Training Talk Thread

[RubyStar]

I got my brand spankin' new shiny white UDX cones this week so decided to see what the dogs would think of them for the first time tonight. Not knowing the foggiest in how to teach this exercise, I just thought I'd place them down in a smaller square and C/T for any movement towards them. Both dogs thought the exercise was to knock the cones over with their paw and when that didn't work, trying to pick them up in their mouth must be it!! When that didn't pay off, they went back to their latest trick, walking backwards (which I must admit, I still get a kick out of )

After a couple of minutes, Millie caught on that she had to go inside the cones. This is a dog who has only had one or two short sessions on shaping the UD box so certainly doesn't know the box very well. I was surprised she caught onto the cones so quickly. I wasn't very consistent in my criteria Smack the trainer! I was clicking when she sat, then I clicked when she stood, then when she sat again. Now that I know she can sit in them, I will make sure I am stricter on my criteria next time.

Here is Millie doing her thing

To those UDX pros If I'm doing this completely wrong, please tell me!

I had Ruby going into the cones, too, but she still insists that walking backwards is the better trick these days

Edited April 8, 2011 by RubyStar

[Sue & Waldo]

Well it is 8 days until our first novice trial. I was told that Cindy is ready but I am not. No surprises there!

As usual it is our heeling that is the problem and my speed. I keep slowing down. I keep telling myself not to

I have recorded a metranome on my phone and I am about to try that. No idea what the other park users are going to think. I am already a source of amusement! I have a very bad sense of rythm so if anyone has any other ideas. Also how often do you treat when trying to keep a dog in position? Do you fade treat during the lead up to a trial? At least nothing else is broken (yet) and I am not panicing! I am still not aiming for a Q just a good round from both of us! (No panic posts yet!)

Wouldn't mind a pass though! Which raises another question. Some people at training will not enter until they can be confident of winning the ring, a score of 197+ and will withdraw if they can't get that. I am just not that competitive and happy with a Q of 175. Is that accepting mediocrity from the dog (or me) and should I push for higher?

[RallyValley]

I am training Toby for CCD. Maybe CD but I doubt it. We only get 3 'passing shots' in the CCD ring, because of that I want those to be nice passes, I am being quite fussy with Toby. To me, I hate doing a test unless I am confidant I will pass, if I am not it sends me into such a foul mood - watch out - . So with obedience I am not going to enter the ring until my dog is perfoming perfect rounds at home and very good rounds in a distracting enviroment.

Also the metronome is awesome ;)

[Mason_Gibbs]

I am training Toby for CCD. Maybe CD but I doubt it. We only get 3 'passing shots' in the CCD ring, because of that I want those to be nice passes, I am being quite fussy with Toby. To me, I hate doing a test unless I am confidant I will pass, if I am not it sends me into such a foul mood - watch out - . So with obedience I am not going to enter the ring until my dog is perfoming perfect rounds at home and very good rounds in a distracting enviroment.

Also the metronome is awesome ;)

Lol i was quite confident going into my first trial - he aced heelwork but lay down in stays, now i will wonder every time we do trial stays if he is going to lay down ;)

[The Spotted Devil]

Sue&Cindy - do what works for you There is nothing wrong at all with being happy with a pass. I know with my Dally that he will never be the perfect obedience dog - partly because of his inept handler but also his nature. However I'm prepared to sacrifice precision for enthusiasm. Now that I'm training such a people oriented working dog I realise just how far Ziggy has come. I still aim for great training sessions but the greatest compliment I've had is about how happy Zig was in the ring - and this from a judge who owns and competes with Goldens

[Sue & Waldo]

Sue&Cindy - do what works for you There is nothing wrong at all with being happy with a pass. I know with my Dally that he will never be the perfect obedience dog - partly because of his inept handler but also his nature. However I'm prepared to sacrifice precision for enthusiasm. Now that I'm training such a people oriented working dog I realise just how far Ziggy has come. I still aim for great training sessions but the greatest compliment I've had is about how happy Zig was in the ring - and this from a judge who owns and competes with Goldens

what a compliment-a happy dog. to me that is vital. My problem is that all Cindy's early training was before I knw what I was doing so her handicap has always been me. I just mean that she is my first dog I have really trained so she has suffered all my learning curves. She is very patient.

