Fight!

[jackie_a1]

Hey Kirs,

Hope your girls are alright, I know how bad it can be first hand.

Lucky and Razor were both entire males and lived happily and without aggression for a while but every few months (it became weeks as Lucky deteriorated) they would get into a massive blue. Lucky weighed 65 kilos and was a dane x cane corso and Razor is a bullmastiff x pitt so imagine my face when they would snap.

It would always be without warning and Lucky would react. Razor was highly food aggressive (towards Lucky) and would growl if Lucky came to close to his food whilst he was eating. Razor would just growl with no intention to react but Lucky (who was also dog aggressive) every now and again would snap and it happened so quickly. They always used to have little tiffs whilst Razor was a puppy and it was nothing but Lucky turning Razor on his back and standing over him but as Razor became an adult he began to fight back which escalated the situation.

Razor and Lucky would fight and to my neighbours it must have sounded like I owned a dog pitt because it would just be savage growling and blood flying everywhere. Lucky would always get Razor on his front legs (and he has permanent scars from it ) and Razor would just go straight for Lucky's face. It would always last 20 - 30 seconds because I ALWAYS intervene. If I didn't they'd both be wrecks, normally the hose was enough to stop them.

The worst injury Razor ever had was a chunk of skin on his eye lid missing a cut nose, and one of the bites on his leg got a bit infected but (I do vet nursing) nothing I couldn't patch up myself. Luckily I've never had to plan a trip to the vets because of their fighting. I don't believe in letting them fight it out. Not at all.

I always supervised eating, always fed them very far apart and always ensured whilst getting bones and treats that they didn't invade each others space however the big fights would always happen when I went back inside and would have to run outside like a mad woman.

The first time I was in shock and shaken up and was quite slow to react but as it happened a little more regularly I made sure to intervene promptly.

I never seperated my dogs after the fight, after I patched them up Lucky would walk over to Razor and lick the blood off him and groom him then they'd snuggle together and go to bed.

[Whipitgood]

Whippets are supposed to be gentle and most of the time they are but when these two go off, they're like bloody chainsaws.

Bloody whippet bitches!!

I can sympathise, i have an alpha bitch here who is dominant over bitches and dogs, shes such a gorgeous gentle thing but can be such a cow sometimes! She has injured my boy after a big bust up, my future star in the ring that ive had to pull out of showing for the past 4 months because it looks like his stifle is permanatly injured. :D

Its amazing how quick they can turn. Hope your girls recover well. Trouble is, once two of them start, its often really hard to break that habit and tension between them.

EDT: i just could not imagine standing by and letting 2 dogs sort it out for themselves. There is no way i would let it go on - i too would immediately separate them and if clobbering them with a cobweb broom does the job then so be it!

Edited May 16, 2010 by Whipitgood

[Black Bronson]

Females fighting don't always get over it. They are worse than males.

Correct from my experiences. Male's will generally fit in with the order of dominance and live with it

[Kirislin]

Hmmmm Penny needs some good healing vibes, she's still not too good, she cant jump up or down off the bed and whimpers when I pick her up. They kept themselves quiet yesterday and I decided to just let them rest but I am getting a bit concerned now. I have my suspicions as to what it might be but I'll let the vet figure it out.

[Daisy]

Sending healing vibes for Penny, hope she is feeling better soon

I hate it when the dogs fight, I think it upsets me more than them. Although I understand about the two bitches thing, and I normally have mostly boys here without many problems other than the occasional scuffle, two of my own dogs (as opposed to fosters) do not get on, and they are two males. It is actually only one of them that causes the problems, so after a few serious incidents, they are kept completely seperated all the time. Yes it is a pain, but I was worried that he might eventually inflict some very serious injuries if not kill my other dog ;)

[whippets]

I don't like putting bitches together. I kennel mine dog + bitch. 2 bitches together is just a disaster waiting to happen.

Not always, I had 2 before these, Kiri and Iris and they never fought, Kiri was clearly the top girl and Iris was happy with the arrangement and never challenged her. They were great mates, always playing together and snuggled up together when they slept.

