Toilet Training For 2 Puppies

[jasqng]

I recently got 2 mini schnauzer cross Jap Spitz and they are brothers at 11 weeks old. There are 4 of us staying together with them. We are trying to toilet train them which is getting pretty chaotic. We are not doing the crate training as we are mostly out during the day for work so we gave them a caged up area with their bed at one corner and training pads at another. When we are home, we let them out to play and eat and do their business.

I am just wondering if it is wrong to let them loose outside to do their business and play? Should we change to leashing them when we let them out and go potty and only then let them loose? We did try doing that but they insist not to do it on the pet loo we have outside. We wait rather long but they do not want to do it. Once we get tired of waiting and let them loose, they straight away do it on the ground outside and not on the pet loo. I am wondering what we are doing wrong?

We also let them run around the rumpus area during the day when we are at home. But then they urinate everywhere other than the training pads that is at their cage. The cage will be opened so they have easy access to the pads. Is this wrong?

Help!!

Thanks!

[Cosmolo]

First things first-

Choose one consistent surface for the dogs- grass OR training mats, not both.

Do you have a yard, courtyard or secure balcony? How long are you away from them during the day? Where do they sleep over night?

What other training are you doing with them? I have never heard of that particular breed mix before and to be honest i think it is going to be very challenging- particularly having two at once. Are you in an apartment? Your training is vital as both breeds in the mix are vocal ones so you need to get on top of some socialisation and basic obedience as soon as possible.

[W Sibs]

First off, good luck, toilet training 2 puppies! It's hard with just one!

It's all about being consistence on toilet training (and training) a puppy or puppies in your case.

Do you have any pics? I've never heard of that cross before!

[Addicted to Dogs]

jasqng and your 2 mini schnauzer cross Jap Spitz

You need to check that all 4 of the humans in the house are being consistent.

Doing the caged up area with training pads sounds like it's working when the pups are contained there - but not when out with wider access. Is this right?

If the training pads work when contained I can't see a problem there. If they're not working even when contained perhaps try a slab of turf in a kitty litter tray (or 4 - 2 in the area and 2 out in the sun) or something similar to the pet loo.

Now it's time to get tough - sorry but you (and the other 3) are at fault if the pups are toileting in the house - not the pups. You should be taking them out to toilet when letting them out of their constrained area, after eating, drinking, playing, sleeping or at least every hour when toilet training. Given the pet loo - keep them on leash or put a fenced area around the pet loo area.

Taking your puppy outside on leash helps you to tkeep them around to make a big fuss and reward toileting with happy face, happy voice and 3 liver treats (or other special treats) - while you can get away with it with 1 pup doing this off leash can be a bit hard if there is only 1 of you out there - particularly if they toilet simultaneously in two places. You need to get the reward to them in 3 seconds or less. So unless you are a superhero then you can go with the leash or take 2 people out, 1 with each pup so that the pups learn to toilet on and off leash. You also need to have patience and wait - if nothing is forthcoming in 5 minutes then bring them inside for some quiet time with you watching for any signs and then taking them out, or time in something like a crate (where appropriately trained for one). Then after 15 - 20 mins take them out again and try. You may have more success if they don't go out together - as the may be a distraction. Also don't talk to them, play or touch them - just stand and wait ready to party when they do the deed.

By the way crate training for housetraining is not about locking a pup into a crate when you're not there. The idea is to use the crate for periods when you are there but can't keep an 100% eye on the pup, or after unsuccessful visits outside. See http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/errorless-housetraining for the full story (or at least one of them).

Oh and check the instructions for the pet loo because dogs don't generally like toileting where they have been before - hence they will spread it all over the lawn if you let them. So maybe there are instructions for washing down or using the pet loo that you're missing (or maybe not) - just a thought.

Let us know how you go - you've got a challenge with 2 at once.

p.s. Please make sure that you give them time independent of each other so that they learn to cope - so many pups that grow up with another don't seem to be able to cope when one of them goes to the vet or anything like that.

[jasqng]

Here is a pic of them. I cannot seem to catch a proper pic of Scruffy (the black one) as he always looks away and cannot sit still. However, he has the Schnauzer look. Ollie (brown one) was good enough to sit still for me to take the pic.

Also, we have mastered the sit command. Now just to get them to use the pet loo. They prefer the training pads so far and have been good in using it during the night. We are all going to try replacing the training pads with the pet loo now. Fingers cross they will be good and use it.

I did find separating them while training is so much better. They have a tendency of not listening when they are playing with each other. I will also start separating them so that they will get used to the separation later on.

[Cosmolo]

Don't forget socialisation to the world is crucial at this age. A good puppy pre school would be very helpful.

They are cute puppies. :D

[W Sibs]

They are VERY cute!!

[jasqng]

Oh they are cute but so very naughty especially since they are 2 brothers. The last 2 weeks when 2 of us are on school holidays....we sort of spoilt them a bit by letting them play around the rumpus. Now that we are back to full schedule, they always bite and tear up the papers we lay at their cage area. So we have been coming home to messes.

Yes they have been to puppy school.....it is pretty funny as they are the smallest ones there and they always run away when the other puppies come near.

We have mastered the sit position....especially when being fed. Now to only master the toilet training.

[poodlefan]

Oh they are cute but so very naughty especially since they are 2 brothers. The last 2 weeks when 2 of us are on school holidays....we sort of spoilt them a bit by letting them play around the rumpus. Now that we are back to full schedule, they always bite and tear up the papers we lay at their cage area. So we have been coming home to messes.

Yes they have been to puppy school.....it is pretty funny as they are the smallest ones there and they always run away when the other puppies come near.

We have mastered the sit position....especially when being fed. Now to only master the toilet training.

That suggests to me that you should be doing a lot of work building their confidence around other dogs - in a controlled environment.

How much time do these two pups spend apart. Do you do activities with them separately. If not, I suggest you start. Pups overbonded to one another can be very difficult to manage down the line.

[di_dee1]

I can not fathom why to use a pet loo if they have access to outside.

I have 2 pups, now 5 1/2 months old.

All adults in your house have to be consistent

I must admit I have not read all the responses.

My way has been that they go out very regularly.

After a sleep, outside, after eating...outside, if sniffing around..outside.

I use the command widdle widdle.

Being on a farm with no neighbours I have peed on the grass myself to show them.

Some collect urine in buckets to do this...works fast too.

Much praise when they pee or poo. I say widdle widdle whilst they are doing it so they associate word with action

We have very few accidents now. If we do, it is my fault for not paying attention.

[Cosmolo]

It is actually quite a significant issue that they are running away when the other puppies come near- i suggest you do some reading on the critical periods of development and find a puppy pre school where your puppies gradually gain confidence if they are not doing so where you are attending.

[Addicted to Dogs]

I'd go one step further and urgently suggest that you get both pups into puppy classes - but a different class for each. This way each pup has to learn to cope with the social situation on their own. You may find that the pups have different reactions when away from their sibling - and doing it alone (or more specifically with you) will build their confidence.