A Small Tiff In The Off-leash Park

[Pollywaffle]

I guess you've got to see both sides..we have two small dogs and our little boy was attacked (5 years ago now) in a dog park by a larger dog..so that has made us rather unsettled and so we would probably react as this man did. No reflection on your lovely dog, but an understandable reaction.

[Simply Grand]

I don't have a problem in general with other dogs running up to my small dog, even if they are bigger than him but like GG85 said, I do tend to step in front of my dog and block the bigger dog to slow it down before it actually reaches mine. It also depends on the body language the approaching dog is displaying, and how I've seen it interacting with other dogs.

After a couple of bad experiences with bigger dogs at the dog park - one of which was a big dog puppy getting carried away with playing, and the other an aggressive dog going for other dogs all over the place, including mine - I am now quite wary, and would put the safety of my dog above anything else. Picking him up would be a last resort and I don't think I would have done it in these circumstances, but sometimes it's the only way to quickly get them out of reach of another dog.

Like you've said, you probably would have been better calling him back in this instance, and you're working on getting him reliably responding to you calling him off but in the mean time don't take if personally if a small dog owner gets worried!

[DerRottweiler]

There is no guarantee, particularly when it comes to survival instincts and the fight or flight mechanism.

You could go as far as saying that it is highly unlikely....and that is it.

[Simply Grand]

The woman immediately picked up the swf (that was growling and barking at Archie),

There are a million and one threads here about people going to off-leash parks and other dogs running up into their dogs faces while the owner says "Oh but he's friendly". Those threads never end well, regardless of the dog's intentions.

I'm interested in this, and taking it ever so slightly off thread, does anyone here believe there is no way in the world their dog would not attack (ie provoke an attack) another dog ? I am pretty sure most of us feel like we know our dogs well enough to say that it would simply never happen to us. Put it this way, there aren't too many threads on DOL of dog owners who come in to tell stories of their dog ripping apart another. That said, we'd kinda like to assume that people who let their aggressive dogs off lead with awful outcomes, never thought their dog would attack either.

So, given our dogs are animals, do you feel that you could 100% guarantee your dog would never provoke an attack on another in 'everyday' circumstances (ie no injury, bitch on heat, bitch defending pups, whatever) ? Or perhaps it's not that simple.

I think it is possible to be extremely confident that your dog would never provoke an attack under everyday circumstances, but I wouldn't trust someone else telling me that about their dog, no matter how sure they were!

I would only trust my own judgement once I know the dog well.

Also, small dogs can get hurt accidently by big dogs who are just playing and mean no harm at all.

[Erny]

My boy's approach and greeting to other dogs is inappropriate/provocative. He's a work in progress and when I'm out we're training all the time for this. I pick and chose my times for going down to off-lead parks (he needs to stretch his legs).

At a big park (lots of space) a number of weeks back. I see a lady with her dog headed in my direction. I put my boy on lead and I moved around and away and took up another spot a good distance away (with a lake in between us) before I let him off lead again. This is good, because I know I can work with my dog, keep him focussed on what we're doing, yet helping his training by doing so in the proximity of other/another dog/s. I see the lady looking at us from afar and figure it was pretty obvious I was keeping my distance. I also knew that she'd seen me clip my dog to lead when she first came towards us. I continue working with my dog, off-lead, practising recalls in between releases and him minding own business, sniffing etc.

Lady continues around the lake - that's ok, she's entitled to and is probably doing 'laps' which many people and their dogs do at this park. So I move again. This time, right away from the lake and up to a soccer field - about 50 - 75 metres out of the road. Again - I saw the lady keep glancing in my direction and knew that it was pretty obvious we were moving out of the way. I don't think it was unrealistic of me to expect that she should observe and respect the fact that I wanted distance between us.

