Bitches That Are Not Easy Whelpers

[Whipitgood]

One of my bitches had a hard time whelping her last litter. I plan to breed her again in the future but will not breed her again if she has the same sort of problems.

But i was wondering what other breeders do to assist them through the whelping? I have read on here previously that some breeders give them oral calcium during labour (Ellz?), some give their bitches kelp during pregnancy.

The issues i had was a long time between pups (5-6 hours), atonic uterus at the end, maternal fatigue, long pushing times (for some of the pups. I seem to get this with the first puppy often). I had 2 decomposed pups that had died long before labour as well, the first and last pup. She also had a bleed about 3 weeks into her pregnancy after her post season bleeding had cleared. So all in all, it wasnt a pleasant litter for her or me!

Anyone care to share their tricks and recommendations, particularly for intrapartum care?

[SwaY]

I give Sandoz calcium between puppies, many breeders do this and find it very helpful.,

[Sandra777]

Calcium Sandoz in very large doses and glucose - but frankly if the bitch had a difficult whelping the first time and I believed she would again and I decided not to spay her I'd just book her in for an elective caesar, much less stressful on all concerned (except my bank balance).

[Jed]

Troy calcium is cheaper than Sandoz, and exactly the same. You can do all those things, feed raspberry leaf tablets during pregnancy etc. I give milk, glucodin or honey (for energy) and calcium during whelping.

Some bitches are just not good whelpers. If you encounter the same problem in the second litter, consider an elective caesar. And, if she is slow between deliveries, consider a caesar THEN. I would also get your vet involved, and have some oxytocin on hand to strengthen contractions.

It's very problematic - you think the time will be shorter for the next whelp .. and it isn't. You then hesitate to caesar a bitch who is whelping. Just when you are considering a caesar - another whelp pops out!!

My experience suggests that in a case like this, it is probably better not to breed the bitch again, as these problems seem to persist from litter to litter.

However, having said that ..... the next litter could all pop out really quickly.

You dither at 3 o'clock when it's been 3 hours, and you dither so long that the last couple of whelps are dead and you need a caesar anyhow (voice of experience).

You need a crystal ball!!

Edited March 19, 2010 by Jed

[jerojath]

I have a bitch who had a very difficult time first time around which ended with a c/section and half her pups dead.

She has since whelped two litters freely - 10 pups in about 3.5 hours and just this week; 6 pups in 2.5 hours and they were the largest pups she's had to date. You just never know!

The daughter of the same bitch appeared to be having alot of trouble whelping her litter.

She delivered one pup and for 3 hours there was no more despite a lot of pushing.

I took her to the vet and upon arrival found she'd whelped another in the back of the car,

and then proceeded to whelp the remaining three in the clinic as we watched with a cuppa!

So these days, I never rush them in for help but prefer to give them a good chance.

Obviously I wouldn't let a bitch carry on if she was very distressed.

I also offer Troy calcium syrup at labors start and throughout the whelping.

[Cockerlover]

I give my girls calcium tab after first pup born ,then one every hour after .,till whelp complete.

[Ozstar]

I also give calcium in between pups and oxy if she is pushing and nothing happening.

If she is taking a long time in between pups (no longer than 3 hours for me) or a pup is still born I would rather go to the vets for a c-section than bugger around. I have a great vet who is cheap and it is not worth risking the bitch or the pups for a few hundred dollars.

If you are happy with what she has produced and is a great mother then I would breed her again but have my vet on stand by just in case.

Leanne

[Christina]

I would not risk it for the sake of my bitch.

If you have to breed her again I would have the vet on standby. Run her in if she was pushing for an hour & no pup was born or be totally safe & book an elective ceaser.

Dogs can die giving birth & that would be my biggest concern given her history.

[Whipitgood]

Thanks everyone for their replies.

Ill do the calcium thing next time then.

