Training Talk Thread

[RallyValley]

Brennans mum we all have our own hanidcaps and hurdles to overcome and whats great about this thread is that you can post here and nobody is going to judge you - they are more likely to pat you on the back and say ...well done mate.

I think Rally Valley can vouch for what I am saying.

and the bestest bit is that we can all watch you grow

Keep up the good work and keep posting ;)

Yes if you go back there are quite a few posts from me about Toby's bike phobia, general anxiety ect. ;)

You will get there Brennan's mum! Toby is coming ahead so much! He still has off nights and will never be a 'normal' dog but on Thursday I felt like we were getting pretty close to being CCD ready He heeled so well (by my standards ) and did all three paces, just need a bit more work on stands.

[ness]

You have done really well with Toby RV and wish you every success in CCD when you get there. I so know what its like to have a "stressy" dog. I still can't get over the fact how far my stress head has come in the last 18 months. From a dog who you couldn't get a person in the ring at the same time, never mind get a hand on her to manage a SFE without her crumbling to a dog who worked the round she did for me last Saturday.

So moral of the story is never give up :D.

[RallyValley]

You have done really well with Toby RV and wish you every success in CCD when you get there. I so know what its like to have a "stressy" dog. I still can't get over the fact how far my stress head has come in the last 18 months. From a dog who you couldn't get a person in the ring at the same time, never mind get a hand on her to manage a SFE without her crumbling to a dog who worked the round she did for me last Saturday.

So moral of the story is never give up :D.

Ness your girl Kenzie is an awesome success story too! :D Even from when I met her to the videos of her now there is such a massive change.

(Hmm CCD has changing goal posts, at the start of the year I told Ptolomy maybe October... now thats getting close and looking doubtful.... maybe next October )

[Jodie Elijah]

Hi all, was hoping to get some advice? (am having a 'i'm useless' moment!!)

We've just recently (as of yesterday!!) got a beagle boy (currently entire, although he's booked in to get fixed next week). He's 15 months old and has only received the very basic of basic training - he will sit when he's about to be fed and will wait until told before he starts eating. I guess thats something!

Unfortunately that's about it really. He's a big boy (i actually don't think i've seen a beagle quite this large), quite solid and strong. My 11 year old son isn't strong enough to hold him still on the leash.

He constantly lunges forward, pulling on the lead. I've tried getting him to sit and stay (while on the lead) however this only lasts for mere seconds.

He is also hugely excitable, he's very friendly, however when he sees another dog, he immediately starts lunging forward on the lead trying to get to the other dog, and plenty of barking. I try to turn him around so that he is facing away, but he generally twists around and around. What I've been doing, is walking him just backwards and forwards in the lane behind our house, and when he started lunging/barking at a dog, i've led him straight away back into our yard (we have 6 foot fences that you can't see through) and made him sit back down.

If anyone can provide any tips it'd be really appreciated He's really a gorgeous boy, quite a sookie la-la really!!

Thanks in advance

[RubyStar]

I am still getting dumbbell mouthing in the retrieve and struggling to make it fun for her (not a natural retriever) unless it's over a jump, amongst a few other more minor things. On the flat sometimes she just wanders out about half way then stops. In part of my 'making it fun' I only do very short sessions with the dumbbell so that makes things very slow and with a number of different issues to separate and tackle it's a bit overwhelming I think I need to talk to one of the experienced triallers at our club and see if they will work through the individual issues with me.

Have you gone back to clicking her when she picks it up, just rewarding the pickup, and taking out the formality?

[RubyStar]

OH and I forgot to add - you might have to fight us for the numpty title :D

Thanks...will try to post more than

[wuffles]

Have you gone back to clicking her when she picks it up, just rewarding the pickup, and taking out the formality?

Yep, I rarely do formal ones as I'm just trying to get enthusiasm and less mouthing. Unfortunately the more I do the more mouthing I get (she rolls it back in her mouth THEN mouths, if that makes sense). If I give a NRM and try again it either gets worse or she refuses to pick the dumbbell up at all.

