Toilet Training In A Crate

[MissLotus]

We have a 1 year old CKC who's house train however since day one, we have had some issues with toilet training her in her crate and it's now driving me insane (I have posted some thread about this a few months ago) and questioning my methods again.

When we first brought her home, straight away, she slept in her crate and she would do the occasional pee at night. She doesn't bark or whimper, so I cannot tell if she needs to go. People have suggested in the past, it could have been how she was toilet train with the breeder and it will take awhile to break her out of the habit. I had divide the crate in half, so she couldn't pee and sleep on the other side. To this day, she still doesn't have full access to the crate. I would wake up about 3 times a night to take her out to pee. After a few weeks of this, I brought the crate into my room, as it's easier for me to be able to hear her. It took awhile, but she eventually got the hang of holding in her pee into the next morning.

About 6 months ago, I moved her from her room into her own room and it was touch and go. Some nights she was fine, other nights she would pee again. SO again, i brought her back into my room to keep an eye on her for a few months and I have not had an accident since. She would sleep for the full 9 hrs or so until I wake up next morning and let her out. 3 days ago, I moved her back into her room and 2 out of the 3 nights, she has peed. Last night, I woke up at 3am to let her pee, my partner took her out first thing in the morning (6am) to pee, but to my surprise there is still a pee mark on her bedding.

This is becoming quiet frustrating as she cannot continue sleeping in our room. Why is she peeing when she's by herself? Do I leave her in that room and wake up in the middle of the night to take her to pee? There are no accidents in the house when she is left alone. So I am really puzzled to why she would pee in her bedding. If i took her crate back into our room, guaranteed there will be no accidents.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated

[DoodleBliss]

Hi MissLotus. I'm not sure if this will help but something to share and for you to consider.

We have a new pup for just over 5wks now and we did (still are) crate training with him. He was doing really well for the first 3wks, being able to hold through the night after less than a week with us and during the day if we go out, we'll time ourselves to be back no more than 3-4hrs later and he'll still be fine. But then all of a sudden, he started peeing in his crate during the day if we were out, regardless if it was 1hr or 3hrs. Thinking it may be the smell since he soiled his bedding, I must have washed it a gazillion times... but e accident went on. A few other factors were considered, ie: timing - we didn't let his pee enough before going into the crate, bladder problem etc but upon further observations, they were not the cause

I did a google on problem with peeing in crate and learnt that another cause could be separation anxiety. And it turns out to be true for our lil' buddy!! Over the past weeks, he's gotten really attached to me as I'm at home a lot and I just didn't realised it. And during tat time he's also learnt that the clicking sound of the keys and the door lock being unlock means we are leaving

So since last week I've started to 'retrain' him by pretending that I'm going out. I'll grab my bag and keys, open the door and step out of the apartment, and then come back in after 10 mins making sure that he can see me. Did that several times the first day and then the same the next day but longer duration, and so on. He's much calmer now and has gotten the idea it seems as we've had pee-free crate for 5days now!!

For your case, (I'm assuming you have washed the bedding thoroughly with the right products) it could be that she's so used to being in the same room with you guys at night. It may be worthwhile that you try settling her down in her room during the day or a few hours before her usual bed time... leave her for 5-10mins and then come back to reassure her that you have not abandon her, also for her to gradually learn to accept being alone in her room. U could also try moving the crate out of the room gradually, as in start by moving it just out of the door with a so gap so she can still sense/hear you and eventually further and further. I really hope what I've shared will help. Good luck!!

[Gretel]

Why can't she stay in your room?

[poodlefan]

How old is she and at what age was she desexed?

I suggest a trip to the vet to check for any bladder infections and for hormonal incontinence. Shes' young for that but you never know.

Have you ever thought about getting a dog door? Seems to me that she's fine IF she can get out of the crate on time.

Edited March 24, 2010 by poodlefan

[MissLotus]

Double Bliss - thanks for you advice, it does sound like she could be suffering from anxiety slightly. I'll do what you have suggested about putting her in the crate earlier and popping in and out so she knows that we are still around.