I am not one to jump in and do elective caesarians "just in case". Having a general anaesthetic and a scar on her uterus has its own substantial risks too. I would rather trial a labour and if it doesnt go to plan, then caesar. Of course if i thought she wasnt going to deliver the pups and oxytocin didnt work, then she would be straight in for a section. I have oxytocin on hand and a good vet at my call the instant i want him - he is my husband!

So these days, I never rush them in for help but prefer to give them a good chance.

Obviously I wouldn't let a bitch carry on if she was very distressed.

Yes im inclined to agree. I would like to give her the best chance, hence looking for ideas here for the labour.

Im not quite willing to elective caesar her just yet after one bad experience with her, however if she does the same again then it will most likely be her last litter.

[Bilbo Baggins]

I use Rasberry Leaf tablets from 2 weeks gestation until delivery. From 6 weeks I use a naturapathic remedy to stop uterine inertia and use calcium sandoz during labour.

[Blakbelgian]

I am one for raspberry leaf tablets about 2 weeks prior to birth.

Good luck with your next litter.

If mother then a daughter has similiar problems whelping aren't we just continuing to breed on a health problem?

BB

[Rysup]

Please take care if you administer your own oxytocin. If there is a blockage you can cause MAJOR damage to your bitch if you give her this. It's not something to be dished out willy nilly.

[Whipitgood]

Please take care if you administer your own oxytocin. If there is a blockage you can cause MAJOR damage to your bitch if you give her this. It's not something to be dished out willy nilly.

Thanks Rysup, its OK, my hubby is a vet, so he is always on hand if needed. He is also reluctant to use it until absolutely necesary because it causes the placentas to separate early, therefore there is a higher chance of losing pups too. I usually try all other methods first.

[ellz]

Yes, I give calcium between puppies, but only if everything is progressing "normally" otherwise. If there is the slightest inclination that things are going pear-shaped then I'm off to the vets before you can say umbilical cord.

I'm considering another litter for Koda, despite her first litter that resulted in a c-section, but only because my vet feels that the first time was a non-event due to the number of puppies (9) and the placement of the uterine horns internally.

BUT...if she has issues with a second whelping, then she won't make it off the operating table intact.

[Joan of Arc]

This topic seems to rotate around every two years or so. I remember having a litter 3 years ago and rasberry leaf tablets were out of favour. I see now that some are favouring them again. I have always used them from about 4 weeks till birth. Then when advised by a vet and read the 'anti' thread three years ago didnt - that is the only litter that we ever had problems with. Maybe just one big coincidence.

Still think I'll go with the tablets again this time. But am always interested in others' views.

[ellz]

You won't get a change of heart from me. I used Raspberry Leaf once, over 20 years ago and will NEVER use it again!!

I didn't even use it on myself......wouldn't have even considered it and probably would have refused if even a doctor had told me to do so. THAT'S how strongly I feel about them!

[Joan of Arc]

Obviously that wasnt a positive experience but would you mind sharing. That's how others learn and I am always interested in how we all approach the same topic from so many different angles.

[ellz]

The puppies came out green and stinking. Healthy but not a nice experience at all. One of them was a red/white and it took nearly three weeks for the green colour to leave his coat. The smell was very "organic". There were no dead puppies or infection so it wasn't that. All these years later, having not used raspberry leaf for any other litter, I've NEVER had another like it, not even when there was suspected infection or neonatal mortality so I can only blame the raspberry.

[Ceilidh]

I don't use raspberry leaf, no reason not to, just no reason to. I also don't give calcium until the whelping is over unless there is an indication that the bitch needs some during whelping. I give a drink of biolac between puppies. I had one c section and the bitch was desexed and the two bitch puppies never bred from.

[sandgrubber]

Complicated. If your hubby is a vet, you have the Ceasar option at hand should the whelping go so bad as to put pups or bitch in danger. I've worked with a few UI bitches and have not found anything that helps -- both ended out desexed -- litters born by Ceasar. I'd say, be prepared for problem is the best advice. A Ceasar is a better option than dead pups or -- worse still -- loosing the bitch and the pups.