Want Your Blood To Boil?

[sandgrubber]

http://www.rspcavic.org/campaigns_news/ima...d_Questions.pdf

Copying the first two paragraphs

Is there a problem with pedigree dog breeding in Australia?

Yes. A wide range of serious welfare problems currently exist in pedigree dog breeds in Australia due to

selective breeding to breed standards. This is a major concern for the RSPCA. These problems include:

- difficulty breathing

- difficulty walking

- difficulty giving birth without veterinary intervention

- serious problems with their eyes

- serious problems with their skin

- chronic back and hip problems

Are the issues in Australia similar to those in the UK?

The documentary – Pedigree Dogs Exposed – uses specific examples about problems with pedigree dogs

in the UK, however, we do have similar problems here in Australia. All the breeds featured in the

program are present in Australia. The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel is the 4th most popular ‘registered’

breed, Pug 7th, Boxer 11th and Rhodesian Ridgeback 19th. While the full extent of these problems in the

Australian pedigree dog population is currently unknown, there is no evidence to indicate that they are

significantly different from those experienced overseas. Dog breeding in Australia is subject to the

same breed standards and breeding practices as in the UK. The only major difference is that the

pedigree dog population is much smaller, which means there are less individuals in each breed.:

[Are You Serious Jo]

Too hard for the RSPCA to take on puppy farmers so they target registered breeders instead. I'm almost at the point where I'll give up my plans to go back into showing, who needs to be made feel like a monster when you are doing the right thing.

[WreckitWhippet]

While the full extent of these problems in the Australian pedigree dog population is currently unknown,

say no more

[Sheridan]

While the full extent of these problems in the Australian pedigree dog population is currently unknown, there is no evidence to indicate that they are significantly different from those experienced overseas.

FAIL.

[poodlefan]

Dog breeding in Australia is subject to the same breed standards and breeding practices as in the UK.

EPIC FAIL

Edited March 16, 2010 by poodlefan

[SparkyTansy]

Is there a problem with pedigree dog breeding in Australia?

Yes.

ULTRA EPIC FAIL

[Are You Serious Jo]

Here it goes, and they have enough money to get what they want.

"We’d like the ANKC to prohibit the registration of 1st and 2nd degree matings; to open studbooks; and outcross then backcross where necessary to increase the genetic diversity within particular breeds."

[WreckitWhippet]

Here it goes, and they have enough money to get what they want.

"We’d like the ANKC to prohibit the registration of 1st and 2nd degree matings; to open studbooks; and outcross then backcross where necessary to increase the genetic diversity within particular breeds."

Thankfully I've now given it up and won't be subject to their nonsense, it's going to be a hard road for those breeders that choose to stick it out and actually care what their breed looks like, acts like and it's integrity.

[Are You Serious Jo]

What will happen is good breeders who test will be driven out, so only poor examples of the breeds will remain and be used as justification to change the breed. They already use dirty tactics such as badly bred dogs to represent all breeders. I wonder how many animal rights people are on RSPCA boards?

[SoL]

And yet when they phoned me up the other day to get dollars out of me they were soooooo enthusiastic about me being a registered breeder of pedigree dogs!!! Their hypocrisy (and knowledge) knows no bounds

[Andisa]

Their message is getting out - I know of a person who returned their purebred pug pup (not one of mine) because the vet (RSPCA VET at an animal shelter) said it was so unhealthy it should be pts on the spot - contacted breeder and the pug was taken to the breders vet - pug is perfectly healthy. Ran it on for another month and has since been sold - for a pup that was so unhealthy that it should be dead it can run and play like any other pup and cleared by the breeders vet.

New owners would not believe the other vet so decided to return the purebred pug pup and was refunded the $1100 purchase price......following week she purchases a Maltese X Cavie (insert stupid ripoff DD name here) for a "bargain" price of $1200 from the pet shop....well F*** me - tell me how that is going to be any better off....