Gretel - personally for us, we prefer our dogs not to sleep in our room. They are indoor dogs, but if we are not crate training them, they sleep in our spare room. Plus out room isn't big enough to have a crate in it and also there is the couple intimacy part to. ;)

Poodle fan - she is 1 years old and desexed. I haven't had a look into a dog door in the crate, if that is what you mean. She's booked in to get her annual vaccination, so I will also get the Vet to do a thorougher check.

Thanks for the advice.

[LuvMyCav]

MissLotus, what size crate are you using? If it's a 24in, I find they don't take up too much room - I have two in my bedroom but if there's no chance for her to stay in your room (and I wouldn't worry about the intimacy bit, they soon get used to it, lol) then I would suggest moving her crate very gradually away, rather than doing it in one hit.

[DoodleBliss]

Double Bliss - thanks for you advice, it does sound like she could be suffering from anxiety slightly. I'll do what you have suggested about putting her in the crate earlier and popping in and out so she knows that we are still around.

Gretel - personally for us, we prefer our dogs not to sleep in our room. They are indoor dogs, but if we are not crate training them, they sleep in our spare room. Plus out room isn't big enough to have a crate in it and also there is the couple intimacy part to.

Poodle fan - she is 1 years old and desexed. I haven't had a look into a dog door in the crate, if that is what you mean. She's booked in to get her annual vaccination, so I will also get the Vet to do a thorougher check.

Thanks for the advice.

Hey MissLotus... hope ur gal is doing better. Let me know if the suggestion helps.

[Elsha_UK_AU]

It could be seperation anxiety... my 15 month old sometimes pees his bed during the day, we do leave puppy pads down (as we don't have a dog door yet) and he has used them but I guess they go where they feel comfortable and if they are a little anxious, where better than your bed or crate. I don't crate mine although they have got a sectioned off part of our room so it is almost crate like for night time sleeps. My 12 week old pup will wake us up in the night if he needs to pee but it is not a common thing.

Is there a reason you don't want her sleeping in your room?

LuvMyCav - Thanks for the reassurance... My hubby was thinking of booting them both out next time

Susan

[Addicted to Dogs]

MissLotus

The first step whenever behaviour suddenly and unexplicably changes or behaviours like housetraining break down is usually to get a vet check. This makes sure that any underlying medical cause is understood and treated before you get on the 'dogs case.' Despite the weeing appearing to only be when you put the pup away from you it may still be worth a check up.

I agree with some of the others that anxiety seems likely as one of the underpinning issues - if not the issue - here. Think about how your dog reacts hen you're at home together or with others around - are they always following you around or cool with chilling out on their own? When you put your dog out but you are home how do they react? If you leave them with someone else are they calm or very distracted or even distressed by your leaving? When you leave them home alone how do they cope? Do they pace, winge, dig, bark or settle readily? If you see signs that your dog is not comfortable in any or all of these situations then it would seem to strengthen the idea that anxiety is a major factor - and specifically anxiety about either being separated from you and/or spending time alone. Unfortunately our lifestyles (and I assume yours) require our dogs to learn to be comfortable doing just that.

So now for some ideas to help:

• Put the crate back into your bedroom for the moment and get things back on track. By the way it's also okay to always have your dog sleep in your room - but I'm guessing that you have a reason for wanting them elsewhere in the house.
  
• Check out the home alone training information at http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/home-alone and practice it with and without the crate.
  
• Once you feel your dog is happy being left alone then gradually move the crate closer and closer to your door, then down the hallway and into the new space - rather than an abrupt in the room and at a distance. Make sure each stage is successful before moving onto the next - if not go back a step. By the way success is dictated by your dog's calm reaction and maintaining being dry at each step - not any other criteria.
  

If this isn't working for you or you don't feel it's practical then perhaps you could set up an alternative such as a puppy play pen (or baby gate across a small room or part thereof) and apply the strategies recommended at http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/puppy...m-amp-doggy-den which allows the crate to be a bed and gives a specific space for toileting if needed.

I hope you find something useful here.

Addicted to dogs.