WoofnHoof Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 And there goes any ounce of possible respect I may have had for Steve Austin. Will not be giving any recommendations for his kennels. Wish they had of had a registered breeder on talking about the good they do, with health testing etc, to explain how the good ones do it right. That's a good idea, I think someone from here should write into the 7:30 report offering to be interviewed about ethical dog breeding, offer a tour of their kennels to show what it should be like, it would be a great counter story to the PF one and showcase the ideal This page has contact details for the producers and reporters if any breeders want to contact them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prydenjoy Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 It would be good if the MDBA got involved in a follow up story to provide people with a starting point to track down really good, responsible breeders. Not many people know about them, even when buying from a "breeder" most people will just call up about that puppy in the newspaper (hows this, Poodles of all sizes and ages for sale in our local paper last week with an out of town number, does that scream PF or what?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
labsrule Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 What really got up my nose with Steve Austin, apart from the fact that he supports the puppy farmers . was that he disputes the fact that dogs brought from pet stores end up in shelters and he was quite adamant in his denial about this problem . This from a guy who has been in the dog world for many years Well I think he shot his credibility to pieces tonight and has probably lost a lot of respect and hopefully business . The point about this claim is that it doesn't matter whether one single puppy sold in a pet shop ever ends up in a shelter. It is how that puppy is bred that is the major issue, as I see it. As someone said: if it has a uterus breed it. The animals suffer - that is the point that should be being stressed. At least "hybrid vigour" was raised. :D I agree that it's not whether the pups end up in shelters or not, it's the emotional wellbeing of these pups that concerns me most. Instead of being raised in a family environment for much of their critical socialisation period they are pissing in their beds with little to no human interaction, bred from parents who have undoubtedly not had any form of temperament testing, not to mention health testing. There were a lot of "breeds" in the story that I couldn't even tell if they were supposed to be purebreds of some kind or mongrels, breeding for type and temperament just goes out the window.Steve Austin :D Of course it is about the way they are bred and the resulting problems that cause a lot of these poor dogs to be dumped in shelters and Steve Austin was disputing and in denial about the high dumpage rates of dogs from petshops (i.e. puppyfarmers) as he wouldn't acknowledge that these poor puppyfarmed dogs have issues due to the way they are bred and their environment . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 No dog breeding should be carried out (even in accordance with the code of ethics) in giant tin sheds akin to battery hens or piggeries. There has been so much agitation by the RSPCA against those industries as inhumane - surely dogs in similar conditions is akin to this given dogs are companion animals and they need to focus on these practices before worrying about registered breeders. The RSPCA need to do something about their website re puppy farms as they have this re registered breeders: http://kb.rspca.org.au/What-is-a-registered-breeder_328.html ://http://kb.rspca.org.au/What-is-a-re...eeder_328.html - great way to confuse the public and send them to puppy farms like Banksia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) Lisa Lindsay, RSPCA NSW did good....going straight to the producing of 'designer dogs' for profit. And the horrors they're seeing with their own eyes. Debra Tranter, Animal Lib Victoria, also made a good point that big numbers of companion animals, like dogs, being kept as 'farm' animals, was just not on. Greatest find was Meg Dobson, former puppy-farmer who's seen the light. She nailed the central point that the puppy- farm life institutionalised the dogs so they lacked any socialisation & were timid with people. But the bloke from the Puppy Farm was totally unaware of that as he faced the cameras saying how good his place is. Shelter & food & reasonable cleanliness were his criteria. There was not one word.....or provision....for socialisation of the dogs to have close experience with people or with the outside world. I agree about contacting the 7.30 Report with the suggestion of showing breeding & homing when it's done well, like by the good registered breeders. I have at my feet 2 brilliant tibbies, in temperament & how well they're socialised. They came from their registered breeder like that. The very opposite of the dogs from puppy farms. The pet buying public need to see the best breeding/raising/homing of dogs. And I agree with Danois that the national website of the RSPCA needs rewriting on the topic of breeders. Edited March 30, 2010 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corvus Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 So how should the Banksia Park fellow be shown? He was shown, in the middle of his puppy farm. Understand this - no puppy farms are good places. People that run them are morally bankrupt - what decent person makes money from the misery of dogs? Anyone with a shred of decency will see him for exactly what he is - you don't need Debra Tranter to explain - don't you see the cruelty?I've got an ex puppy farm dog here, probably dumped as she's 8 and started breeding dead or disabled pups. She's been bred from pretty continually, according