[Christina]

Does this mean that all non pedigree dogs, the designer dogs that come from 2 breeds crossed with no pedigrees, the well it looks like a something or other cross & the we don't know breed

Are all healthy & free of all these problems ?

I don't think so but the public will.

Very misleading & totally biased.

People believe what they are told

& just don't think about or figure out what they are not told.

Our canine societies need to make more efforts at educating & promoting.

Maybe they should run some T V advertising from our membership funds too.

[justin19801]

This from an organisation which kills dogs in numbers too large to ever imagine. As Stalin said, one death is a trgedy, a million deaths is a statistic. What will happen to all these dogs and what will happen to dog ownership if people don't act. It's fine to raise the issue in forums but do we have the collective "bottle" to do something about it? The usual suspects will no doubt criticise my views, as is their right, but their holier than thou attitudes are what helps to drive these policies.

[WoofnHoof]

Does this mean that all non pedigree dogs, the designer dogs that come from 2 breeds crossed with no pedigrees, the well it looks like a something or other cross & the we don't know breed

Are all healthy & free of all these problems ?

I don't think so but the public will.

Very misleading & totally biased.

People believe what they are told

& just don't think about or figure out what they are not told.

Our canine societies need to make more efforts at educating & promoting.

Maybe they should run some T V advertising from our membership funds too.

Yep at the moment the RSPCA can say whatever they like and no one is challenging them on it, if the ANKC wont defend itself against an attack against it's very existence what are they there for? And I know many will just jump up and say they are just a registering body that keeps the pedigrees but their own mssion statement says otherwise:

To promote excellence in breeding, showing, trialling, obedience and other canine related activities and the ownership of temperamentally and physically sound pure bred dogs by responsible individuals across Australia.

To promote responsible dog ownership and encourage State Member Bodies to put in place programs to that effect.

To act as spokesperson on all canine related activities on a National basis on behalf of State Member Bodies and to pledge assistance and support to the respective State Member Bodies.

If the ANKC wont step up in response to this blatant attack by the RSPCA perhaps there is a need for a seperate purebreed advocacy group?

[Are You Serious Jo]

I think there is a need for a separate group because clearly the ANKC aren't stepping up.

[Christina]

I think there is a need for a separate group because clearly the ANKC aren't stepping up.

Just curious what a seperate group would be expected to do ?

Pedigrees would really still have to be registered to ANKC.

There are some seperate groups already

MDBA for registered breeders.

Some other australian dog breeders group where you don't have to be registered & can breed crosses.

We need the ANKC to stand up for their members in all relevant areas, which this is, & we should be asking for this.

[Jed]

BZZZZT! WRONG!! DO NOT PASS GO!! DO NOT HAVE A CIGAR

The RSPCA is controlled by PETA. The aim is to wipe out ownership of dogs.

That has been the aim for at least 20 years.

They are using exactly the same tactics they used to introduce BSL and anti docking legislation

Vilify via the media

Print any untruth which promotes the point

Reduce the numbers to oppose your viewpoint

Convince the public

Run a major media campaign, preferably with some untrue documentary

Get vets to support your cause

When the public believes the lies, introduce legislation

Purebred dogs are on their way out.

They've been on the way out for at least 10 years. Ingrid stated clearly what she was doing, no one believed her.

People will buy crossbreds. When there are no purebreds to cross back to, the crossbreds will be an endogenous stew of bad health, bad behaviour, and bad attitude.

And then they will use the same tactics to wipe them out too.

The public believed that documentary. Registered breeders came here and told them the truth, and they called us liars.

I've had boxers for longer than a lot of the posters here have been alive, and I've never owned or seen a boxer with epilepsy. Nor have most other boxer breeders. Now, individual boxers may have epilepsy, but it is certainly NOT a hereditary problem.

Whilst the public are jumping up and down about syringomyelia in Cavaliers, hardly ANYONE in Australia has seen it. There is no evidence it is hereditary. The incidence is 2% in Australia, and I suspect it is 2% in England too. They used the figures from Clair Rusbridges studies, which were from dogs suspected of having syringo, which were referred by vets in England. So now no one knows.