Most of the time the time Penny and Kibah are OK but I have to watch them and avoid situations that might cause a fight. I just lapsed a bit last night. I've just gone out and brought Kibah in, she's been in the car all this time but now I've crated her. I'll be keeping them both apart or on leads for the next little while to see how they are together.

not always? but it did happen didn't it.

What's done is done, your posts of "I never..." really aren't of any help are they?

Kirislin - I hope the girls will be ok, just watch for fluid building up under the skin (on the girls neck you think might be bruised) and Pers's suggestion of a hottie each and something sweet to drink is a good one ;)

I hope apart from being a little sore and sorry for themselves that tomorrow brings some calm.

From the breeds I have had, JRT's, Newfs, Greys and whippets. I have found, in my experience, that females together is the worst combination you can get. They are worse than having 2 males.

And yes it is of help if someone else can learn from that. As others have already said with bitches together.

[Loving my Oldies]

Hmmmm Penny needs some good healing vibes, she's still not too good, she cant jump up or down off the bed and whimpers when I pick her up. They kept themselves quiet yesterday and I decided to just let them rest but I am getting a bit concerned now. I have my suspicions as to what it might be but I'll let the vet figure it out.

Very gentle strokes for Penny and good vibes for her quick recovery.

[mita]

I have found, in my experience, that females together is the worst combination you can get.

Some of my females have been real steel magnolias. Beautiful, sweet, loving.....& not looking for trouble.

BUT when they wanted to stand on their dig....they turned into fierce little dragons. Didn't happen often.

With Angel the tib, she spent her whole life being an angel.

UNTIL she beat up a fat Corgi girl named Victoria who growled at her when she went to drink from a water bowl at a Blessings of the Animals church service. And when our big sheltie girl nicked her treat....Angel launched herself at her & grabbed her by the lip. Both our shelties were wary of her, from then on.

A couple of others have been steel magnolias, too. But the combination seems to depend if the 2nd girl is 'softer' & doesn't push the boundaries.

One of the breeders told me that when the girls decide to fight....they mean it with a passion. With the boys, there's a lot of shadow boxing.

[Kirislin]

From the breeds I have had, JRT's, Newfs, Greys and whippets. I have found, in my experience, that females together is the worst combination you can get. They are worse than having 2 males.

And yes it is of help if someone else can learn from that. As others have already said with bitches together.

I've had whippets for 25 years now and 23 of them have been with bitches together, so I'd say I am reasonably experienced.

My poor Penny as I suspected, has a cracked rib, and yes I take the blame for it, ;) but thankfully even the vet agreed that I did what I needed to do at the time, if I'd left them to sort it out, I would have been digging holes right now. They were completely oblivious to me, my shouting and my clobbering at the time, just goes to show what adrenaline does. I am sorry dearest Penny that I broke you. She's been prescribed some painkillers and rest for the next 2 weeks.

[persephone]

Oops- poor penny As you said tho- it would have been worse if left - Don't blame yourself- adrenaline does make us do things we wouldn't normally .

[Aziah]

I don't like putting bitches together. I kennel mine dog + bitch. 2 bitches together is just a disaster waiting to happen.

Not always, I had 2 before these, Kiri and Iris and they never fought, Kiri was clearly the top girl and Iris was happy with the arrangement and never challenged her. They were great mates, always playing together and snuggled up together when they slept.

Most of the time the time Penny and Kibah are OK but I have to watch them and avoid situations that might cause a fight. I just lapsed a bit last night. I've just gone out and brought Kibah in, she's been in the car all this time but now I've crated her. I'll be keeping them both apart or on leads for the next little while to see how they are together.

not always? but it did happen didn't it.

What's done is done, your posts of "I never..." really aren't of any help are they?

Kirislin - I hope the girls will be ok, just watch for fluid building up under the skin (on the girls neck you think might be bruised) and Pers's suggestion of a hottie each and something sweet to drink is a good one

I hope apart from being a little sore and sorry for themselves that tomorrow brings some calm.

From the breeds I have had, JRT's, Newfs, Greys and whippets. I have found, in my experience, that females together is the worst combination you can get. They are worse than having 2 males.

And yes it is of help if someone else can learn from that. As others have already said with bitches together.

