Are Mothering Skills Hereditary?

[sandgrubber]

I've been very lucky with my lines. All the girls have been great mothers . . . so broody that they get milk when another girl has pups . .. so tolerant that they let their mother/daughter/sister, or whatever nurse their pups. I can trace this back six generations. Generation seven, there's Molly. She has only had one litter. She was crabby with her own pups and is crabby with everyone else's pups as well. She didn't have much milk either. I think I'll try her once again; some people say they've had bad mothers come good on the second litter.

Have other's had a line of good mums produce a girl who isn't?

If Molly doesn't come around on her second litter, is it likely that her offspring will also be short on maternal instinct. She's a lovely girl, otherwise. But in some ways, a bad mum is worse than a girl that can't free whelp.

[whippets]

Yes I believe there is a hereditary component.

I wouldn't breed from a bitch again if she was a bad mother. I had a Newf that was a bad mother. I didn't breed her again.

[SoL]

I'm not sure, I thought it was hereditary but I also think it depends on the bitch to a certain degree. Zu, our foundation bitch, was a fantastic mother - free whelper, good carer and brilliant feeder - was amazingly careful around the pups, you didn't have to worry about her rolling on them or stepping on a pup when she got in and out of the box. Her daughter, Sunny, well, not so great for her first litter. I ended up having to babysit Sunny babysitting her pups. Everytime I moved away when she was settled to feed, Sunny would also get up and move away. I'm hoping it was because it was her maiden litter, she is due in a week and a half so we shall see.

[Jed]

I too believe it is a hereditable quality. However, I would give a bitch who was a bad mother the first time another go. Experience has led me to believe that there are lots of reasons for a bitch being a bad mother and with subsequent litters she will be ok.

Stress has a lot to do with numerous behaviours - eating pups, growling, refusing to feed, lack of milk.

Of course, if they are terrible mothers with the second litter, there are no more. 99% of the ones who were less than ideal the first time were more settled and better the second time.

Edited March 10, 2010 by Jed

[ellz]

I do agree there is some hereditary basis, but a lot of it does come down to the individual as well.

I've had bitches who have been fantastic mothers that have given birth to bitches that are lousy mothers, and vice versa.

I will give a bad mother the benefit of the doubt on one, maybe two occasions depending upon the circumstances. If it isn't a "text book" pregnancy and/or whelping and the bitch is lacking in the parental instinct department then I believe some leeway has to be given. Hormones/health can play a huge part in the temperament of any animal.

But if a bitch has an easy time of it and does a lousy job, and does a lousy job on a subsequent occasion, then she is removed from the breeding program and her daughters are watched like hawks.

It will be interesting to see what happens if/when I decide to breed from my American Cocker bitch again. She had the maternal instincts of a rubber ducky. She didn't labour successfully or show any signs whatsoever that she had read any of the whelping textbooks. Two puppies resulted from her breeding, one of which was euthanased. She had one puppy naturally after very little labour in the wee small hours of a Tuesday morning and then with no warning whatsoever popped out another puppy some 5 hours later. It was this puppy that was PTS at 3 weeks due to some form of retardation.....possibly due to the delayed birth. Once they were out, she fed them but that was about it and at 2 days I removed the weaker puppy from her and carried it in my bra, tube feeding it around the clock. I could have taken them BOTH from her and she wouldn't have cared. I pulled those puppies out from underneath her on more occasions than I care to remember. I'm still umming and aahing about re-breeding her, but I won't know if the above was an anomaly if I don't give her another go. I just need to be sure that I'm mentally, physically and financially ready for a repeat IF another disaster occurs. Interestingly, I bred the sire of this litter and his mother had whelping issues as well.....I wonder if they can be passed down through the males too????