to my vet. There are inherent behavioural problems with such dogs because of the conditions/situation they are kept in. Apart from the vile physical condition they are often in. Calm down. I was drawing attention to the fact that despite the guy having obviously scrubbed his facility top to toe before they got out there to film it, and despite the fact he was trying to distance himself from other PF, the story still showed him in an unfavourable light. When that was perceived to have happened in the Catalyst PDE aftershock everyone decried it as biased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Mita, Unfortunately, the average public person does not have the knowledge to go to the Canine Council/registered breeders. The average person sees the cute puppy in the window at the pet shop at the mall, the kids get to cuddle it and BINGO they have a new dog. They haven't given any consideration that this cute bundle of fluff will be with them for the next 12-15 years. And also that this cute puppy's mother is still in a cage at the puppy farm breeding the next lot for the pet shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 The programme was put on about puppy farms, DD's & where pet shop puppies come from. This is what it did. Better than nothing & good for raising public awareness. Shame that they did not promote registered breeders & mention health testing & vet care etc. Overall despite the puppy farmer saying it was ok if done properly etc, which I doubt would really impress the public anyway, it was not exactly a luxury setting, it got the point across, showed enough horror stuff & was better presented than most of these type of things. Its a start. I hope it made many people think about this more. Poor bloody dogs though. What is wrong with some people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loving my Oldies Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) What really got up my nose with Steve Austin, apart from the fact that he supports the puppy farmers . was that he disputes the fact that dogs brought from pet stores end up in shelters and he was quite adamant in his denial about this problem . This from a guy who has been in the dog world for many years Well I think he shot his credibility to pieces tonight and has probably lost a lot of respect and hopefully business . The point about this claim is that it doesn't matter whether one single puppy sold in a pet shop ever ends up in a shelter. It is how that puppy is bred that is the major issue, as I see it. As someone said: if it has a uterus breed it. The animals suffer - that is the point that should be being stressed. At least "hybrid vigour" was raised. :D I agree that it's not whether the pups end up in shelters or not, it's the emotional wellbeing of these pups that concerns me most. Instead of being raised in a family environment for much of their critical socialisation period they are pissing in their beds with little to no human interaction, bred from parents who have undoubtedly not had any form of temperament testing, not to mention health testing. There were a lot of "breeds" in the story that I couldn't even tell if they were supposed to be purebreds of some kind or mongrels, breeding for type and temperament just goes out the window.Steve Austin :D Of course it is about the way they are bred and the resulting problems that cause a lot of these poor dogs to be dumped in shelters and Steve Austin was disputing and in denial about the high dumpage rates of dogs from petshops (i.e. puppyfarmers) as he wouldn't acknowledge that these poor puppyfarmed dogs have issues due to the way they are bred and their environment . I made this point because if ever you speak to/hear/read Pet Shops talking about this issue, they always bring up "the fact" (as they see it - I am not saying it is a fact) that very few pet shop dogs end up in shelters. And the interviewers never have anything to say about this because they haven't done their homework, or don't see the wider picture. In their defence, the pet shops always talk about the puppies never the conditions in which they are being bred. And this is the point that the 7.30 Report was focusing upon in going to those who have to deal with it: RSPCA, Animal Liberation and the ex Puppy farmer, Meg. I think many people who know nothing about this issue will be pretty shocked. I would hope so anyway. Hopefully there will be Part 2 in which some of the really bad raids will be shown. Edited March 30, 2010 by Mother Moocher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paganman Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Beats me how the practice of selling puppies in a shop is allowed to continue. Seems theres an endless supply of buyers who have little knowledge of how to be a responsible dog owner, buy an unknown puppy on a whim, only to dump it sometime down the track. Puppy farmers are no better than people smugglers and dont care if some die along the way. Why the government doesnt step in and put a stop to this practice is beyond all reasonable thinking. Steve Austin should be ashamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danois Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 To an extent its disappointing it was an ABC report. The ABC audience demographic is probably not really the same demographic of those who go to puppy farms/ pet shops for their puppy purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) Mita,Unfortunately, the average public person does not have the knowledge to go to the Canine Council/registered breeders. The average person sees the cute puppy in the window at the pet shop at the mall, the kids get to cuddle it and BINGO they have a new dog. They haven't given any consideration that this cute bundle of fluff will be with them for the next 12-15 years. And also that this cute puppy's mother is still in a cage at