I'm working on this field - this time I was doing 'heel' work, as well as sit/stay, drop/stay and the like. I had kept up the occasional glance to check for the proximity of this lady and her dog, but saw nothing. I'm in the middle of the field. There is a heap of alternative exits from this park and PLENTY of space. I had my back turned, working with my boy. I saw my boy's body language change. I glanced around and saw this lady walking straight towards me in her exit from the park. Her dog was at least 25 - 30 metres ahead of her. As I was grabbing my lead and clipping it to my dog's collar, I called out, asking her to call her dog back. (I hate having to call out to people for this, because I know that me yelling out isn't helping the calmness I'm trying to train my dog to.) I wanted to be in a position where I had control of my dog before they got any closer. There is no aggression from my dog, but I am trying to train him to not be so intense in his urge to get to other dogs - it's way too intense. I could see her dog was friendly and placid enough - but that's not the point.

I got no response from this lady and she kept following her dog (who had continued towards and straight to us). My boy was already bouncing to the end of his lead and I was trying to grab a quick moment to be able to secure the lead to my hands to better give me the control I needed. I know I can control him, I just needed the opportunity to gain my balance.

I called out again to this lady to please recall her dog. (If she was ok with the dogs meeting, that would've been fine, but I wanted, for my dog's training sake, to do it in a more controlled fashion - calmly and slowly).

No answer.

By this stage, too late. Her dog was right with us by now. The lady caught up. I said (breathlessly) "I asked you to recall your dog".

Her response? "My dog doesn't have a recall when he's around other dogs, so I don't bother."

Be it not for her (even knowing this) to clip her own dog to the lead before it had got to the point of her dog leaving her behind and out of reach.

Unfortunately, this is the underlying attitude of many people in off-lead parks, whether they admit it or not.

Not suggesting that's the case for you, Mrs TS - you're obviously conscious of working to attain the level of control you need. One of the points is that if our dogs are in training for what we want as appropriate greetings and recall control, then we need to be in a position to be able to control the dog and insist on the command response by at the least clipping dogs back on lead or long-line in advance when we know that the control is unreliable and working to the appropriate response before we then reward our dogs and then let them greet, play etc. with other dogs. Every time people lose control, they are teaching their dogs that ignoring/not complying is ok and is in many instances self-rewarding.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Erny

[corvus]

I think this so-called "effective control" is a bit improbable. I mean, how can you ever guarantee that level of control? Given we were just talking in the training thread about the impossibility of 100% recalls. Dogs are living creatures with minds and wills all of their own. Without restraint they can and will do what they please. It's not easy to gain good control of them in that state, and if that rule were enforced I think dog parks would be pretty empty. My boys can be a tad unpredictable in their greetings. I would say at least 90% of the time they trot up nice and polite and greet like model dog park citizens. Occasionally they trot up nice and polite and suddenly get excited and bound the last couple of metres. What do you do? Call 'em back and they come, but they've already done their bounding. If they know the dog they tend to charge right up to them and barely pause to touch noses before they get playing. That's okay, we know the owners and they know our dogs and everyone is okay with that. Sometimes the boys will be playing their own game and unexpectedly swing their game right into another dog they were not paying attention to. What do you do? Apologise. Yeah, if I'd seen that coming I would have called them and they probably would have come away, but I didn't see it coming. I'm not prescient.

When it comes down to it, I apologise pretty regularly. Because even though my dogs are pretty sensible greeters, and even though they come when called, I don't always foresee what's about to happen and I can't do anything about it once it's happened except apologise. I often err on the side of caution and call them away from small dogs because they are big and scary. But then, some of their best friends are small dogs. I find that people are generally pretty forgiving and polite if you apologise. I'll ask if I should put mine back on leash and I take any form of hesitation as a "yes". I think you just do the best you can to keep your dogs from upsetting other people and dogs. "Control" is a fallacy with animals. The only way you will ever be sure to have control is to keep them restrained. And even then....

[Loving my Oldies]

Everyone has said good and sensible things.

I would just like to add that it is not so much that a dog mightn't be friendly, it is simply the size difference that can be a problem. A little dog can be so easily injured by a much larger dog who just wants to play.

