Inside Or Outside?

[kiwioz]

This is a little complicated, so apologies in advance! I'll start by saying my dogs have been locked inside during the day for the last few years, so that is what they are used to. However, at my previous house there was the perfect arrangement of a small courtyard area they could go to the toilet in, without being properly outside. At the moment at my new house they either have to be locked fully in, or fully out, though I'm open to a doggy door.

If they are locked outside:

1. Biggest problem and reason they've previously been inside, is my dogs bark. Not all day nuisance barkers, and not just cos they're bored, but they bark at 'stuff' and there is enough 'stuff' to make the barking a problem. Also some things don't go away by themselves and I have to remove my dogs, eg. confrontations with the dogs next door.

2. In a few months it will be bloody cold here, and wet, muddy and possibly snowy.

3. Less of an issue, but Finn is very much an inside dog and doesn't really like being outside.

If they are locked inside, those problems are solved but instead:

1. Up to 10 hours without toilet access

2. A lot of restrictions on me, eg. can't go places straight after work cos I have to let the dogs out.

3. Again, less of an issue, but in complete contrast to Finn, Cal is very much an outside dog and is much happier out there.

If I got a doggy door and let them have indoor/outdoor access some issues would be solved, but not the barking, and I could come home to a very wet and muddy house some days.

Ultimately I know there is no perfect solution, but which is the lesser of two evils? How long do other people have their dogs locked inside with no toilet access?

Any help/suggestions/advice/experiences very greatly appreciated :D

[Golden Rules]

Keep them inside. No harm can come to them, and they can't make a nuisance of themselves with the neighbours.

I have a dog who prefers to be indoors than outdoors (he'd bark constantly at not being able to get inside if I left him outside) and he is left up to 12 hours somedays (I wouldn't let it go much past 12 hours) and he copes just fine.

Otherwise get your dog door but restrict the access to the house so they don't run amok with mucky paws! :D

Love your dear wee cottage btw! I'm jealous!!!

[all that glitters]

Keep them inside. No harm can come to them, and they can't make a nuisance of themselves with the neighbours.

I have a dog who prefers to be indoors than outdoors (he'd bark constantly at not being able to get inside if I left him outside) and he is left up to 12 hours somedays (I wouldn't let it go much past 12 hours) and he copes just fine.

Otherwise get your dog door but restrict the access to the house so they don't run amok with mucky paws! :D

Love your dear wee cottage btw! I'm jealous!!!

Agree Nothing wrong with having dogs indoors IF they are happy with that situation!

It's safer, it's less worry for you when you are away, neighbors aren't potentially getting angry at you, they can't dig our or escape, can't get poisoned, can't get stung by wasps etc. The only thing I think though is that if they are indoors all day up to 8hrs or more I highly recommend getting a family member, neighbor or dog walker to come at lunchtime to give them a toilet break and a bit of playtime. Breaks up the day into two blocks that way!

Edited February 26, 2010 by ~ShelleAndShyla~

[kiwioz]

Keep them inside. No harm can come to them, and they can't make a nuisance of themselves with the neighbours.

I have a dog who prefers to be indoors than outdoors (he'd bark constantly at not being able to get inside if I left him outside) and he is left up to 12 hours somedays (I wouldn't let it go much past 12 hours) and he copes just fine.

Otherwise get your dog door but restrict the access to the house so they don't run amok with mucky paws! :D

Love your dear wee cottage btw! I'm jealous!!!

Is that 12 hours without a toilet break GR? The house before last they were shut in all day, sometimes over 10 hours, and seemed fine, but I worry that its too long. Though I guess they hold overnight with no dramas.

Thanks about my cottage

Shelle that's a good idea about the break, unfortunately I've only just moved to the area so it will be a little while til I find someone close by who I know well enough to trust with that job, but I will keep that in mind.

[all that glitters]

Keep them inside. No harm can come to them, and they can't make a nuisance of themselves with the neighbours.

I have a dog who prefers to be indoors than outdoors (he'd bark constantly at not being able to get inside if I left him outside) and he is left up to 12 hours somedays (I wouldn't let it go much past 12 hours) and he copes just fine.

Otherwise get your dog door but restrict the access to the house so they don't run amok with mucky paws! :D

Love your dear wee cottage btw! I'm jealous!!!

Is that 12 hours without a toilet break GR? The house before last they were shut in all day, sometimes over 10 hours, and seemed fine, but I worry that its too long. Though I guess they hold overnight with no dramas.

Thanks about my cottage

Shelle that's a good idea about the break, unfortunately I've only just moved to the area so it will be a little while til I find someone close by who I know well enough to trust with that job, but I will keep that in mind.

If they are well behaved inside anyway and used to not having someone come halfway through I'm sure they will be fine

[cowanbree]

What I have done is section my yard so there is a small area off from the back door that the dog door opens into. They can't see a lot so it doesn't allow them to bark at everything but they can still go to the toilet. They tend to spend most of the day inside.