Bassets were severely criticised for "furnishings". Winning Bassets in Aust have very few furnishings, and even the owner of the dog shown in the documentary said he was surprised he won!!

Pekinese have managed pretty well for thousands of years without the RSPCA, incidentally.

The ANKC doesn't have the funds to run a full scale media campaign. The time to do it was 20 years ago. It's too late now.

If YOU don't like it, don't complain about the ANKC, do something effective. Do what they did in WA and NZ. Write to your local member, and tell him about it, and that he will lose YOUR vote.

But you wont, of course, it's too hard, and so there will be no dogs.

Edited March 16, 2010 by Jed

[justin19801]

BZZZZT! WRONG!! DO NOT PASS GO!! DO NOT HAVE A CIGAR

The RSPCA is controlled by PETA. The aim is to wipe out ownership of dogs.

That has been the aim for at least 20 years.

They are using exactly the same tactics they used to introduce BSL and anti docking legislation

Vilify via the media

Print any untruth which promotes the point

Reduce the numbers to oppose your viewpoint

Convince the public

Run a major media campaign, preferably with some untrue documentary

Get vets to support your cause

When the public believes the lies, introduce legislation

Purebred dogs are on their way out.

They've been on the way out for at least 10 years. Ingrid stated clearly what she was doing, no one believed her.

People will buy crossbreds. When there are no purebreds to cross back to, the crossbreds will be an endogenous stew of bad health, bad behaviour, and bad attitude.

And then they will use the same tactics to wipe them out too.

The public believed that documentary. Registered breeders came here and told them the truth, and they called us liars.

I've had boxers for longer than a lot of the posters here have been alive, and I've never owned or seen a boxer with epilepsy. Nor have most other boxer breeders. Now, individual boxers may have epilepsy, but it is certainly NOT a hereditary problem.

Whilst the public are jumping up and down about syringomyelia in Cavaliers, hardly ANYONE in Australia has seen it. There is no evidence it is hereditary. The incidence is 2% in Australia, and I suspect it is 2% in England too. They used the figures from Clair Rusbridges studies, which were from dogs suspected of having syringo, which were referred by vets in England. So now no one knows.

Bassets were severely criticised for "furnishings". Winning Bassets in Aust have very few furnishings, and even the owner of the dog shown in the documentary said he was surprised he won!!

Pekinese have managed pretty well for thousands of years without the RSPCA, incidentally.

The ANKC doesn't have the funds to run a full scale media campaign. The time to do it was 20 years ago. It's too late now.

If YOU don't like it, don't complain about the ANKC, do something effective. Do what they did in WA and NZ. Write to your local member, and tell him about it, and that he will lose YOUR vote.

But you wont, of course, it's too hard, and so there will be no dogs.

I don't think PETA controls the RSPCA, they are actually competitors for the public's dollar, their beliefs are the same though. Ingrid is honest enough to spell out her agenda. My experience is the RSPCA tells people what they believe they want to hear, contradicting themselves if it means more money flowing in and doing what they do best, killing dogs. Don't be fooled by the TV stars.

Apart from that I believe you are spot on with your assessment.

[Steve]

This isnt new but it gains momentum Open the studs book - outcross and then backcross - all we end up with is the same situation they claim we have now but with more diseases rather than less because of the new ones we let in when we out cross to another breed.

What the ANKC should be doing is fighting back and stop giving into them and start counteracting their uneducated opinions.

1.Tell the world dog shows are only judging dogs on how they look depending on their breed standard - the show ring is a beauty contest and that no reputable breeder only breeds with a dog which passes this test and not all of the other tests and screenings and research into ancestry the dog has to pass to be chosen to breed with.If they muck around with implmenting health criteria before issuing a championship that this will not prevent dogs suffering. Its not possible to test and screen for everything a dog could have or get into the future and dogs have over 100,000 genes not one or two.