I told one of the instructors about the issues and said "she almost looks tortured when holding the dumbbell", I showed her and she said "oh... I see what you mean" I have been trying to reenforce her for holding it correctly by holding while she takes it and clicking for the right position in her mouth. I can generally get her to hold it correctly without mouthing if I hand it to her but not if she picks it up off the ground. I think I just have to be patient and precise in my clicks

[RallyValley]

Have you gone back to clicking her when she picks it up, just rewarding the pickup, and taking out the formality?

Yep, I rarely do formal ones as I'm just trying to get enthusiasm and less mouthing. Unfortunately the more I do the more mouthing I get (she rolls it back in her mouth THEN mouths, if that makes sense). If I give a NRM and try again it either gets worse or she refuses to pick the dumbbell up at all.

I told one of the instructors about the issues and said "she almost looks tortured when holding the dumbbell", I showed her and she said "oh... I see what you mean" I have been trying to reenforce her for holding it correctly by holding while she takes it and clicking for the right position in her mouth. I can generally get her to hold it correctly without mouthing if I hand it to her but not if she picks it up off the ground. I think I just have to be patient and precise in my clicks

What happens if you put it on the ground/a chair ect but leave your hand on it? If she does it without mouthing you could fade your hand...

[Brennan's Mum]

RV- That's fantastic . One of my long term goals is to complete a CCD trial with Brennan-- it will just go to show how far we have come.

Well we had another fantastic walk today. I am on a health kick so as a result we are doing longer walks. Today we went for one 50 minute walk rather then splitting it into 2 shorter walks. We passed 2 dogs in their yards at 8 feet away. The first dog was barking, and Brennan just was not interested. In fact, it wasn't until we had passed the house and were 11 feet away that she decided to look back at the dog.

The second dog, she saw, didn't bark but she did go to pull on her lead, I gave her a correction which she responded too ( she ceased pulling/ hackles went back down) so I praised her lots. We did a sit and some focus work for a minute and she was really good.

We hopefully start Obedience at Para Districts Obedience Club in early/ mid October which will be good. I decided to start her up at the end of the year thinking that at least we can introduce ourselves to the club, and it will give us at least 5-6 lessons which we can use to a) practise over summer, and b) 5-6 practises around other dogs.

[RubyStar]

Have you gone back to clicking her when she picks it up, just rewarding the pickup, and taking out the formality?

Yep, I rarely do formal ones as I'm just trying to get enthusiasm and less mouthing. Unfortunately the more I do the more mouthing I get (she rolls it back in her mouth THEN mouths, if that makes sense). If I give a NRM and try again it either gets worse or she refuses to pick the dumbbell up at all.

I told one of the instructors about the issues and said "she almost looks tortured when holding the dumbbell", I showed her and she said "oh... I see what you mean" I have been trying to reenforce her for holding it correctly by holding while she takes it and clicking for the right position in her mouth. I can generally get her to hold it correctly without mouthing if I hand it to her but not if she picks it up off the ground. I think I just have to be patient and precise in my clicks

I would try waiting her out. If she mouths it, don't NRM her, just wait until she stops mouthing and holds it nicely, then C/T.

[wuffles]

I would try waiting her out. If she mouths it, don't NRM her, just wait until she stops mouthing and holds it nicely, then C/T.

Unfortunately she'll spit it out before she stops mouthing it :p

Edit: She'll tilt her head back and let it slide to the back of her mouth, let it sit there and maybe wriggle/mouth slightly, then spit it out.

Edited September 1, 2011 by wuffles

[Nik]

Must be an Aussie thing as Annie does this too. I was told that when she brings it to me to turn and walk with her still holding it. Sometimes I walk backwards, but with her walking beside me at heel it seems to stop her spitting it out. I then just reach my hand down and take while we're moving. this was advice from a very senior member at my club (one of the very few who have actually trialled)

We've progressed to sitting in front with it now, but as soon as my hand touches the dumbbell she releases it. It's up to me now to make it look like I'm not catching it

[RubyStar]

I would try waiting her out. If she mouths it, don't NRM her, just wait until she stops mouthing and holds it nicely, then C/T.