So has anyone in the game long enough (ie. Kirislin)...she's not an uneducated novice...

Most of us have had bitches that will fight no need to roll your eyes at me! I've had some bitches who've had a fight and can be put together again and others who haven't been able to go back to that happy medium.

[wolfgirl]

I have run many bitches together over the years, in all that time we had one fight only between mother and daughter and with strong leadership they bonded back together and ran together for many years to come.

Not all bitches can be run together, it depends.

Sorry haven't read the whole thread but just wanting to send more healing vibes as it's a horrible situation to go through

[OSoSwift]

Kirislin - don't beat yoruself up too much. You would never hurt her deliberately. I

would also do what it took to get them apart. When my Dobe bitches had their one and only blue I knew that the younger one was out to kill the older one. Luckily running at them at top speed and swearing at them seemed to somehow sink in and they parted long enough to give the young one a good kick up the bum and put her in the dog run.

The older one luckily was wearing a coat with an extended neck so the rabid throat tearing was not very successful. Ther was many holes in the dog coat and some holes in the dog.

I would NEVER let them fight it out. Result would have been one dead dog.

Rommi is on light duties and because it was cold I left Rommi at home and only took Lewis to dog training. SHe is Alpha bitch and she tried to pin his ears back shortly after we got home. It was immediately stopped and they have been fine together. I do not leave them together when I am not here due to her dusting him up when I put them in the dog run together.

[poodlefan]

Kirislin:

My poor Penny as I suspected, has a cracked rib, and yes I take the blame for it, but thankfully even the vet agreed that I did what I needed to do at the time, if I'd left them to sort it out, I would have been digging holes right now. They were completely oblivious to me, my shouting and my clobbering at the time, just goes to show what adrenaline does. I am sorry dearest Penny that I broke you. She's been prescribed some painkillers and rest for the next 2 weeks.

Better one dog with a cracked rib than the other dog dead.

Shit happens and 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing. My guess is this won't happen again because you won't let it.

[Kirislin]

thanks again for understanding. You're right, I would never hurt my dogs intentionally. Penny is alot happier now the pain meds have kicked in.

I was telling a friend about it and she said tell Penny to take up knitting because she is much too old to be brawling and picking fights.

[persephone]

tell Penny to take up knitting because she is much too old to be brawling and picking fights.

here are our two old bags who fight.... half asleep on 'their chairs' Butter wouldn't melt.....

[Kirislin]

tell Penny to take up knitting because she is much too old to be brawling and picking fights.

here are our two old bags who fight.... half asleep on 'their chairs' Butter wouldn't melt.....

Oh come on now, those sweet old things?

[OSoSwift]

thanks again for understanding. You're right, I would never hurt my dogs intentionally. Penny is alot happier now the pain meds have kicked in.

I was telling a friend about it and she said tell Penny to take up knitting because she is much too old to be brawling and picking fights.

hmmm a knitting dog that I would like to see!

Yes hindsight is a wonderful thing. People think quite often I am over cautious. BUt I have lived with bitches that have a contract on each others heads so I know just how bad it can get.

PF is right, better a bitch with a broken rib, than dead, because that is quite possible what may have happened.

I am quite sure that it will never have the chance to occur again as to have dogs intently trying to kill each other is a scene and sound you will never forget and you will make damn sure it never happens again.

Rommi and Lewis send gentle Whippet hugs to all of you.

[Clyde]

Shit happens and 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing. My guess is this won't happen again because you won't let it.

Yep, exactly.

Hope she's feeling better soon Kirisln.

[KnucklesDutchnUs]

Kirislin.

I really feel for you mate, stuff like this put's you on edge for days / weeks afterwards.

Our two have had a few scraps.

I have not read through every page of this thread and I appologise if this has been covered or you already know it.

We are lucky in that in our scraps we know that if we remove Dutch, Knuckles will back off and wants no part in carrying on. The best way we have found of breaking them up is to grab Dutch by the back legs / hips and drag him backwards.

I'm pretty sure there was some threads on here about breaking up fights by pulling apart backwards, there was some great strategies for dealing with fights single handed aswell.

Cheers

Bob