[Sue & Waldo]

I am training Toby for CCD. Maybe CD but I doubt it. We only get 3 'passing shots' in the CCD ring, because of that I want those to be nice passes, I am being quite fussy with Toby. To me, I hate doing a test unless I am confidant I will pass, if I am not it sends me into such a foul mood - watch out - . So with obedience I am not going to enter the ring until my dog is perfoming perfect rounds at home and very good rounds in a distracting enviroment.

Also the metronome is awesome ;)

I agree with the idea of doing a test to pass it is just that my pass mark for the next trial is for me to relax and enjoy; Cindy to be happy; and for her to do the figure of 8; and for me to keep an even speed in heeling.

[JulesP]

Well it is 8 days until our first novice trial. I was told that Cindy is ready but I am not. No surprises there! ;)

As usual it is our heeling that is the problem and my speed. I keep slowing down. I keep telling myself not to

I have recorded a metranome on my phone and I am about to try that. No idea what the other park users are going to think. I am already a source of amusement! I have a very bad sense of rythm so if anyone has any other ideas. Also how often do you treat when trying to keep a dog in position? Do you fade treat during the lead up to a trial? At least nothing else is broken (yet) and I am not panicing! I am still not aiming for a Q just a good round from both of us! (No panic posts yet!)

;) Wouldn't mind a pass though! Which raises another question. Some people at training will not enter until they can be confident of winning the ring, a score of 197+ and will withdraw if they can't get that. I am just not that competitive and happy with a Q of 175. Is that accepting mediocrity from the dog (or me) and should I push for higher?

I would NEVER tell a handler that they were crap. That is really bad instructing. Now unless you have given your dog to someone else to train, it is you that has produced a dog that is ready. Therefore YOU are ready too!

My aim is always a pass. I am not going to win. I got a little bit freaked out by the whole winning thing at the trial I did. But I know that you do drop points due to nerves so I usually aim to be sitting on a very high percentage in practice before I enter.

Anyhow you are braver than me. I got told I was crap and haven't been to training since ;)

[Sue & Waldo]

Well it is 8 days until our first novice trial. I was told that Cindy is ready but I am not. No surprises there! ;)

As usual it is our heeling that is the problem and my speed. I keep slowing down. I keep telling myself not to

I have recorded a metranome on my phone and I am about to try that. No idea what the other park users are going to think. I am already a source of amusement! I have a very bad sense of rythm so if anyone has any other ideas. Also how often do you treat when trying to keep a dog in position? Do you fade treat during the lead up to a trial? At least nothing else is broken (yet) and I am not panicing! I am still not aiming for a Q just a good round from both of us! (No panic posts yet!)

;) Wouldn't mind a pass though! Which raises another question. Some people at training will not enter until they can be confident of winning the ring, a score of 197+ and will withdraw if they can't get that. I am just not that competitive and happy with a Q of 175. Is that accepting mediocrity from the dog (or me) and should I push for higher?

I would NEVER tell a handler that they were crap. That is really bad instructing. Now unless you have given your dog to someone else to train, it is you that has produced a dog that is ready. Therefore YOU are ready too!

My aim is always a pass. I am not going to win. I got a little bit freaked out by the whole winning thing at the trial I did. But I know that you do drop points due to nerves so I usually aim to be sitting on a very high percentage in practice before I enter.

Anyhow you are braver than me. I got told I was crap and haven't been to training since ;)

Sorry you haven't been back to training. I am not sure if I am brave, a glutton for punishment, stubborn or plain stupid.

(Pity sure I am not brave though! You should see me if i think there are rodents about.)

[Mason_Gibbs]

Sue&Cindy - do what works for you There is nothing wrong at all with being happy with a pass. I know with my Dally that he will never be the perfect obedience dog - partly because of his inept handler but also his nature. However I'm prepared to sacrifice precision for enthusiasm. Now that I'm training such a people oriented working dog I realise just how far Ziggy has come. I still aim for great training sessions but the greatest compliment I've had is about how happy Zig was in the ring - and this from a judge who owns and competes with Goldens

what a compliment-a happy dog. to me that is vital. My problem is that all Cindy's early training was before I knw what I was doing so her handicap has always been me. I just mean that she is my first dog I have really trained so she has suffered all my learning curves. She is very patient.