Unfortunately she'll spit it out before she stops mouthing it :p

Edit: She'll tilt her head back and let it slide to the back of her mouth, let it sit there and maybe wriggle/mouth slightly, then spit it out.

My blonde retriever does the throw it back in the mouth thing then rolls it as she returns She looks like she's having a jolly good time with it! We lost considerable marks on it for the first time in our last trial. I have to sort of back chain it to see at what point she decides to roll it as I mostly only get it on full retrieves. (but I know she can do it other times so it's a matter of me training it out, but I've been lazy )

Millie used to spit if I didn't take it from her in a reasonable time frame (still does on occasion), but I still try to wait her out and gradually increase it. She's getting better I'm experiencing the mouthing most on leathers with her, though, but using the same principle in waiting her out like I did for dumbbell.

Edited September 1, 2011 by RubyStar

[The Spotted Devil]

Just going through this with Zig - if he mouthed it I said "ah well", removed it from his mouth and out of reach for a few seconds. I've built such value for it (had to!!!!) that he was desperate to try again. I will not tolerate any level of mouthing now - still a work in progress but at least it's progress

ETA: I started by waiting him out just so I could mark the behaviour but quickly stopped as he was learning that chomp, roll, chew, hold = reward.

Edited September 1, 2011 by The Spotted Devil

[wuffles]

Must be an Aussie thing as Annie does this too. I was told that when she brings it to me to turn and walk with her still holding it. Sometimes I walk backwards, but with her walking beside me at heel it seems to stop her spitting it out. I then just reach my hand down and take while we're moving. this was advice from a very senior member at my club (one of the very few who have actually trialled)

We've progressed to sitting in front with it now, but as soon as my hand touches the dumbbell she releases it. It's up to me now to make it look like I'm not catching it

Hey Nik! I've had the same advice and I agree, it does stop her mouthing and spitting it out when she is moving with me. But as soon as I get her to sit in front she will roll it back again. I think I will take some video of a few different situations and see if I can work out the point when she does the roll.

TSD, I am still having trouble building value. I use extra special treats and do minimal repetitions. I get the best reaction out of her if I move the dumbbell around a lot and hide it behind my back, but if I try a second time without doing that she is likely just to stare blankly at me

[The Spotted Devil]

How hungry is she? What else makes her tick? Is she always hard to motivate?

[Nik]

Annie and I have just discovered dog chocolate. I must say her enthusiasm is astounding me! And I break them into tiny pieces too. We have a trial this Sat that I hope she'll continue to show the same enthusiasm for

[wuffles]

How hungry is she? What else makes her tick? Is she always hard to motivate?

She is always very, very, very hungry. She is very easy to motivate.

I've never come across something like the dumbbell, though. If I try wait her out she will offer other behaviours - nudging the dumbbell, pawing it, dropping, sitting on it... she just doesn't seem to want to put it in her mouth.

[Natsu chan]

Well not to interrupt the discussion but I thought I would you all might like to see my new little obedience prospect. Well we hope so anyway! So far we are doing quite well but you all know how that is! She is a collie rough not that you'd know from the lack of hair.

[The Spotted Devil]

How hungry is she? What else makes her tick? Is she always hard to motivate?

She is always very, very, very hungry. She is very easy to motivate.

I've never come across something like the dumbbell, though. If I try wait her out she will offer other behaviours - nudging the dumbbell, pawing it, dropping, sitting on it... she just doesn't seem to want to put it in her mouth.

Great that she's motivated normally. Maybe you have inadvertently poisoned the behaviour???? Been there got the t-shirt ;) Maybe take a break for a while and then start again with the Shirley Chong method and a different retrieve article. She may well be picking up on your frustration too.

ETA: No soreness in the mouth???

Edited September 1, 2011 by The Spotted Devil