Max#1 Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Lilli_star: I'm sure she will be ignoring them in no time. Look out for ickyness though - like weeping or pus or redness - it could be a sign of infection. KTB: Like you, I also wonder about this conformation thing - and have been reading the thread about two-tone kelpies with interest. I am always reassured though, that just as for humans beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it must be the same for the human perception of dogs. And therefore, there's enough people who like all the different looking dogs, that no dog - no matter how conformingly beautiful or ugly, must go unloved. Well I'm a bit sore today after another fantastic flyball training session last night. Max is really coming along well - and where he's not, is because my lack of coordination is holding him back - ha! And in exciting news we're going to the nationals on the weekend. I'll make sure to take my camera! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalathebear Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 KTB: Like you, I also wonder about this conformation thing - and have been reading the thread about two-tone kelpies with interest. I am always reassured though, that just as for humans beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it must be the same for the human perception of dogs. And therefore, there's enough people who like all the different looking dogs, that no dog - no matter how conformingly beautiful or ugly, must go unloved. I'd hope so. I was reading the line that said: No dog is perfect and every dog will have it's faults, but geeez, why wouldn't you give yourself the best shot at buying a pup that has good conformation and the potential to remain sound. i.e. even if you're not going to show, the better the conformation of the dog, the better the pet you're going to get. I think about all the ugly/non-conforming dogs in the pound and my own ugly non-conforming doggies and guess they're lucky that they got OH and me who will love them the way they are. I guess I'm lucky they love me for who I am even though I have allergies, am chubbier than I should be, also short-sighted, have no lung capacity and in no way conforming to the Perfect Human Breed Standard ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) I have just dropped Ava off at the vet's for her operation! It was a different place to our usual vet so she was very excited and a bit perplexed why Satchy had to stay home and SHE got to go for a car ride. Little does she know what's about to happen Satch was happy to have a day of peace and quiet. I don't think people care whether a dog conforms to the breed standard or not UNLESS the dog purported to be a "good example of the breed" or has been purposely bred to look different to the breed standard (eg. huge SBTs). I certainly don't have many people looking down their nose at my big mutt, but that's because he doesn't meet any standard and no-one expects him to. He has heaps of imperfections and when people bred dogs like him you get all kinds of trouble (overbite, bad hips, bad leg structure which means he's not as athletic as he should be). If I told someone, "This is my purebred Canberra Sheparoodle and I am going to breed him" it would be a different story! If I was to put Ava's pic out there amongst Aussie breeders and ask them if she was a good example of the breed I'd be asking for a whomping, but I know that doesn't make her any less of a good pet Edit: No-one's saying that non-conforming dogs shouldn't be loved... that's just silly. Plenty of people in the thread you're talking about have their own rescue mutts or dogs that look like they've bit hit by a truck and they still love :D Edited November 9, 2010 by wuffles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niques Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) Gosh, I'm awful at keeping up with this thread this week. Sounds like a big storm you guys had! I was quite worried pre-puppy about the weather - so many people seem to have storm reactive dogs. But James is a Summer puppy and bred on the Sunshine Coast, no less. His first 8 weeks were spent in near constant rain. When we went to see them at 5 weeks we arrived in the midst of a huge thunder storm and the little chubsters played (and snored) through the whole thing. KA, I know exactly what you mean when it comes to obedience. I desperately wanted to go as far as possible with it, but the general class setup and environment is simply not right for James to learn. Until it got to the point where we really weren't getting anything out of it. We're going to revisit it next year when he's a bit more mature and after doing a lot more work on our own. Very pleased to hear Ruby's right back to her cheeky self :D Hopefully she's good with her stitches for you. Her (mutilated) bear is exceedingly cute. Hoover never seems too dopey to me. More deceptively adorable. Can't see past the gorgeous floppy ears to realise there's a ticking brain underneath Max#1, I'd love to see video of Max's flyball training. It sounds like great fun! The current threads have me interested in James' conformation. He has a very handsome Aust Ch. for a father but poor James still looks incredibly awkward at times. I'm hoping he's just going through his lanky phase. And will grow out of that long back You'd think there was a bit of Dachshund in him at present. ETA: Hope all goes smoothly for Ava Edited November 9, 2010 by Niques Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalathebear Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) I have just dropped Ava off at the vet's for her operation! It was a different place to our usual vet so she was very excited and a bit perplexed