Older happy and friendly dogs seem to intuitively know how to play with different dogs, but a young boisterous Labrador wouldn't .

It is also pretty instinctive for people with small dogs to pick them up in a situation where they believe their dog is in danger .......

I know when I first had two little Maltese, I viewed every other dog as a potential killer. :D I was amazingly ignorant. Luckily there was an offleash park close to where I lived and I soon learned to relax - ummm a little bit. No amount of reading prepares you for the real thing.

[Quickasyoucan]

Unfortunately the behaviour you describe from your lab is exactly what is repeated time over at dog parks. As Erny said dogs are supposed to be under effective control in a dog park and that means not bothering other dogs or people trying to enjoy the park regardless of how friendly your dog is.

The other persons reaction might have been a little over the top but you do not know what experience they have had previously. Also if your dog is getting growled at by other dogs for his behaviour you are putting him at risk of being attacked. Plenty of dogs resent over-enthusiastic intrusions into their personal space, why run the risk.

It is good that you are questioning it but perhaps practising your recall is a good idea so that you can guage an owner/dog's eagerness to play first and then everyone is happy. Its a bit like kids asking before they can pat a dog.

Not everyone goes to the off leash to have their dog play with others, some go so their dog can chase balls, to train under distraction etc, not every dog has to play with other dogs, but owners are limited in where they can exercise their dogs off leash and not everyone has the benefit of acreage to run on.

On a legal note you should also be aware that "attack" as defined by law includes chasing, rushing or harrassing any animal or person other than vermin. I have heard of a case of a dogbeing declared dangerous for simply jumping up on the wrong person or chasing someones cat up a tree. Better to be safe than sorry and train good behaviours into your dog.

[Paulp]

Just re read your post, if you are in a signed off lead area, especially if there are already several dogs off lead, then I would say it is up to the people entering with thier dog if they want to interact with the dogs already there, if they don't then they shouldn't enter.

Technically, this is not right. Although admittedly it is the current days' common consensus of opinion by most of those who take their dogs and use the off-lead areas for exactly that purpose. But effective control is what each and everyone of them is supposed to have before they exercise the privilege of being allowed to let their dogs off-lead. Unfortunately, because so many people have the attitude of "if you don't want dogs running over to you in an off-lead area then don't come here" it's too hard to battle it without risking it being at the expense of their own dog's safety and that's exactly what a lot of people who are conscientious about the problems that can and do occur at off-lead parks do - they don't go. Even though they too are entitled to their share of the park and peaceable enjoyment of it.

You are right, should have thought more first (a new baby in the house is messing with my head), it is really up to all parties to respect the rights of all at off lead areas, at BODC we have given priority to small dogs in one of our off lead areas on club days because an area full of big dogs puts off small dog owners from entering when they have just as much right to use the areas.

[Erny]

I think this so-called "effective control" is a bit improbable. I mean, how can you ever guarantee that level of control?

My strongest argument is that people take that attitude of "improbability" and chose to do nothing about it to improve it. So as far as I'm concerned, your comment above isn't really relevant. It's a defeatest statement used to support counter-argument to what I'm saying here. That's blunt Corvus, and not just because it is you. I'd say the same to anyone who would have written that. I mean no personal offence by it but that, IMO, is the fact of it. Most of the lack of control we commonly see at off-lead parks CAN be improved. It's because people either don't recognise or recognise and don't want to make the effort to improve the weak areas of their dog's training, that improvement is not gained. They "excuse" it.

I have enormous recall control with my dog, even around other dogs. Its the other dogs in the park that don't, that cause the problems.

When it comes down to it, I apologise pretty regularly. Because even though my dogs are pretty sensible greeters, and even though they come when called, I don't always foresee what's about to happen and I can't do anything about it once it's happened except apologise.