the puppy farm breeding the next lot for the pet shop. Agree, schmauzer, & it's why I agree with the folk who want to contact the 7-30 Report so a program can be done showing what the good registered breeders do. And how people can go to them for pets. I'm still meeting piles of people who honestly think only show people can adopt puppies/dogs from the show people (which is what they call the registered breeders). We went to a public event at the weekend. And, as usual our 2 tibbies got so much attention from people, for their good looks & for their wonderful temperaments/socialisation. As always, I tell people that's how they came from their good registered breeder. Had nothing to do with me! You're right. Every single person asked, but how do you find breeders of dogs like that? They have no idea where to start. Edited March 30, 2010 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schnauzer Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Mita,Unfortunately, the average public person does not have the knowledge to go to the Canine Council/registered breeders. The average person sees the cute puppy in the window at the pet shop at the mall, the kids get to cuddle it and BINGO they have a new dog. They haven't given any consideration that this cute bundle of fluff will be with them for the next 12-15 years. And also that this cute puppy's mother is still in a cage at the puppy farm breeding the next lot for the pet shop. Agree, schmauzer, & it's why I agree with the folk who want to contact the 7-30 Report so a program can be done showing what the good registered breeders do. And how people can go to them for pets. I'm still meeting piles of people who honestly think only show people can adopt puppies/dogs from the show people (which is what they call the registered breeders). We went to a public event at the weekend. And, as usual our 2 tibbies got so much attention from people, for their good looks & for their wonderful temperaments/socialisation. As always, I tell people that's how they came from their good registered breeder. Had nothing to do with me! You're right. Every single person asked, but how do you find breeders of dogs like that? They have no idea where to start. All we need to do is to get Westfield on our side and Pfffttt - there goes the Pet shops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shmurps Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 I agree it was the wrong demographic. However it's a start, now to get the ball rolling and have a 1 hour doco. To inlclude the dump rate, the shelter/pound side , heath probs and then where to buy and how to find a good ethical breeder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mita Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) I agree it was the wrong demographic. However it's a start, now to get the ball rolling and have a 1 hour doco.To inlclude the dump rate, the shelter/pound side , heath probs and then where to buy and how to find a good ethical breeder. Agree. I kept thinking, while watching the program. If only the commercial stations would show this... It's a start, tho', as you say. I'd also like to see purebred pride public events where our wonderful pet p/b dogs from the excellent breeders could just soclalise with people. These dogs are their own best selling point. I keep finding that it's meeting the dogs, in everyday events, that makes people ask the right questions. Edited March 30, 2010 by mita Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spottychick Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Are Banksia park and ACA the same? Yes they are This is why it doesn't matter how they portrayed him on this show - they were using him as a "positive" example of puppy farming - what a joke! http://www.govegan.com.au/puppies/?p=200 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christina Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) One thing that is never mentioned at all is When puppies are in pet shops what happens to those who do not get sold. The pet shops will say All puppies do get sold. The large chains also move them from shop to shop if they don't sell. Not all puppies do get sold. I have heard the worst dispose of them by shooting on remote properties. Others dump them at RSPCA. No idea what others do but it won't be in the best interests of the pups in most cases. They are a business. Businesses need to dispose of stock. This is something that is always ignored. It is another valid point against selling pups in pet shops. Edited March 30, 2010 by Christina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bindii Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 Best coverage of puppy farms that I've seen on TV to date. Certainly didn't have a positive twist to it in any way, don't think anyone would walk away thinking that they're a good thing. Brilliant. I hope it was seen by many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 (edited) As for the PIAA - from their website: "Formed in 1979 (as PIJAC) the Pet Industry Association is owned and run by its members, who believe in professionalism and high standards. The Mission of the Pet Industry Association is; through education, excellence, enterprise and integrity; to represent members and lead the pet industry." Maybe the members of PIAA should come and meet some of the dogs we have rescued from puppy farms/ex pet shop purchases. Pet shops are supplied by puppy famers - not registered breeders. Steve Austin needs to rethink his ethics. After last night's show, I don't believe that Steve Austin has any ethics. Edited March 30, 2010 by Ellie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas Posted March 30, 2010 Share Posted March 30, 2010 I had thought Steve Austin was a good guy prior to last nights show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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