Trialling And Eye Contact

[gsdog2]

I alos love the connection I have with my dogs, Rommi isn't worried about constant eye contact, Lewis loves it and he looks at me with such adoration I can't help but look back - If only my husband looked at me like that!

I've been told I should look ahead and not at my dog, and yet my OH videoed my last trial and I felt I looked disconnected from my dog. I'm now going to try for a happy medium of looking slightly ahead of her but not directly ahead. I have to admit though the original reason I was told to look "up" was to help me walk in a straight line

[sas]

Apparently some judges in QLD don't like the hand on the hip. But that's what I tend to do. I think the general rule is your hands can be at your side or at your middle or you can have one on your hip as long as you don't move them (unless giving a signal).

From the videos I have watched the dog is targeting the hand so I don't personaly like it. I can't do that with my anyway as his head is higher than my waist.

[bedazzledx2]

If the dog is not touching the hand then there shouldn't be a problem. If the dog is constantly nudging the hand then yes that would be cause for lots of points to go down the tube!

Apparently some judges in QLD don't like the hand on the hip. But that's what I tend to do. I think the general rule is your hands can be at your side or at your middle or you can have one on your hip as long as you don't move them (unless giving a signal).

From the videos I have watched the dog is targeting the hand so I don't personaly like it. I can't do that with my anyway as his head is higher than my waist.

[Seita]

Goodness me!!! I do wonder about different states sometimes!!!! Its a little blue book that is supposed to be the same for all states put out by the ANKC. No where does it say you can't have your hand on your hip. I'm not shooting the messenger here but it can be a concern.

Apparently some judges in QLD don't like the hand on the hip. But that's what I tend to do. I think the general rule is your hands can be at your side or at your middle or you can have one on your hip as long as you don't move them (unless giving a signal).

It's not something I've heard of (and I'm SE Qld). The only thing I've been told is no matter where you choose to have your hand you should keep that position for the whole ring workout ie. don't let your hand swing one minute and then hold it to your waist the next minute as this could be seen as a double signal

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

[gsdog2]

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

I know a senior judge and I have asked this person if it was right that competitors were being pinged for putting their hands in a different position before the recall, and after the recall. This particular judge was adamant that there was no penalty!!! This person is a senior judge and is a current judge. I would not risk the change of hand position myself because it comes down to who your judge is on the day.

[bedazzledx2]

Page 9 of the little blue book...."A voice command and a signal may be given, but must be used simultaneously. A signal should be a single gesture of the arms and/or hands only, which must be promptly returned to their normal position. Signals must be inaudible and must not touch the dog." Most judges interpret normal position to be that which the handler has adopted at the beginning of the exercise. In other words, if for instance in the recall, you turn and face your dog with your hands at your sides then that is your normal position for that exercise. If you then call your dog and place your hands at your waist then I, and most judges will ping you for an extra signal. If you then give a finish signal and that hand stays at your side instead of returning to your waist...that's another point off!!! Gets expensive when its the handler making the mistakes not the dog

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

I know a senior judge and I have asked this person if it was right that competitors were being pinged for putting their hands in a different position before the recall, and after the recall. This particular judge was adamant that there was no penalty!!! This person is a senior judge and is a current judge. I would not risk the change of hand position myself because it comes down to who your judge is on the day.

[gsdog2]

Thanks for putting the page number in, because you know what I'm doing this week

Page 9 of the little blue book...."A voice command and a signal may be given, but must be used simultaneously. A signal should be a single gesture of the arms and/or hands only, which must be promptly returned to their normal position. Signals must be inaudible and must not touch the dog." Most judges interpret normal position to be that which the handler has adopted at the beginning of the exercise. In other words, if for instance in the recall, you turn and face your dog with your hands at your sides then that is your normal position for that exercise. If you then call your dog and place your hands at your waist then I, and most judges will ping you for an extra signal. If you then give a finish signal and that hand stays at your side instead of returning to your waist...that's another point off!!! Gets expensive when its the handler making the mistakes not the dog

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

I know a senior judge and I have asked this person if it was right that competitors were being pinged for putting their hands in a different position before the recall, and after the recall. This particular judge was adamant that there was no penalty!!! This person is a senior judge and is a current judge. I would not risk the change of hand position myself because it comes down to who your judge is on the day.

[Mas1981]

This is a very interesting topic, I am keen to start competing when my dog is ready but I did not know any of this stuff so I have found it very informative

[bedazzledx2]

Unfortunately the ANKC have opted not to print any more rule books and DogsWest don't have any left. You can download the rules from here http://www.ankc.org.au/Rules.aspx

This is a very interesting topic, I am keen to start competing when my dog is ready but I did not know any of this stuff so I have found it very informative

[Mas1981]

Unfortunately the ANKC have opted not to print any more rule books and DogsWest don't have any left. You can download the rules from here http://www.ankc.org.au/Rules.aspx

This is a very interesting topic, I am keen to start competing when my dog is ready but I did not know any of this stuff so I have found it very informative

Thanks I will read through it all

[Seita]

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

I know a senior judge and I have asked this person if it was right that competitors were being pinged for putting their hands in a different position before the recall, and after the recall. This particular judge was adamant that there was no penalty!!! This person is a senior judge and is a current judge. I would not risk the change of hand position myself because it comes down to who your judge is on the day.

It was a senior judge who picked me up on this and I asked another couple of senior judges who all agreed that that hands must return to the same position as they started in.

That said the same senior judge said they'd ping me for my foot work as they would consider it a double signal as well - when I stop for a halt I take a longer slower step with my right foot and then bring my left foot up in line. Some people take a shorter step before stopping, I just take a longer one and this person was adament that they consider it a double command. There's a reason I choose not to trial under them ever.

