Charlie Murphy On The Dog Whisperer

[Kavik]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXuj3Kss9c4

Warning: swearing but very funny

[BittyMooPeeb]

OMGawd this is so spot on!!

I thought I was the only one who didn't like Cesar's methods. Guess I was wrong

[poodlefan]

OMGawd this is so spot on!!

I thought I was the only one who didn't like Cesar's methods. Guess I was wrong

Very wrong. DOLers are divided on the subject. Many high profile positive reinforcement dog trainers are not fans.

Dr Patricia McConnell reckons “Cesar has put dog training back 20 years.”

What he can do with aggressive dogs is one thing. When he suggests that average folk use those methods on their pets is where he loses me.

[KristenLovesLabs]

I personally think you need to take what he says, and use what suits you.

There have certainly been things I've used that I've learnt from him that have made a difference. But I always remember I'm not a professional dog trainer, so I'm not going to go in and do the things he does.

I actually like Cesar, he loves his dogs, surely everyone in the world could learn at least that from him.

[all that glitters]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Ah they are probably jealous

ETA i still found that very funny

Edited March 10, 2010 by ~ShelleAndShyla~

[huski]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Whether or not he solves problems is a matter of opinion

[all that glitters]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Whether or not he solves problems is a matter of opinion

Sure is! We cant all agree

[becks]

OMG how long will it take for the keyboard to dry out! I really did LOL a few times!

[Esky the husky]

LOL

I enjoyed that

Thanks for sharing

It's funny 'cause it's true

[Monah]

:D My OHs cousin sent me this yesterday

she also sent another one parodying agility training videos where the guy teaches agility in 4 steps!! by telling you what videos to buy then his dogs play up at the end. Jeff someone, I dont know how to post it, sorry. very very funny though.

Jefs guide to dog agility, thats the name of it

[Vickie]

I thought it was hilarious!

Saying that, I watch & enjoy his show all the time. There are lots of things I like about him & things I don't too.

My biggest problem is the influence he has on the average pet owner with the average pet. He is often dealing with extreme cases on his show & while some of the methods he employs may be appropriate for the specific dog he is dealing with, they are definitely not appropriate for the average joe blow with his average untrained dog. I have seen quite a few people trying unsuccessfully to use Caesar methods on dogs who just don't need them. It makes for very confused dogs!

I have also successfully used a few of his methods with my own dogs & at the pound & have found they work exactly as he demonstrates.

Edited March 10, 2010 by Vickie

[Vickie]

she also sent another one parodying agility training videos where the guy teaches agility in 4 steps!! by telling you what videos to buy then his dogs play up at the end. Jeff someone, I dont know how to post it, sorry. very very funny though.

Jefs guide to dog agility, thats the name of it

OMG I LOVE that clip!!!! Everytime I watch it, it totally cracks me up. Jef is a VERY funny guy (as well as an excellentr dog trainer)! I have a friend who knows him well & she says he's even funnier in person...if that's possible.

Here is the clip:

[poodlefan]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Ah they are probably jealous

ETA i still found that very funny

No, it is not the whole point. The point is that people want to use his methods for problem dogs on ordinary pets. The steps missing when you do that are having the experience that Cesar does to diagnose the issue and to know just how far a dog can be pushed. Most pet owners simply don't have that much savvy.

As Patricia McConnell (who believe me, does not need to feel jealous) explains, Cesar's methods often take dogs up to and over their bite threshold. If you think inciting ordinary pets to bite you is an acceptable biproduct of a training method, then you have a different approach to dog training than I do.

Personally, I think Cesar tends to perpetuate the myth (not directly but by inference) that most issues with dogs can be solved by dominating them. Ah, if only it was that simple. I've read Cesar devotees on other forums explaining that any disobedience can be resolved by pinning a dog to the ground. I tend to think training a dog is a better option.

I think some of his messages are great - particularly on the importance of exercise. Others, are far more problematic.

[BittyMooPeeb]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Ah they are probably jealous

ETA i still found that very funny

No, it is not the whole point. The point is that people want to use his methods for problem dogs on ordinary pets. The steps missing when you do that are having the experience that Cesar does to diagnose the issue and to know just how far a dog can be pushed. Most pet owners simply don't have that much savvy.