[Elsha_UK_AU]

My 14 month old CKCS is inside all day with no access to outside. We bought him 5 weeks ago from a breeder and he had outside access there. He is fine most of the time but occassionally will toilet on his own bed whilst we're at work. We don't make a fuss of it, just wash his bedding and move on. If we haven't given him access to a place where he can toilet, we can hardly be reprimanding him on it. In the 5 weeks we've had him, he's done it about 5 times.

He loves being outside, but is a rather "cloth headed" dog :D He will eat bugs, try and chew stones, bark at the neighbours (only on 1 side) and whine at them cos he wants to be with them. I originally wanted to lock him outside all day whilst we were at work but now have thought better of it. I am going to get a dog door installed and we shall see how that goes. He sleeps 95% of the day anyway.....even when he's outside, he runs around and then flops down somewhere to sleep.

I think you would feel better leaving your two inside, if that is what they have been used to. Just remember, that if they do "toilet" in the house, that you cannot really reprimand them as you haven't given them access to outside.

I do feel your pain, we bring home a puppy in 2 weeks and when we go back to work, there will be 2 of them in the house.

Good Luck in your decision.

Susan

[kiwioz]

Thanks guys. Shelle its true that they're not used to having someone come, though I've just remembered there was an ad for someone who does dog walking/care etc during the day in one of the local papers, so I can keep it in mind as an option.

Cowanbree I did wonder about that, but unfortunately I don't think it will quite work here the way my house and yard are set up.

Elsha I don't even mind so much if they end up going in the house - it occassionally happens, but I feel bad that they obviously held on so long they got to bursting point, and Finn in particular hates having to go in the house.

[Elsha_UK_AU]

Elsha I don't even mind so much if they end up going in the house - it occassionally happens, but I feel bad that they obviously held on so long they got to bursting point, and Finn in particular hates having to go in the house.

Maybe get the dog door installed then and ask your neighbours to report if there is extended barking. If they are used to being inside, even with the door door, they may still spend most of their day inside and only go outside to toilet or have a sniff around.

[Golden Rules]

Is that 12 hours without a toilet break GR? The house before last they were shut in all day, sometimes over 10 hours, and seemed fine, but I worry that its too long. Though I guess they hold overnight with no dramas.

Thanks about my cottage

Yes, 12 hours without a toilet break. All he does all day is sleep. Sometimes he won't 'go pee' in the morning when I leave for work so I figure by the time I get home he has must really be hanging out to 'go pee' but he just moses on out to the lawn, does a big pee, and then races to get back inside! :D

And yes, my reasoning is they do hold for long periods overnight, so no big deal during the day

[corvus]

We are in much the same position. Both our dogs are locked inside with no outside access all day. It is usually 9.5 hours at the moment, as I hurry home because one of the dogs is only 8 months old and he can't hold it for much longer than that, but in the past it's been 10 hours most days, and up to 13 hours on occassion. They have bladders of steel! We had a dog walker visiting for my younger boy until recently. Some days he doesn't quite make it, but I figure as long as he makes it most of the time I'm okay with that.

What I do feel bad about is coming home, letting them out to pee, then locking them up again because I have to go out again. They are young dogs and really need to get out and run around. I usually play with them or take them to the park or something when I get home. They are fine during the day. No peep out of them and they don't destroy anything. Just sleep.

[blacklabrador]

Mammals concentrate urine over night so they don't have to pee as often, so it's not really an argument for saying that they will only need to pee that often during the day. Like us, they drink and pee more during the day and then are able to hold all night or perhaps pee once. I don't think it's healthy for a dog to have to hold for 12 hours during the day - JMO.

Kiwi the dog door sounds like a good idea, but can you get bark collars for them? I don't like barking dogs and am careful not to let my dogs annoy my neighbours as I think it's highly unfair to make someone else suffer because of my choice to keep dogs on a suburban block. Barking can also be dealt with by a behaviourist as it can be a leadership issue (ie dogs feeling the need to be over protective of the territory and alerting to everything that moves).

If you have a dog door then your dogs can choose where they spend time and if you have one that likes in and one that likes out then that is the fairest option to accomodate both.

[Mas1981]

At our old place I left my pup inside when I went out because you could see right into the yard and I was scared that people might take him when he was smaller and then when he was bigger the neighbours kids used to tease him so I left him inside if we went out, once he was inside for 9hrs when I went to the Royal Show and no accidents. At our new place no one can see in and he has a nice patio area and some grass for him so now I leave him outside, I think it all depends on the yard and house set up etc.

[Gayle.]

Can you get them soemething to use as a toilet indoors so that if they really HAVE to go, they can use that? Something like a large shallow tray (think litter tray but bigger), with a thick wad of newspaper in the base. Leave it near the backdoor when they are to be left inside, but put it away when you're home so they don't get into the habit of going in the house when they can easily be let outside.

Dogs are smart (as you are no doubt very aware), and they'll figure it out quickly. Finn might not feel so bad if he has a proper place to go.