Needless to say I will be enrolling in the judges training program later this year so I'm sure I'll have LOTS AND LOTS of questions to test out all the senior judges!!

[gsdog2]

I know of a couple of judges here in QLD who don't like the hand on the hip thing, if you have both hands held across your middle it's fine but one down by your side and one up could get penalised by certain judges. My biggest issue with hands is when giving commands like retrieve or go to the box and putting my hands back to the same position that they started in... I might start with hands by my side when I throw the dumbell and after the command to retrieve put them at my middle and then give the command, I keep getting told off for that!

At my first CCD trial I got pinged every time I looked at my dog... lost 12 points in total on the heeling which was a combination of looking my dog and her bumping into my leg which the judge considered crowding.

I know a senior judge and I have asked this person if it was right that competitors were being pinged for putting their hands in a different position before the recall, and after the recall. This particular judge was adamant that there was no penalty!!! This person is a senior judge and is a current judge. I would not risk the change of hand position myself because it comes down to who your judge is on the day.

It was a senior judge who picked me up on this and I asked another couple of senior judges who all agreed that that hands must return to the same position as they started in.

That said the same senior judge said they'd ping me for my foot work as they would consider it a double signal as well - when I stop for a halt I take a longer slower step with my right foot and then bring my left foot up in line. Some people take a shorter step before stopping, I just take a longer one and this person was adament that they consider it a double command. There's a reason I choose not to trial under them ever.

Needless to say I will be enrolling in the judges training program later this year so I'm sure I'll have LOTS AND LOTS of questions to test out all the senior judges!!

I have my little blue rule book in front of me

And yes, I had thought your hands should return to the same position, however this came up in a discussion between a group of us who were training and this particular judge said there would be no points deducted! There were a number of us who were stunned by this because a couple of them HAD lost point for changing position.

This is a particularly nice judge (who's had years of experience) and I'd like to think, can be forgiven for this one error (I'm sure the competitors under this judge would be happy )

[Prydenjoy]

I also noticed watching Patty Ruzzo that there hands have to be at their sides for recalls , like our way better.

I think that answers my next question, if Berri see's my hand at my right side he'll go straight in for the flip finish, so for a recall my hands are kind of grasped together in front of me. Is this what others do?

Lewis loves it and he looks at me with such adoration I can't help but look back - If only my husband looked at me like that!

I can relate x 2

Page 9 of the little blue book...."A voice command and a signal may be given, but must be used simultaneously. A signal should be a single gesture of the arms and/or hands only, which must be promptly returned to their normal position. Signals must be inaudible and must not touch the dog." Most judges interpret normal position to be that which the handler has adopted at the beginning of the exercise. In other words, if for instance in the recall, you turn and face your dog with your hands at your sides then that is your normal position for that exercise. If you then call your dog and place your hands at your waist then I, and most judges will ping you for an extra signal. If you then give a finish signal and that hand stays at your side instead of returning to your waist...that's another point off!!! Gets expensive when its the handler making the mistakes not the dog

I'm confused, I can tell I'm going to lose a lot of points on the weekend (all through my own faults!). So technically it would be ok if I stood feet slightly apart (he comes in and stops with his feet between mine) and my hands grasped in front BEFORE I call him, it shouldn't be an issue when I call him and have my hands like this? What about down the track when I want to finish him, obviously my hands will then move to the side and my feet will have to come together, will I be penalised?

I think I'll learn a lot through stewarding this weekend as well!

Can you look at the dog when you stop or down or stand or whatever? I don't want to hit him in the face if I don't look down and just swipe my hand in front of him!

[OSoSwift]

I'm confused, I can tell I'm going to lose a lot of points on the weekend (all through my own faults!). So technically it would be ok if I stood feet slightly apart (he comes in and stops with his feet between mine) and my hands grasped in front BEFORE I call him, it shouldn't be an issue when I call him and have my hands like this? What about down the track when I want to finish him, obviously my hands will then move to the side and my feet will have to come together, will I be penalised?

If your hands start infront, you give your signal then they return to infront you will be fine. When you execute the finish you will have to give the hand signal return it to the same positiong in front and your feet will have to stay where they were for the recall. Moving your feet together will be another signal, as would be giving a hand signal and the hand returning to your side not back to the previous position infront.

Edited April 5, 2010 by Rommi n Lewis

[Prydenjoy]

Ok I'm going to have to revise some of his signals etc I think!

[gsdog2]

Ok I'm going to have to revise some of his signals etc I think!

Just remember Jeanne - ENJOY YOURSELF

I know it's easier said than done, but I think we all lose sight of the fact that we're supposed to be doing this to have a great time with our dogs

Nothing bad's going to happen if you make a mistake, in fact most people (judges & stewards included) are very sypathetic.

[Prydenjoy]

I always say when I stop having fun, I'll stop training.... The thought of being judged is pretty nerve racking though!

[gsdog2]

I always say when I stop having fun, I'll stop training.... The thought of being judged is pretty nerve racking though!

If it wasn't for the fact that you have to drive home I often wonder if a quick rum might help

[Prydenjoy]

I always say when I stop having fun, I'll stop training.... The thought of being judged is pretty nerve racking though!

If it wasn't for the fact that you have to drive home I often wonder if a quick rum might help

Guess I'll have to arranged a DD

[dogdude]

Can you look at the dog when you stop or down or stand or whatever? I don't want to hit him in the face if I don't look down and just swipe my hand in front of him!

Hi Jeanne

I would have thought a Pap would be well below your hand signal, from an upwright position?? Should be no need to worry.

I think alot of novice handlers with small dogs tend to bend while giving hand signals. (in fear of the dog missing the signal) Should be no need to if the dog has great focus on you.