If you feel the need to apologise "pretty regularly" then it indicates to me something is amiss. Things do happen - we like to think we have eyes in the backs of our heads, but we don't. But for these "unforeseen" incidents to be occurring on a regular basis, something isn't quite right.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Erny

[jacqui835]

The woman immediately picked up the swf (that was growling and barking at Archie),

There are a million and one threads here about people going to off-leash parks and other dogs running up into their dogs faces while the owner says "Oh but he's friendly". Those threads never end well, regardless of the dog's intentions.

I'm interested in this, and taking it ever so slightly off thread, does anyone here believe there is no way in the world their dog would not attack (ie provoke an attack) another dog ? I am pretty sure most of us feel like we know our dogs well enough to say that it would simply never happen to us. Put it this way, there aren't too many threads on DOL of dog owners who come in to tell stories of their dog ripping apart another.

So, given our dogs are animals, do you feel that you could 100% guarantee your dog would never provoke an attack on another in 'everyday' circumstances (ie no injury, bitch on heat, bitch defending pups, whatever) ? Or perhaps it's not that simple.

I feel I could bet my life on my dog never starting a fight. But, that's not to say that I don't think he would ever attack another dog, or even a person. He has had dogs try and and attack him, and whilst he defers to me, I know that if I wasn't there, or couldn't solve the problem, he would defend himself. Dogs, and particularly small ones have pulled on their leads, snarling at him and I can get him to ignore that, but the truth is, if a dog launched a serious attack at either me or him, I think there would be a good chance he'd attack back, and probably cause some serious damage. He is a doberman, and one from working lines at that. He has had extensive training and that continues every day, but he is protective and confident and he doesn't back down or show submission or fear to aggressive dogs or people, he will just follow my lead.

"That said, we'd kinda like to assume that people who let their aggressive dogs off lead with awful outcomes, never thought their dog would attack either." - this has not been my experience. Anytime in all of my years of keeping a dog (which has been my whole life) when a dog has attacked, the owner has known their dog was this way inclined. They have excuses of course, but it's never been the first time. Most of the stories on these threads seem to indicate the same.

[Danois]

It's about respecting other peoples right to use the same space as you - not everyone wants big dogs bounding up to their small ones and this is where you have to bomb proof the recall.

It also means paying complete attention to your dog at all times - and this is where most people in dog parks fall down. Too busy chatting away without regard to their dog's behaviour.

I have a giant breed and took him to the park yesterday. He had a lot of pent up energy as he'd not had much of a walk in the last couple of days and we were over to the side where no other dogs were (only 3 small dogs in the big park). I kept Boo to the side and let him run around. One of the small dogs came over towards us so I recalled Boo and clipped on the lead (knowing he'd be too boisterous). Dog lost interest and went away. Let Boo off. Little dog came back so I clipped Boo on lead again and walked further away. Happened one more time too before I decided to leave the park.

Owner paid no attention to the fact that I clearly did not want her dog interacting with Boo and made no attempt to recall it to leave us alone. Was quite frustrating.

ETA re the side question - I am very confident that my dog would never start a fight. Even when other dogs have had a go at him, if offlead, he runs rather than defending himself - and this is a 2 year old entire male.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Danois

[Greytmate]

Just got back from a walk in the off-leash park. It's normally rather chaotic but I have never seen any aggro outside a few growls and warnings.

My boy is a 1yo lab, so quite big (not quite fully grown) and bouncy but well behaved generally. He bounces up to everyone (dogs) and crouches wagging tail like mad until they sniff him. The reaction can then be anything to more sniffs to immediate play fighting depending on other dogs' reactions. He has been 'warned' plenty of times by dogs big and small and backs off every time.

Couple walking their small white, maybe maltese (not tiny weeny, although small). Archie bounded up, and he does bound, so 30kgs is quite a sight to people who don't know him. The woman immediately picked up the swf (that was growling and barking at Archie), while I was constantly reassuring both wife and hubby that Archie would absolutely not hurt him at all, he's completely harmless. Archie also responds well to 'gentle' when he's playing with smaller dogs and once he reaches them, will definitely slow down / back off. Husband said very roughly "he is going for our dog", I replied "no I promise you he's not, he is totally friendly" .... and he made some other rude comment about how Archie was stressing everyone in the dog park despite there being plenty of dogs his size and bigger romping around. Arch tried to play with a few other little ones and was fine, owners reactions ranged from smiling to one who called their dog away and Archie moved on.