I am much the same, Mason is the first dog i have trained to do anything so both of us are learning together ;)

[The Spotted Devil]

Seriously JulesP? ;)

Come hang out with me and train on the outskirts. We have lots of fun We can even be crap together

ETA: I don't know anyone who got it right with their first dog, or their second....

Edited April 9, 2011 by The Spotted Devil

[huski]

Sue, I always aim for a personal best - my dogs best and my best, comparing her to other dogs is pretty irrelevant and doesn't really serve any real purpose IMO.

I am quite a competitive person and many people tell me I have the wrong breed to be competitive with, but I like a challenge and ultimately I don't care about getting a pass or high score as long as my dog goes out and works with a good attitude.

ETA: Having said that because I am a bit competitive I do aim for higher scores with Daisy ONLY because I know she is capable of pulling them. But that's the icing on the cake.

Edited April 9, 2011 by huski

[RubyStar]

I entered Ruby before she was ready, just because I was so keen to get out there and trial. That meant I had 6 months + break between CCD and Novice because I wasn't confident she could work offlead (sometimes I still wonder when she likes to greet the judge and stewards!! )

With Millie, I wanted to be confident that she was working to the best of her Novice + ability before entering a CCD trial. Even when people told me she was ready, I still held off a bit more. It paid off because she basically got them in straight passes and all with placings. I'm competitive in the lower levels, but CDX and higher, all I'm after is a pass Actually with Ruby, all I'm after is for her to concentrate during the heelwork and get her SFE, whether that means a pass or not. Anything more is a bonus ;) Basically, I don't care what other people are achieving, I just want to better each of my girls' performances from the last trial we did.

You have to go into it with your own goals, Sue&Cindy. If scoring 197+ isn't one of yours, then don't worry about it! ;)

Edited April 9, 2011 by RubyStar

[Sue & Waldo]

I also aim for the best we can do together and high on my priority list is that we love it together. I am also competitive by nature and have learnt to compete with myself.

I started to think about this when I watched a fellow competitor pull out literally seconds into a heeling pattern because his dog "wasn't working well enough" and would not win the ring. It was my second trial and I have since seen him at other events and he is so compatitive and demanding. I admore his dedication but I hope it is not as stressful as it seems.

Anyway if I could bottle Cindy's heeling in training this morning I might even get tempted to aim for high scores!

[Ptolomy]

I also aim for the best we can do together and high on my priority list is that we love it together. I am also competitive by nature and have learnt to compete with myself.

I started to think about this when I watched a fellow competitor pull out literally seconds into a heeling pattern because his dog "wasn't working well enough" and would not win the ring. It was my second trial and I have since seen him at other events and he is so compatitive and demanding. I admore his dedication but I hope it is not as stressful as it seems.

Anyway if I could bottle Cindy's heeling in training this morning I might even get tempted to aim for high scores!

I have pulled my kids out after a few steps in the heelwork too.....why, not because she wasn't going to win but because she was stressed to the max. Sometimes I would get indications as we walked into the ring - she would start looking behind her, wouldn't sit at the start post and I would attempt to play with her, make her comfortable, we would begin heelwork and there was just no point in continuing, she certainly wasn't enoying it, so I couldn't see the point in finishing the round. Other days this same dog - would come out and work like a trooper.

One of my others I will pull out if I think he is sore, sometimes it is hard to see or tell outside the ring, but put him in a familiar situation (he has trialled for years) and it is easier for me to tell - so yep he will get pulled out too at some point in the round.

Finally, my little allergy girl, - she often gets pulled out. Generally she is either brilliant or bloody awful (just like her mother) and yep if she is not working well - she gets pulled out - why because I don't want to reinforce crappy work, I not asking her to do something she can't do or hasn't been trained for - so depending on her attitude we may not stay long, or I may opt to go onto the next exercise, or pick an exercise I think she would do well, so I could jackpot.

So there are three reasons why I may pull my kids out in the heework - take it from me, none of them are because I wouldn't win!!!!