2. Explain that when purebred breeders breed puppies they have several major issues to contend with that cross bred breeders do not.That is, future litters and how possible RECESSIVE genes and POLYGENIC GENES which may not show in the first generation will show in potentailly thousands of dogs into the future.

3. That close breeding used with knowledge is a proven scientific tool which can identify and eliminate problems which can stop thousands of dogs suffering into the future WHICH ALL PUREBRED BREEDERS OF EVERY SPECIES use when it in the best interest of the animals they are breeding. That if they take away the option for a breeder to use this then there will not be less dogs suffering.

4.That purebred dog breeders have ALWAYS - SINCE DAY ONE - had the ability to have the stud books opened and that many have done exactly that.

If they make certain screens and testing passes mandatory for championships, if they open stud books without clear goals and understanding of what they are doing - just because someone who has no formal education in genetics, and no experience in breeding dogs says this is what we should be doing all that will be is a PR exercise which will cause more dogs to suffer not less.

They should also tell them they are full of it because they dont have any idea of what the health of OUR purebred dogs are because there are no studies, research or figures to back them up and unless they can work out a way of identifying who breeds a dog which they think is a purebred and can determine issues in OUR dogs as opposed to dogs bred by back yard breeders and puppy farmers they are dreaming and someone had beetter start yelling back at them.

If anyone wants the MDBA to stand up for them or their breeds then they had better join because expecting us to do what needs to be done for those who are not members is not only unfair its unrealistic.

Join here - www.mdba.net.au

[Steve]

BZZZZT! WRONG!! DO NOT PASS GO!! DO NOT HAVE A CIGAR

The RSPCA is controlled by PETA. The aim is to wipe out ownership of dogs.

That has been the aim for at least 20 years.

They are using exactly the same tactics they used to introduce BSL and anti docking legislation

Vilify via the media

Print any untruth which promotes the point

Reduce the numbers to oppose your viewpoint

Convince the public

Run a major media campaign, preferably with some untrue documentary

Get vets to support your cause

When the public believes the lies, introduce legislation

Purebred dogs are on their way out.

They've been on the way out for at least 10 years. Ingrid stated clearly what she was doing, no one believed her.

People will buy crossbreds. When there are no purebreds to cross back to, the crossbreds will be an endogenous stew of bad health, bad behaviour, and bad attitude.

And then they will use the same tactics to wipe them out too.

The public believed that documentary. Registered breeders came here and told them the truth, and they called us liars.

I've had boxers for longer than a lot of the posters here have been alive, and I've never owned or seen a boxer with epilepsy. Nor have most other boxer breeders. Now, individual boxers may have epilepsy, but it is certainly NOT a hereditary problem.

Whilst the public are jumping up and down about syringomyelia in Cavaliers, hardly ANYONE in Australia has seen it. There is no evidence it is hereditary. The incidence is 2% in Australia, and I suspect it is 2% in England too. They used the figures from Clair Rusbridges studies, which were from dogs suspected of having syringo, which were referred by vets in England. So now no one knows.

Bassets were severely criticised for "furnishings". Winning Bassets in Aust have very few furnishings, and even the owner of the dog shown in the documentary said he was surprised he won!!

Pekinese have managed pretty well for thousands of years without the RSPCA, incidentally.

The ANKC doesn't have the funds to run a full scale media campaign. The time to do it was 20 years ago. It's too late now.

If YOU don't like it, don't complain about the ANKC, do something effective. Do what they did in WA and NZ. Write to your local member, and tell him about it, and that he will lose YOUR vote.

But you wont, of course, it's too hard, and so there will be no dogs.

I don't think PETA controls the RSPCA, they are actually competitors for the public's dollar, their beliefs are the same though. Ingrid is honest enough to spell out her agenda. My experience is the RSPCA tells people what they believe they want to hear, contradicting themselves if it means more money flowing in and doing what they do best, killing dogs. Don't be fooled by the TV stars.

Apart from that I believe you are spot on with your assessment.

I agree that PETA and RSPCA are competitors for money but I do believe that the RSPCA has been infiltrated by animals rights looooonatics.