Should I really put him on leash in these circumstances, given owners are all so different ?

I was really tempted to say to this bloke "the only person that's stressing is you and you're passing that straight on to your dog, especially by lifting him up". But I can obviously understand his concern for his dog's wellbeing and uncertainty about a big bouncy boy.

Archie doesn't back off every time then.

I don't know that I would describe a dog that is bounding towards a growling dog as 'friendly'. To me, friendly interaction is where both dogs are equally willing to play.

[Erny]

You are right, should have thought more first (a new baby in the house is messing with my head), it is really up to all parties to respect the rights of all at off lead areas ...

Thank you Paulp.

I think "baby brain" can be excused :D.

[labsrule]

The woman immediately picked up the swf (that was growling and barking at Archie),

There are a million and one threads here about people going to off-leash parks and other dogs running up into their dogs faces while the owner says "Oh but he's friendly". Those threads never end well, regardless of the dog's intentions.

I'm interested in this, and taking it ever so slightly off thread, does anyone here believe there is no way in the world their dog would not attack (ie provoke an attack) another dog ? I am pretty sure most of us feel like we know our dogs well enough to say that it would simply never happen to us. Put it this way, there aren't too many threads on DOL of dog owners who come in to tell stories of their dog ripping apart another. That said, we'd kinda like to assume that people who let their aggressive dogs off lead with awful outcomes, never thought their dog would attack either.

So, given our dogs are animals, do you feel that you could 100% guarantee your dog would never provoke an attack on another in 'everyday' circumstances (ie no injury, bitch on heat, bitch defending pups, whatever) ? Or perhaps it's not that simple.

With Fitzy my beloved lab boy I lost last year, I would have to say yes absolutely 100%. Never ever had any issues with him with other dogs, kids or humans. In fact I got told by a few dog owners during his lifetime that we encountered on our walks, parks, beaches etc that he was either the only dog or one of a very select few that their dogs would allow anywhere near them. He was an extremely friendly, outgoing and very happy dog and loved every dog and human he met and they reciprocated He has been the best natured dog I have owned and I think my current pup, Tana is following in his footsteps .

As for my current boys, Thomas my 14 yr old who I adopted 4 yrs ago, absolutely 100% as well as he is the most placid, gentle, friendly dog you could ever meet and wouldn't harm a fly and would never ever be provoked. Tournie my soon to be 12 yr old who I adotped 2 yrs ago, on the other hand is not very tolerant of other dogs and there is no way I would take him to an offleash dog park and I only let him offlead during his walks when there are no other dogs around. He is extremely protective of me and resource guards me, so I don't put him in stressful situations around other dogs and we keep our distance from them during walks.

My pup Tana is a typical Lab pup, but he is not over the top with other dogs and I take him to a dog park once or twice a week and the other dogs, both large and small actually rush him and jump all over him. I am pretty tolerant with other dogs with him, but I do keep a watchful eye and whenever I see he is being harrassed by an overzealous dog then I will step in and call him over and so does the owner of any dog that may be harrassing him. My pup has extremely good recall for such a youngster, so he reliably comes to me everytime I call him, sometimes with other dogs in tow :D All the other dog owners at this park also keep a watchful eye on their dogs as well . As he is only a pup I can't yet guarantee him 100%, but he is such a typical friendly, extremely good natured pup with fantastic bite inhibition (i.e. has never nipped at all throughout his puppyhood), and not over the top with other dogs, I seriously doubt he would provoke an attack. I am actually off in a few mins to take him to this park

[Paulp]

The woman immediately picked up the swf (that was growling and barking at Archie),

There are a million and one threads here about people going to off-leash parks and other dogs running up into their dogs faces while the owner says "Oh but he's friendly". Those threads never end well, regardless of the dog's intentions.