why Satchy had to stay home and SHE got to go for a car ride. Little does she know what's about to happen Satch was happy to have a day of peace and quiet. Good luck to Ava!! I hope she's ok and doesn't miss you too much. Do you get to pick her up today or does she stay overnight for observation? I don't think people care whether a dog conforms to the breed standard or not UNLESS the dog purported to be a "good example of the breed" or has been purposely bred to look different to the breed standard (eg. huge SBTs). I certainly don't have many people looking down their nose at my big mutt, but that's because he doesn't meet any standard and no-one expects him to. He has heaps of imperfections and when people bred dogs like him you get all kinds of trouble (overbite, bad hips, bad leg structure which means he's not as athletic as he should be). If I told someone, "This is my purebred Canberra Sheparoodle and I am going to breed him" it would be a different story! If I was to put Ava's pic out there amongst Aussie breeders and ask them if she was a good example of the breed I'd be asking for a whomping, but I know that doesn't make her any less of a good pet Edit: No-one's saying that non-conforming dogs shouldn't be loved... that's just silly. Plenty of people in the thread you're talking about have their own rescue mutts or dogs that look like they've bit hit by a truck and they still love :D Normally don't disagree with you wuffles, dear but in that thread, there are some people who are implying that 'just a pet' should also be conforming even if it's not for show. There are heaps of people on DOL who do love non-conforming dogs but there are certainly ones out there who are disapproving of non-conforming pets. The further issue is that if one had a conforming dog that was very awesome, if one did not show it - there would be people here who jump up and down because it's selfish not to 'do' something with it and just 'waste' it as a pet. Not everyone in the world is as rational and chilled as you with your lovely pedigree and lovely pound puppy ... The current threads have me interested in James' conformation. He has a very handsome Aust Ch. for a father but poor James still looks incredibly awkward at times. I'm hoping he's just going through his lanky phase. And will grow out of that long back You'd think there was a bit of Dachshund in him at present. So cute. Have you been able to get James in one of those adorable 'stack' poses that they do to show dogs? that always looks so cute with puppies because I can imagine if it was one of my dogs, the head would be looking back going: "Where's my treat??" Edited November 9, 2010 by koalathebear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Wuffles and KTB: it was the 'if my dog looked like that it wouldn't get a start' that got me. Though I'm not quite sure what that's supposed to mean. KTB: I had to laugh at your non-conforming description. Sometimes I stop and appreciate just how lucky I am with Max. Though, I'll be brutally honest here (ha!) - I think the way our dogs are has a lot to do with us. Certain characteristics I believe are bred - like preference for style of play, tendencies towards aggression/submissive behaviour etc - and some of these can be modified - but the way they just 'are' is primarily because of us. Wuffles: good luck to Ava! Niques: photos, photos, photos! Awkward puppies are the cutest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) oops Edited November 10, 2010 by Max#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Normally don't disagree with you wuffles, dear but in that thread, there are some people who are implying that 'just a pet' should also be conforming even if it's not for show. There are heaps of people on DOL who do love non-conforming dogs but there are certainly ones out there who are disapproving of non-conforming pets. The further issue is that if one had a conforming dog that was very awesome, if one did not show it - there would be people here who jump up and down because it's selfish not to 'do' something with it and just 'waste' it as a pet. Not everyone in the world is as rational and chilled as you with your lovely pedigree and lovely pound puppy ... There are always going to be people that think like that but it's not everyone, just a tiny few We've discussed some "interesting" posters before so I know we feel the same way about that, but it's a minority really, as with any issue on these forums. And some people are just rude but frequenting a number of internet forums over the years, you just get used to them after a while I think most people are going to be accepting if a dog is bred responsibly and somehow came out a bit weird like Ava (bless her little white face :D) but unhappy if it was bred from parents who obviously don't stack up conformation-wise. And Little Miss Ava gets to come home tonight, I pick her up at 5pm They said they will call before the op, then when she wakes up. I haven't heard from them yet so I presume she is charming them all with her pretty face and waggy tail waiting for her turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalathebear Posted November 10, 2010 Author Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) Wuffles and KTB: it was the 'if my dog looked like that it wouldn't get a start' that got me. Though I'm not quite sure what that's supposed to mean. I was a bit concerned about that comment, too because the same breeder had mentioned in the rare colour thread: "I wouldn't think twice to make sure a black and tan, liver, blue or fawn doesn't make it past the first few hours. I'd be taking a serious look at how they've come about and making sure I take measure to prevent them popping up again." i.e. would