard to breed to.

Exactly like the Kelpie where there are show kelpies and working kelpies. OK so the farmer doesnt give a rats arse about the Kennel Club standard per se but alot of people perseve them as being different dogs. They are not. They are one in the same or so they should be.

[jackie_a1]

Stonebridge well said here here.

That's pretty much what I gathered after reading the website he asks same breed? And I think? Ugh yes?

[bullyfan]

I agree with Lo Pan.

"In 1898 the United Kennel Club was formed with the express intent of providing registration and fighting guidelines for the now officially-named American Pit Bull Terrier. Later, those who wished to distance themselves from the fighting aspect of the breed petitioned the American Kennel Club for recognition of the Pit Bull so that it would be eligible for dog shows and other performance events. The AKC conceded in 1936 but only under the stipulation that the dogs registered with them be called "Staffordshire Terriers", the name of the province in England the breed supposedly originated in. Upon acceptance of the breed, many people dual-registered their dogs with both the AKC and the UKC."

Found somewhere on the world wide web, this would indicate they are the same.

[jackie_a1]

Ok so far 40% voted yes and 59% said no.

I actually voted yes. I think they are the same breed however like stated earlier they have different capabilities and purpose.

[Bullbreedlover]

Tdier calling it a different line is much better than calling them completely separate breeds. A working german shepard of course is different to a show shep but are they not still GERMAN SHEPARDS? That's what I'm trying to say. Same breed different purpose.

Same breed different purpose but still only one standard to breed to.

Exactly like the Kelpie where there are show kelpies and working kelpies. OK so the farmer doesnt give a rats arse about the Kennel Club standard per se but alot of people perseve them as being different dogs. They are not. They are one in the same or so they should be.

Not meaning to highjack the thread but I am totally aghast sometimes in regards to the Kelpie standard. The standard calls for a ruff aroud the neck and a brush tail. totally essential for the Kelpie in the outback and regions of NZ for keeping themselves warm. Yet in many many Kelpies both working and show there is very very little ruff or brush tail

Anyways back on topic now

[jackie_a1]

Stone you can rail road the thread a bit I give you permission

Do you have pics of the difference? I actually didn't know it existed.

[Sandra777]

Confused

where does Amstaff and SBT come into it?

I made a comparison between the SBT and BULL TERRIER not Amstaff.

[HeavyPaws]

I cannot make an informed or accurate vote on this, but I can say that I've met two purebred APBT imported from the states, and they were adorable, fantastic dogs.

My range of experience with American Staffordshire Terriers and Staffordshire Bull Terriers is limited to the god-only-knows-what "pure" mutts that people buy in droves from the Trading Post. I see a wide range of "proper" sizes, shapes, colours and temperament in these dogs, so it's hard for me, and probably the rest of the public, to distinguish between the APBT, AST and SBT.

I have never met a AST or SBT that was bred by a real breeder {and here 'real' means responsible, registered, and conforming to the breed standard}, which to me is a real shame.

I am, however, interested in learning the difference between these dogs, meeting purebred examples of the last two, reading into each breed's history and then making an informed decision based on that.

[GoldenGirl85]

Confused

where does Amstaff and SBT come into it?

I made a comparison between the SBT and BULL TERRIER not Amstaff.

Lol, Im even more confused now!!!

I think I might say bye bye to this thread seeing as I dont have anything worthwhile to contribute and go and snuggle with my GR LMAO

[Monah]

No..

Almost like saying a Vizla is a Wei.

They look extremely similar just different colours.

Completely different in size and many many other areas too. Origins, country, temperament, EVERYTHING.

I voted Yes, although I have to admit to knowing nothing about these breeds apart from knowing several amstaffs and having 2 pitbulls as neighbours (yes, they are not allowed here).

I'm a bit confused too as to how staffords and bull terriers came up in the topic. but obviously I've missed something.

;)