I'm interested in this, and taking it ever so slightly off thread, does anyone here believe there is no way in the world their dog would not attack (ie provoke an attack) another dog ? I am pretty sure most of us feel like we know our dogs well enough to say that it would simply never happen to us. Put it this way, there aren't too many threads on DOL of dog owners who come in to tell stories of their dog ripping apart another. That said, we'd kinda like to assume that people who let their aggressive dogs off lead with awful outcomes, never thought their dog would attack either.

So, given our dogs are animals, do you feel that you could 100% guarantee your dog would never provoke an attack on another in 'everyday' circumstances (ie no injury, bitch on heat, bitch defending pups, whatever) ? Or perhaps it's not that simple.

I don't think either of my two would agressively instigate a fight but by their nature they could and, if I'm not careful, do push other dogs too far and get an aggressive response (it is hard to get through their thick heads that not all other dogs are labs). My female will just back away if this happens, my male will initially back away but if the other dog presses the issue he will respond. For this reason I rarely let them both off lead at the same time in the presence of other dogs and recall them if I feel they are getting too boisterous (or just take them home if the arousal level of all the dogs is getting too high). If I see another dog getting in their face then I leash and take them away before the situation gets out of control. Fights can and do happen and it is often not as simple as saying that a specific dog started it, the causative factors are often complex and interactive so it is up to each owner to manage their dog to prevent arousal levels increasing to the point where you get a fight. Unfortunately many owners are insensitive to their dogs arousal levels, don't recognise the signs, or just don't care.

[Turkey Trip]

I don't normally comment in these threads but..

Erny thank you for your contributions and I hope many dog owners are reading them and taking in what you are saying.

I have lived and interacted with dogs all my life. When did it become fashionable for dog owners to allow their dog to run up to strange dogs and people and harass them without either their invitation or permission?

Other dogs and their owners, off or particularly on leash should be able to enjoy the their walk and the ambiance and open space of a park without having to fend off unwanted loose dogs running over, off-lead and completely NOT under the control of their minder. Off lead does not mean out of control.

If you are there with a group of dog owners and you all agree that your dogs can play together off lead, then fine. However, do not allow your dog to bound up to other dogs and people you do not know, uninvited. This is plainly irresponsible and you and your dog are entertaining yourself at the expense of someone' else's enjoyment of their walk. Not good etiquette.

Other dogs are not there for the entertainment of your own. If you or your dog want to interact, then please ASK the other owner's first.

If I can relate an incident from yesterday. Husband and I are walking dogs on lead, two each. We are using a route used for over 10 years, part of which crosses a large oval. If there are no dogs loose on the oval we do allow our dogs off-lead for this section, still under our control as they can be recalled. Any young ones still without reliable recall remain on lead.

Yesterday there was a mixed group of several dogs and owners having a lovely time playing and throwing balls etc in the middle of the oval so our dogs stayed on lead and we gave them a wide berth, skirting around the far perimeter.

Half way around, I heard shouting and looked up to see a little white fluffy dog barreling across the oval towards us, totally ignoring his handlers calling. Our dogs are not in the least aggressive HOWEVER they are walking in their pack (which to their minds includes us) and this little dog is making a beeline for us, barking loudly and using dominant body language. The dogs lunge forward to meet this perceived threat and I have to hold them back behind me and step between them and the little dog as it closes in.

When he gets within close range he has second thoughts.. (as sensible dogs do when faced with four larger dogs facing up to them and appearing to be unintimidated.) So he stands just out of range, up on tippy toes, hackles up, staring in an unfriendly way and bawls us out instead. We cannot walk on as every time we try to do so he gets Dutch Courage and hones in on their heels, to which they quickly swing around and get ready to take him on.