As Patricia McConnell (who believe me, does not need to feel jealous) explains, Cesar's methods often take dogs up to and over their bite threshold. If you think inciting ordinary pets to bite you is an acceptable biproduct of a training method, then you have a different approach to dog training than I do.

Personally, I think Cesar tends to perpetuate the myth (not directly but by inference) that most issues with dogs can be solved by dominating them. Ah, if only it was that simple. I've read Cesar devotees on other forums explaining that any disobedience can be resolved by pinning a dog to the ground. I tend to think training a dog is a better option.

I think some of his messages are great - particularly on the importance of exercise. Others, are far more problematic.

Agree wholeheartedly.

What works for Cesar, works for him because of who he is. Take away his uber-confident persona and his experience/skills, and you are left with a method that the average pet owner has no hope of making work for them.

Cesar was televised at the same time as Victoria ??? from the UK. I believe her methods are infinitely much more suited to helping pet owners. She gave them excercises to do, changed their routine, and used positive reinforcement (ie showed them how to train the dog!) - most people would easily be able to do what she has shown them to do (except the one woman who couldnt cope not having the dogs on her bed LOL). Cesar walks into a home, chest puffed out, and basically says 'turn into me and your dog will behave'. There's a rather large flaw in that plan ......

[huski]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Ah they are probably jealous

ETA i still found that very funny

No, it is not the whole point. The point is that people want to use his methods for problem dogs on ordinary pets. The steps missing when you do that are having the experience that Cesar does to diagnose the issue and to know just how far a dog can be pushed. Most pet owners simply don't have that much savvy.

As Patricia McConnell (who believe me, does not need to feel jealous) explains, Cesar's methods often take dogs up to and over their bite threshold. If you think inciting ordinary pets to bite you is an acceptable biproduct of a training method, then you have a different approach to dog training than I do.

Personally, I think Cesar tends to perpetuate the myth (not directly but by inference) that most issues with dogs can be solved by dominating them. Ah, if only it was that simple. I've read Cesar devotees on other forums explaining that any disobedience can be resolved by pinning a dog to the ground. I tend to think training a dog is a better option.

I think some of his messages are great - particularly on the importance of exercise. Others, are far more problematic.

Totally agree

[poodlefan]

BMP:

Cesar was televised at the same time as Victoria ??? from the UK. I believe her methods are infinitely much more suited to helping pet owners. She gave them excercises to do, changed their routine, and used positive reinforcement (ie showed them how to train the dog!) - most people would easily be able to do what she has shown them to do (except the one woman who couldnt cope not having the dogs on her bed LOL). Cesar walks into a home, chest puffed out, and basically says 'turn into me and your dog will behave'. There's a rather large flaw in that plan ......

She's Victoria Stillwell.

I think a general problem with televised dog training shows is the impression they leave that these 'difficult' dogs can be turned around very quickly. Sometimes they can but what the owners of such dogs who are watching the show don't see is all the footage that ended up on the editing floor AND how long it takes for some of the methods used to impact on the dog.

There are few miracle cures to a problem dog. It can take a hell of a lot of time and effort to turn one round.

I worry that those owners who find themselves in this situation and that don't see miracle results will feel frustrated or inadequate and offload the dog.

[KristenLovesLabs]

She's Victoria Stillwell.

I think a general problem with televised dog training shows is the impression they leave that these 'difficult' dogs can be turned around very quickly. Sometimes they can but what the owners of such dogs who are watching the show don't see is all the footage that ended up on the editing floor AND how long it takes for some of the methods used to impact on the dog.

There are few miracle cures to a problem dog. It can take a hell of a lot of time and effort to turn one round.

I worry that those owners who find themselves in this situation and that don't see miracle results will feel frustrated or inadequate and offload the dog.

Those issues you mentioned are real, but not Cesar Millan's problem. Any dog training tv show is going to show a side of dog training that appears much easier than it really is. Not only are they done by experienced and confident dog trainers, but as you mentioned, what has ended up on the cutting room floor?

If people are stupid enough to act like Cesar Millan does when training their dog, when he states over and over again "Please do not try this without consulting a trained professional" then I fail to see how he's at fault for other peoples idiocy.

I love Cesar Millan, I think he's a great dog lover and a great dog trainer, but his show is for entertainment purposes only, it's on the tv. But then I guess that's why infomercials are so popular, because people will believe anything they see on the idiot box.

At the very least, Cesar tells people to walk their dogs twice a day, and if everyone did that, there'd be a lot less dogs in shelters, a lot less boredom and happier dogs all around.