[NZVizsla]

Outside. Finn's a young dog, do you want to have to do this for the rest of your life?

There are some barking devices on Trade Me that you place inside or outside, and whenever the dog barks it lets off a high pitch squeal to deter them from barking.

Apparently these work.

So maybe try this? and test it out on the weekend? as well as check fences etc.

I really think dogs should be outside during the day, where possible. :D

[dee lee]

We have Honey inside when we arent home, its a max of 7 hours between when I go to work and come home again.

She wont use our yard for toiletting anyway. So she gets a big run in the morning comes with us to take the kids to school, gets a last toilet stop before I go to work and then is inside all day til I come home and take her to the park to go to the toilet again.

We started doing this when we adopted her late last year and she was fearful of the builders next door.

We figured it was better to clean up any toiletting than have her hurt herself trying to get away from them. I'd rather have a doggy door but she is too big so this has worked ok.

EXCEPT yesterday... Honey had obviously eaten something that disagreed with her and my MIL (who brings the kids home from school some days) walked in to find a massive pile of sloppy poo in the kitchen and had to clean it up. :D At least she had done it on the tiles.

[sas]

My 14 month old CKCS is inside all day with no access to outside. We bought him 5 weeks ago from a breeder and he had outside access there. He is fine most of the time but occassionally will toilet on his own bed whilst we're at work. We don't make a fuss of it, just wash his bedding and move on. If we haven't given him access to a place where he can toilet, we can hardly be reprimanding him on it. In the 5 weeks we've had him, he's done it about 5 times.

He loves being outside, but is a rather "cloth headed" dog :D He will eat bugs, try and chew stones, bark at the neighbours (only on 1 side) and whine at them cos he wants to be with them. I originally wanted to lock him outside all day whilst we were at work but now have thought better of it. I am going to get a dog door installed and we shall see how that goes. He sleeps 95% of the day anyway.....even when he's outside, he runs around and then flops down somewhere to sleep.

I think you would feel better leaving your two inside, if that is what they have been used to. Just remember, that if they do "toilet" in the house, that you cannot really reprimand them as you haven't given them access to outside.

I do feel your pain, we bring home a puppy in 2 weeks and when we go back to work, there will be 2 of them in the house.

Good Luck in your decision.

Susan

You are giving your puppy an area to go toilet right like a toileting pad? Toileting in their bed is not normal even if you don't give them a toilet area.

[Dog_Horse_Girl]

Our three dogs have been inside dogs from the time we adopted them. I'd prefer to know they're safe and secure inside than be constantly worrying about whether the greyhound had eaten any toads, whether Ruby was running around like a loon (damaging her already injured cruciate) or barking all day, and whether Molly felt secure in the great big yard or overwhelmed by too much space. We have tiled floors and while the house is open-plan, we have installed baby gates to separate the spaces. Ruby and Molly are kept together (neither wears a collar - just in case) and the greyhound is separated. I've come home once to find Lilly with the other two and a gate pushed over...but I think we must have had storms that day.

I recently started working shifts so can be away for up to 12 hours at a time and the dogs cope all right. I let them out just before leaving. I've trained them to go on towels if they can't hold it and I leave plenty of towels around (plus puppy pads) just in case. Ruby won't go inside unless she's got a tummy upset (rare), Lilly and Molly both use the towels and are very good at not messing up the floors.

[moosepup]

Mine have 2 doggy doors so can pretty much do whatever they like (which is generally snoozing inside) when we're home but are locked inside when we're out. It's more about me being a worry wart then anything else. Also, Moose has started riling up the dog next door so I can imagine him getting all the neighbourhood dogs going if left outside.

They both get put outside in the morning for about an hour to do their thing and get some fresh air and then I bring them in just before I leave. They are restricted to the open plan kitchen/lounge/dining and hallway which is all tiled so if they do need to toilet it's not a hassle to clean up. 99% of the time they can go all day without toileting. Moose will do the odd nugget but they are so tiny, firm and odourless that it's not a major drama. Then when we get home they go for a nice big walk. I think they're happy chappys so will stick with it.

[kiwioz]

Wow thanks so much for all the responses guys

There are some differing thoughts here, but it is all helpful to read. Its good to know that others have their dogs inside for long periods with no dramas - as whatever my eventual outcome turns out to be, this is what I have to do at the moment.

Bark collars may well be worth investigating. I want to do some behavioural work for Finn because of other issues, and thought about trying to do some work with their barking, but of course its so hard to enforce as the problem is when I'm not home.

An inside 'toilet' is a good idea too, or the towel idea, I could try that. I also like the idea earlier in the thread of someone coming to let them out on days when I'll be a really long time.

All of it will depend slightly on where I get a job too. I know my hours (teaching) but I could potentially be up to 45-50 mins from home. Whereas if I score a local school I can pop home at lunch time if needs be, and be home nice and early.

Ultimately I did want them to be able to be outside, and these ideas have given me a lot to think about. Even if I end up doing some combination of everything!