Our walk stopped, I hear his name being called so step forward and talk to him "Hellooo, is your name Oscar?" "What a good boy" I say in my hypocritically sweetest tone. He is not interested in people, just our dogs so he doesn't mind as I hold his collar to try and keep him at bay from my two straining charges and tickle him under the chin. He finds this a bit confusing; "Huh? I didn't know you guys were our friends, how did you know my name. Here I am being a big guard dog yet now I'm not sure...?"

The reason for doing this is so that my own dogs (who want to deal with him) take a cue from me and relax their guarding reflex - but one wrong move and this little dog could be toast in an instant.

It is not his fault, but our nice walk has been spoiled and he is in imminent danger. We cannot move so wait, with me trying to keep the little dog at a distance from ours but he is loose and free to dart in while they are on lead. - So not easy to do. We are stuck.

Eventually a young girl comes over from the group - I ask her to pick up her little dog. She just stands there, says nothing and stares at us. After some minutes a lady arrives and we manage to get her to pick the still blustering little "Oscar" up. Whew! She is a nice lady and Oscar is a nice little dog - just doing what is natural for a dog. "He won't do anything" she says.

All I can answer as we beat a hasty retreat is to say; "Yes but my dogs are part of a pack and he is not. He is in danger if he takes on a strange pack of dogs without getting to know them first." Oscar was not looking to make friends, in his own way he was guarding territory and trying to be a smart-arse. My 4 dogs walking on lead with us would have all gone him if he had barreled into the middle of their group acting in the aggressive way he was initially. It could have been a very nasty and unnecessary incident if we had been as ignorant of dog behaviour as dear little Oscar's owner.

Please keep your off-lead dogs under control, do not allow them to harass other people and their dogs without permission. If other dogs are sharing the park or oval and particularly when they're on lead, do not allow your unrestrained dog to run up to them and invade their space.

Yes dogs are sociable animals but they are all different and some do not like or even want to meet others outside of their own pack. In many dogs eyes, doggy-polite introductions are first required and a strange dog barreling up to them will most certainly not be welcome.

It is much more pleasant for everyone if we could all appreciate that. We should not allow our dogs to spoil the enjoyment of someone else's walk.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Turkey Trip

[DerRottweiler]

While it is true that the dog should be under control at times, we should also appreciate that not everyone has their dogs at a standard where the dog will not randomly approach others and recall on command. This is part and parcel of taking your dog to an off-leash park, I call it reasonable foresight. I am not saying it is right or wrong, but, it is to be expected, going to a park where a leash is compulsory is a good alternative if the above is of true concern to you.

[Erny]

Turkey Trip .... I'm disappointed that you live OS. You're the type of dog-owner who I enjoy coming across and meeting with when I'm out walking any dog I happen to have in hand. Pity distance to where you live isn't going to make that possible.

to the way you handled that situation in the park. I used to do the same when I was out with my previous dog "Kal" who, when adopted, was fear aggressive to other dogs. The approach you made to the other dog was often the approach I made as well - a 'signal' from us as our dog's leader that it's ok and also for them to be able to defer to our choices. Keeping your dogs behind you in those types of instances is also something that I practice. Again, it goes to leadership. I enjoyed your post - it was riddled with common sense and responsibility.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Erny

[Erny]

While it is true that the dog should be under control at times, we should also appreciate that not everyone has their dogs at a standard where the dog will not randomly approach others and recall on command. This is part and parcel of taking your dog to an off-leash park, I call it reasonable foresight. I am not saying it is right or wrong, but, it is to be expected, going to a park where a leash is compulsory is a good alternative if the above is of true concern to you.

Yes - that's true, DerRottweilier. However, it is unfortunate that the scales of weight are far tipped to out of control dogs being common place, and where reasonable foresight by those same people isn't something many of them bother with.

These parks SHOULD be able to be enjoyed by everyone and not have to be abandoned because of the majority who find it easier to turn their backs on the fact that they do not have control over their dogs. But ignoring that responsibility obviously works for them, because it does mean that they manage to shun away the people who don't agree with them and the enjoyment of the park is for them and those who are likeminded, alone.

Edited May 6, 2010 by Erny