[Kavik]

How can people be against him when his methods solve the problems? Isn't that the whole point?

Ah they are probably jealous

ETA i still found that very funny

No, it is not the whole point. The point is that people want to use his methods for problem dogs on ordinary pets. The steps missing when you do that are having the experience that Cesar does to diagnose the issue and to know just how far a dog can be pushed. Most pet owners simply don't have that much savvy.

As Patricia McConnell (who believe me, does not need to feel jealous) explains, Cesar's methods often take dogs up to and over their bite threshold. If you think inciting ordinary pets to bite you is an acceptable biproduct of a training method, then you have a different approach to dog training than I do.

Personally, I think Cesar tends to perpetuate the myth (not directly but by inference) that most issues with dogs can be solved by dominating them. Ah, if only it was that simple. I've read Cesar devotees on other forums explaining that any disobedience can be resolved by pinning a dog to the ground. I tend to think training a dog is a better option.

I think some of his messages are great - particularly on the importance of exercise. Others, are far more problematic.

Completely agree

[poodlefan]

She's Victoria Stillwell.

I think a general problem with televised dog training shows is the impression they leave that these 'difficult' dogs can be turned around very quickly. Sometimes they can but what the owners of such dogs who are watching the show don't see is all the footage that ended up on the editing floor AND how long it takes for some of the methods used to impact on the dog.

There are few miracle cures to a problem dog. It can take a hell of a lot of time and effort to turn one round.

I worry that those owners who find themselves in this situation and that don't see miracle results will feel frustrated or inadequate and offload the dog.

Those issues you mentioned are real, but not Cesar Millan's problem. Any dog training tv show is going to show a side of dog training that appears much easier than it really is. Not only are they done by experienced and confident dog trainers, but as you mentioned, what has ended up on the cutting room floor?

If people are stupid enough to act like Cesar Millan does when training their dog, when he states over and over again "Please do not try this without consulting a trained professional" then I fail to see how he's at fault for other peoples idiocy.

I love Cesar Millan, I think he's a great dog lover and a great dog trainer, but his show is for entertainment purposes only, it's on the tv. But then I guess that's why infomercials are so popular, because people will believe anything they see on the idiot box.

At the very least, Cesar tells people to walk their dogs twice a day, and if everyone did that, there'd be a lot less dogs in shelters, a lot less boredom and happier dogs all around.

I don't see anyone blaming Cesar because people try to do as he does. What people are pointing out (or me at least) is that people DO attempt to do what he does.. and that's its a serious pitfall.

I'm sure if Cesar stuck his head in a lion's mouth, some of his followers would try it too. What I believe is that if you want to follow a trainer's methods on your own dog, there are better candidates than Cesar around. However, I'm not for one minute suggesting that he's not a very talented trainer.

[BittyMooPeeb]

BMP:

Cesar was televised at the same time as Victoria ??? from the UK. I believe her methods are infinitely much more suited to helping pet owners. She gave them excercises to do, changed their routine, and used positive reinforcement (ie showed them how to train the dog!) - most people would easily be able to do what she has shown them to do (except the one woman who couldnt cope not having the dogs on her bed LOL). Cesar walks into a home, chest puffed out, and basically says 'turn into me and your dog will behave'. There's a rather large flaw in that plan ......

She's Victoria Stillwell.

I think a general problem with televised dog training shows is the impression they leave that these 'difficult' dogs can be turned around very quickly. Sometimes they can but what the owners of such dogs who are watching the show don't see is all the footage that ended up on the editing floor AND how long it takes for some of the methods used to impact on the dog.

There are few miracle cures to a problem dog. It can take a hell of a lot of time and effort to turn one round.

I worry that those owners who find themselves in this situation and that don't see miracle results will feel frustrated or inadequate and offload the dog.

The other aspect of Victoria Stillwell's show I liked (apart from the gawd darn sexy boots and car ) was that they did followups. So the viewer did get to see that after X weeks there was a certain amount of improvement, but there was still a way to to. They also covered a followup where the dog was not responding to training and the decision was made to euthanase. Very sad, but it did show the viewer both the positive and negative outcomes, and the time taken to achieve them. I thought it was a brilliant show for teaching the general public about training their pets, and the consequences of not doing so.

Or maybe I just liked the boots ................. :D