put to sleep healthy puppies because of colour. The reason was very rational i.e. to make sure that those colours didn't cause a 'bad' type of dog to become the next craze. The thread was almost shut down because there was one poster who got quite outraged at the thought of healthy puppies being put to sleep etc. To be fair though, in the blue staffy thread, I think that the breeder was just saying that she wouldn't think of showing a blue staffy like the one that the OP of that thread owns etc. Don’t' know though … can't judge I suppose because I'm not a breeder and it must be a dilemma if you end up with non-conforming puppies - can't keep them because that drains your own resources, but can put them out there because that creates publicity and a demand for 'badly conformed' dogs. I suppose I still struggle a lot with the whole 'show' thing because it seems strange to expect temperament and physical perfection from an animal … I'm more comfortable with expecting physical ability from a dog – dog sports, obedience etc. For me dog shows, I get a bit of discomfort from dog shows because they feel to me like child beauty pageants or something. I know that this is irrational and that shows are there for the betterment of the breed blah blah blah but I guess I'm just happy with my two pet doggies who I will hopefully never put up to be judged for their rag tag appearance … ETA: wuffles you are right - I know it's a minority view and the majority of the people here love their dogs - motley, non-conforming, ugly or cute-ugly or lovely as the case may be .. I guess I can't help but 'respond' even in my head when I see some posts that make me go: "Yoicks!" Edited November 10, 2010 by koalathebear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niques Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 So cute. Have you been able to get James in one of those adorable 'stack' poses that they do to show dogs? that always looks so cute with puppies because I can imagine if it was one of my dogs, the head would be looking back going: "Where's my treat??" Not a chance :D If I bent down to slightly adjust one leg I'm quite certain that the head would immediately twist around to ask, "What on earth are you doing back there?" and then the rest would just come tumbling down. I've been neglecting James photos lately. I'll have to start taking some more. From some angles (mainly from the rear) he looks quite dashing, but from various front angles his back looks weird when standing. I suspect because he's grown long before tall. He's so short Has anyone's male pup started cocking their leg yet? James has slowly, over the past few months, been discovering the joys of marking the neighbourhood. But still no leg-cocking. This past week or two he's taken to tucking himself in tight and then putting his bum as close to the ground as possible to attempt some degree of height to his stream. It's hilarious to watch Thankfully it's only out and about - plain ole normal wees at home, still Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalathebear Posted November 10, 2010 Author Share Posted November 10, 2010 OK, I have photos to justify our existence in this sub-forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Very cute KTB. I too feel somewhat bemused by the concept of showing dogs. Niques - Max has never put his leg up. Not once. And now he's over six months and desexed I really wonder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KumaAkita Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) Hey all... hope today's treating you all well. lilli_star: Glad Roo's on the up and up, hope she continues to improve and has no icky stitches issues Wuffles: Good luck to Miss Ava. I'm sure she'll be fine... bet Satch enjoys the peace and quiet while it lasts Max#1: +1 on the flyball video. I can't imagine Kuma doing it. He'd probably destroy the equipment! I'm clumsy too, so i'm sure it'd never work. :D KTB: Lovely Hoov photos. Second one is all - hey, you woke me up! Niques: We used to call Kuma Long Dog, coz he'd grow in length first. Then his back legs would grow, then his front would catch up. He is still a bit gangly and awkward. On the Show Dog/Conformation topic - hmmm... I too am bemused by the show dog scene. I don't begrudge those who do it, it's just not my bag. I personally cannot see why I'd want to do it. I understand that the standards all came from somewhere, and that there is some basis in historical/traditional uses for the animal. However, I need convincing as to why some of the standards remain. I'm also desperate to find out why Kuma is not "show worthy" I also think Humans have their own "conformation" show - if not, then Miss Universe/Miss Worlds, etc would not exist. These ladies are held up to be the best example of womanhood at that given moment in time. I don't buy into that either, by the way, just an example of the ideals humans impose on themselves and all around them. Re cocking of leg: Kuma has only started doing it in the last few months. Now he's working on getting his pee higher up the totem pole. We have to inspect every blade of grass, ever light pole, every letter box, just so Kuma can claim it as "his". He still pees like a girl at home. Once he pee'd on a banked garden bed, he was half asleep and cocked too high and nearly fell over. Silly Billy ETA: I've put a couple of photos of Kuma in the Spitz Calendar 2011 thread, if you like 'em please vote for me when it's time Edited November 10, 2010 by KumaAkita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Just got a call to say Ava is waking up in her bed and will be ready to come home tonight as planned Maybe I will contribute to the photo aspect of the thread tonight, of the groggy little puppy. I can't see the pics here at work Re cocking of leg: Kuma has only started doing it in the last few months. Now he's working on getting his pee higher up the totem pole. We have to inspect every blade of grass, ever light pole, every letter box, just so Kuma can claim it as "his". He still pees like a girl at home. Once he pee'd on a banked garden bed, he was half asleep and cocked too high and nearly fell over. Silly Billy :D @ Kuma falling over. Satch pees like a girl at home as well and marks EVERYTHING on walks. Some mornings it gets ridiculous. Most of the time he doesn't even get his target but he seems pretty happy with himself anyway. We think that he was desexed as a very young puppy but obviously that has had no effect! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalathebear Posted November 10, 2010 Author Share Posted November 10, 2010 Catching up properly .. Post-desexing stitches, always so stressful, especially for those of us with monsters who are so good at unpicking stitches on stuffed toys. Give us some photos of Miss Roo soon, lilli_star! I also want to see Max flyball training videos! I'd love to see an Akita doing agility or flyball, too! It would be so cute! On a distantly related note, wuffles pointed out to me the other day that we have a French bulldog at BDOC. So cute! I'm also desperate to find out why Kuma is not "show worthy" I think that would just open you up to a world of unnecessary upset It would be like having lots of people telling you that you have an ugly baby … I cringe to think of what Conformists would say about Elbie or Hoover … They have nice teeth but perhaps they have wonky hocks, dud withers, spastic mandibles and defective ocular sockets .. I also think Humans have their own "conformation" show - if not, then Miss Universe/Miss Worlds, etc would not exist. These ladies are held up to be the best example of womanhood at that given moment in time. I don't buy into that either, by the way, just an example of the ideals humans impose on themselves and all around them. True … I have to say that of late, each rescue dog I've been given to do a video for is getting 'uglier' than the last … They're proving difficult to rehome and they're probably the antithesis of conformity. Sigh … I have to confess doing videos for them is a bit tricky, too.. My two doggies wee like girls although Elbie will very occasionally lift his leg and do the Boy Thing. I've never seen him mark anything – he WAS desexed at 10 weeks so maybe that has something to do with it? ETA: I've put a couple of photos of Kuma in the Spitz Calendar 2011 thread, if you like 'em please vote for me when it's time But of course! :D Will definitely vote for my favourite akita. My two work colleagues here had never heard of/seen an akita before so I spent 10 minutes showing them photos of Kuma and then the Wikipedia link to Hachi Just got a call to say Ava is waking up in her bed and will be ready to come home tonight as planned Maybe I will contribute to the photo aspect of the thread tonight, of the groggy little puppy. I can't see the pics here at work Yay! So glad she's ok. Good luck keeping her calm tonight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niques Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Looking forward to some new Ava photos when she's home, Wuffles Niques: We used to call Kuma Long Dog, coz he'd grow in length first. Then his back legs would grow, then his front would catch up. He is still a bit gangly and awkward. When James was very small you could watch him grow based on his tail. His tail always grew first. Some mornings I would look at him and think that he had an abnormally long tail. A few days later it would be short again and you'd realise that the whole puppy had gotten a little bit bigger. The first Hoover photo is adorable - sleepy little boy. I contemplated on and off about whether to go down the show route. I'm a tiny bit too competitive for my own good so it appeals in that sense, but I'm also extremely lazy and it seems to be a ridiculous amount of effort to go to. Maybe when they start judging dogs in all their muddy, scruffy glory :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max#1 Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) Ha ha Niques and KA! I know exactly what you mean! Not so much these days, but definitely in the earlier weeks I remember looking at Max and thinking: my what a big head you've gotten.... or: such long legs..... or: such BIG ears..... or: what a little head.... hehe. It seemed my puppy was growing in a disproportionate way! But like Elbie and Hoover - everyone who's seen him says he has great teeth.... Edited November 10, 2010 by Max#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KumaAkita Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) My.... what big ears you have... ETA: whoops - probably should photoshop out his lipstick! must do that when I get home.... :D Edited November 10, 2010 by KumaAkita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betsy Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 Just ducking in quickly to post this link Apologies if you've already seen it Now going out to play some soccer with the doggy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wuffles Posted November 10, 2010 Share Posted November 10, 2010 (edited) Ava is home, very groggy but still quite happy They said she was very well behaved except when she wanted to "talk" to the two westies that were also there getting desexed. Here is a video of the sleepy puppy: Edit: Damn lipstick getting in the way of good photos eh KA :D Edited November 10, 2010 by wuffles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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