And then on the other hand you have my Staffordshire Bull Terrier bitch who was OBVIOUSLY in whelp from the minute she came home from the stud dog (or so she was telling me at that stage anyway! ). Her belly grew on schedule, she had a day of morning sickness at around 13 days post mating. She was positively scanned at around 3 weeks, counting xray done about a week or so before she was due to give birth. She started to go into labour but not well enough for my liking so she had a c-section and gave birth to 9 puppies. All were healthy and strong. She fed them ALL until they were weaned. Didn't try to sit on them. Kept them impeccably clean to the point where at one stage I was getting a little worried that they weren't passing any waste....but it was just mum being a super-mum! She still loves the puppies that I kept (1 dog, 1 bitch) and spends time with them whenever she can just playing and teaching them how to be obnoxious!

The vet feels that she should be given another try and that the delay in labouring was due to the jigsaw of puppies in the uterine horns. If she has a smaller litter next time, the whelping may be natural. If she has another equally as large litter next time, there will be no more litters!!!

And it will be interesting to see what the offspring that have been retained from both bitches above do in the future as well.

[AmandaJ]

After reading almost every scientific paper I could on the heritability of behavioral traits I now take a very simplistic view - If they didn't learn it: it's hereditary - If it's been learned: it isn't hereditary

This would have made more sense if I'd qualified it with ---- she could have inherited more of dads traits than mums...

Edited March 10, 2010 by AmandaJ

[SwaY]

Im sure many bitches have built in mothering skills, what they don't have you must teach them.

It's your job, you made the choice to get them pregnant, you teach them.

If that means holding their hand, you do it.

If that means, showing her 30 times how to toilet puppies, you do it.

It may not be ideal, but you as the breeder have a responsibility to the bitch to follow through.

[shellbyville]

I have one girl who was not a good mum the first time around. She is an easy whelper, with no complications, and she had heaps of milk, but was cranky with her babies for the first week or so, I supervised all feeds 24/7 until the pups were over 2 weeks old. She came on heat quickly after her first litter, pups were just 4 months I think, so I bred from her again straight away and the 2nd time she was so much better. No crankiness with the babies, she kept them and the whelping box impeccably clean and was even a more protective of them. Whereas the first litter she didn't care if my other bitch hopped in the box and helped nurse & toilet them (which was very helpful). The 2nd time around she seemed to know they were hers and did a wonderful job.

I am not sure what her mother was like, as I did not breed her.

Edited March 10, 2010 by shellbyville

[angelsun]

I had a line of Manchesters that was horrific when it came to mothering. (didn't know it at the time I aquired the bitch) She had a litter previous to when I bred her, and smothered the pups...yes that's right...pulled them into her neck and pushed down on them and killed them for lack of a better description to explain it.

When I bred her and not knowing her history (funny how the breeder failed to share this info) she had seven pups....I spent the next three weeks laying on the floor by the whelping box pulling pups out from under her neck and uncurling her to allow them to nurse. When it was all done, three pups remained, one of which had been bullied by her and lost an eye prior to them opening. She had been removed from pups and was put in to feed them and clean them up only. She was rough with them and growly and hated the job and by 3 weeks, pups were fully weaned off her. I will add, that without a litter, she was one of the sweetest girls imaginable.

I found out not long after that her mother behaved the same way....diligent supervision when litters born but fatalities none the less as they smothered pups and would pick on one and toss it around without fail. The grandmother was the same....great dogs without pups, lovely structured dogs with solid pedigrees and horrible mothers. No amount of training to nurture was going to change that, nor do I for a minute believe that you can anyway! (I've just seen and had too many litters and watched generations of parenting to know that this sort of behaviour is hereditary!)

I was thankful that the surviving pups were male and that no one, including myself would have to deal with this sort of litter/mothering behaviour again...in the end, those males were all neutered anyway, so the line ended as there were no others that had that pedigree or even similar....I think that's why I attempted the litter, to protect the line, but since then, I've realized that I was just dragging on a problem that should have been stopped generations before.

I have had girls that simply didn't know what to do, but were not as described above....gentle guidance and supervision got them over it and future litters were fine...but when it comes down to being straight up a 'shitty' mother....it's not going to matter.

[Lesley]

Many years ago a very experienced breeder told me that if puppies have had good mothering, then they will be good mothers.

We had a litter of 11 and the bitch (first time mum) was scared of her own puppies and wouldn't have anything to do with them. The litter consisted of 10 dogs and only 1 bitch who was the last one born.