Good luck next weekend Sue and Cindy. Some of my best rounds, the ones I am happiest with are ones that I have failed. To me when you first start trialling, its not about winning, thats the icing on the cake, its about getting into the ring, then getting your first pass, then its about improving what you do, your handling and the dogs general work, and then its about moving through the classes and finally its about getting a second and third dog becaus you have learnt so much that you are keen to try it all over again.

[ness]

I would also pull Kenz for shitty heelwork and have pulled Ness out of UD when she has been off with the fairies and its been like pulling teeth. Occasionally I will try for a second exercise but normally that one goes pearshaped to so now I don't even bother with that.

I have been prepared to pull Kenz out of stays depending on who we have ended up alongside in the stay line up even though she has been sitting on a pass at the end of the ring work (from ok to brilliant scores). I have also considered pulling her out because she is sore (well sore enough to struggle with her sit stays).

[RubyStar]

and yep if she is not working well - she gets pulled out - why because I don't want to reinforce crappy work, I not asking her to do something she can't do or hasn't been trained for - so depending on her attitude we may not stay long, or I may opt to go onto the next exercise, or pick an exercise I think she would do well, so I could jackpot.

So there are three reasons why I may pull my kids out in the heework - take it from me, none of them are because I wouldn't win!!!!

Agreed! I have often pulled my kids out a few steps into the heelwork, too. The way I see it, if they are not paying attention and are giving me something that I would definitely not accept in training, why continue and let them think that just because we're in a trial ring they will be allowed to get away with it?

I pulled Millie out this past weekend because I knew at the start peg it wasn't going to go well. It was 99% my fault (if not 100%), my routine for getting her into the ring was crap. I rushed it, I shovelled treats into her gob just to get rid of them, and nothing I had trained to get into the ring with focus was used. We took off at the start peg with her attention elsewhere, she missed 2 turns so that was enough for me to say thanks but we're out of here. So we didn't end it on a bad note though, I did the SFE with her because I know that is one of her stronger exercises, then we exited. I made sure I had a better ring entry routine happening for the afternoon trial, and this time we made it through and got a pass.

[RubyStar]

I have to keep quoting Ptolomy because her words are very wise and full of good info!

Some of my best rounds, the ones I am happiest with are ones that I have failed.

Me too! Definitely! I have had some awesome rounds with Ruby that I walk out with a huge grin on my face, where we messed something up to fail but it was just a truly awesome round. Then we have rounds where we have gotten through but it wasn't with the same pizzazz as she has given me in those failed rounds Example is from this past weekend, Ruby worked her little cotton socks off for me and I was just pleased as punch, even though we got no passes. Millie, it was like pulling teeth in her round. Millie got her first CDX pass, and somehow we also managed to win the class too, but in all honesty, I came away more pleased with Ruby's work than Millie's even though Millie is the one who got the pass :D

To me when you first start trialling, its not about winning, thats the icing on the cake, its about getting into the ring, then getting your first pass, then its about improving what you do, your handling and the dogs general work, and then its about moving through the classes and finally its about getting a second and third dog becaus you have learnt so much that you are keen to try it all over again.

;) ;) ;)

[Sue & Waldo]

I have no problems for pulling dogs out for the reasons above-but I do if it is because the score will be below 195 as the only reason.

I appreciate your help in thinking this through and encouragement for next weekend.

that my brain, heart and feet are all on the same page!

[wuffles]

Interesting discussion going on in here guys, keep it up! ;)

We just got home from our second CCD trial (a double). Did alright in the morning trial with 94 and first on countback. Her heelwork wasn't bad but it wasn't as nice as our last trial - but it was a new and difficult ground to work on so I'm quite happy.

Considered pulling out of the afternoon trial but as there were only 3 CCD competitors everything went quite fast and Ava seemed quite enthusiastic still. Anyway, she was a little off with the fairies in the ring, actually kept position ok but forgot what a halt was! With 10 seconds to go in the down stay she decided to stand up - never done that before - just stood there until I returned.

At least now I get a chance next week to get a better score than the 88 we would have got if she hadn't broken her stay

Edited April 9, 2011 by wuffles