Being the only girl we ran her on for 7 months, and she was a sweet little girl but what we call a nothing wonderful puppy, so was desexed and went to a pet home.

The second time around the same bitch was a wonderful mum and produced a litter of 8 consisting of 5 dogs and 3 bitches.

Our current old girl only had 2 litters and was a lousy mum on both occasions.

She considered herself too high and mighty for menial nursemaid tasks. There was no cleaning dirty bums from her, so they were all wet wiped.

Her babies would be crying in the whelping box and she would be lying on the lounge next to them but no way was she going in and having those little gremlins chewing off her. That litter consisted of 3 dogs and only 1 bitch, who was titled but later desexed and pet homed.

Her second litter produced only 2 live puppies and her maternal skills were not much better, although this time she would clean their faces when they graduated to a puppy porridge meal. (YUM)

The little girl from that litter was incredibly beautiful and our hopes to carry on with. She titled, but sadly passed away too early.

Pictured with her Mum in my avatar, it broke my heart to lose her for she was very very special to us.

And who knows, she may have been lousy in the mothering department also.

[Stolzseinrotts]

Do I think it is hereditary, yes I do.

Some girls need help to learn / understand things and are in shock to start with. Some that aren't that good first up are so much better the next time. Some who aren't good first up will be the same next time.

I had a bitch who with her first litter was terrible at the job. After about 2 weeks she finally clicked on and did her job very well and fed / cleaned puppies up until they left. Her next litter she excelled as a mother from birth all the way through. Her line had great mothers in it and I hoped that her second litter was not to be a repeat of her first, it wasn't and I was very relieved at not having to feed and toilet the pups myself.

Other bitches I have had were born to be mums, these girls are super mums and worth their weight in gold and came from a great mothering line.

I think it is important to know the bitch line and the mothering skills in that line. Not always easy to do but I think if you wish to breed on than to me that is very important that the line be from known free whelpers and great mothers.

ETA; Saying the above, life is not always black and white. I have known some daughters of great mothers to not be good mums at all and some from not good mothers to be great. Sometimes things don't always go to plan. Mother nature is very unpredictable.

Edited March 12, 2010 by Stolzseinrotts

[sandgrubber]

Do I think it is hereditary, yes I do.

. . .

ETA; Saying the above, life is not always black and white. I have known some daughters of great mothers to not be good mums at all and some from not good mothers to be great. Sometimes things don't always go to plan. Mother nature is very unpredictable.

You mean mother nature isn't always a good mother (but some of her pups are ;) )

Sorry . . . couldn't resist.

[whippets]

Maiden bitches that don't know what to do but learn and ones that want to take care of their pups but arn't sure is entirely different to a BAD mother.

I won't tolerate a bad mother. She would be desexed and pet homed after the litter.

A bad mother (imo) is one that:

- refuses to nurse/clean pups

- growls/bites at newborn pups

- refuses to stay in the whelping box with pups

- and of course cannot be trusted around the pups (tries to kill them).

[angelsun]

I totally agree

[ellz]

So do I, but by the same token, I won't "label" a bitch as a "bad mother" until she has been given every opportunity. If there is every sign that she is not successful, or if I get "that feeling" (as I'm sure many breeders do) that the bitch isn't going to change....then a decision is made.

[BOSSFACE]

One of our girls, who has now had four litters, is an excellent mother for the first three to four weeks. No problems whelping, heaps of milk....you couldn't really fault her in the mothering department. However, for the first three litters, as soon as they started to become mobile she became extremely nervous around them. Trying to grab them etc as soon as they started to run around....way way too rough. Consequently we weaned at three weeks and put her babies in with another one of our girls. She finally learned on her fourth litter that she had nothing to worry about and was the perfect mother for ten weeks.

Her daughter from her second litter required a c-section for her first litter of three babies and unfortunately showed the exact same behaviour as her mother. She currently has a three day old litter and we will see how she goes with these guys. Hopefully she will learn more quickly than her mum. She is currently being an excellent mother despite another difficult whelping...though we did avoid another c-section.