What Breeds Actually Fall Under Bsl?

[GABBA]

I wonder if people still breed these dogs, i know pit bulls are still out there, but the more rare breeds like the Brasillian Mastiff. I asked this the other day, but i think the post was deleted.

I understand it is illegal to buy OR sell. Im not after one, just curious (i just got myself a dog - thats all i need for now)

[poodlefan]

I wonder if people still breed these dogs, i know pit bulls are still out there, but the more rare breeds like the Brasillian Mastiff. I asked this the other day, but i think the post was deleted.

I understand it is illegal to buy OR sell. Im not after one, just curious (i just got myself a dog - thats all i need for now)

Not here GABBA, or at least not openly. They've been banned from import for many years.

Personally I can live with the import bans on Tosa, Presas and Dogos. I've got nothing against these dogs in responsible hands. Its the fact they find their way out of such hands that worries me.

Definitely a dog that an owner should have to be licensed to own after meeting suitability criteria. If that were done, I'd have no problems with them being here.

[OzPit]

Personally I can live with the import bans on Tosa, Presas and Dogos. I've got nothing against these dogs in responsible hands. Its the fact they find their way out of such hands that worries me.

I'd like to see Presa's allowed in. They're not an easy dog, not suitable for first-time dog owners, but I reckon they'd go alright. A lot of people only know the breed from the attack on Dianne Whipple in '01, but people don't realise that was the first ever death casued by a Presa/Presa Mix (the dogs that killed Whipple were mixes) in the US. After that attack their popularity went up 400%, which is a bit sick, but I can't find any reports of another Presa attack. But I'm not too google-savvy so if you find any let me know.

Dogo's and Tosa's on the other hand, I'm happy for them to be banned. As much as I think the Dogo's are good-looking animals, no way would I like to see them or Tosa's here.

Licensing would be great, but if the councils are having a rough time policing the ownership of RB's I have serious doubts about the effectiveness of licensing for Tosa's/Dogo's/Presa's. The responsible people would get licenses, the irresponsible ones wouldn't. And councils are having a hard enough time getting breed ID for APBTs correct, Tosa's and Presa's I reckon they'd really struggle to get ID correctly. Dogo's though are pretty easy to ID in my opinion.

Unless it was a really stringent licensing system, like if there was a register keeping track of each dog's owner and location, and random visits by some kind of licensing officials, I doubt it would be very useful. Which is a shame I think.

[geo]

Personally I can live with the import bans on Tosa, Presas and Dogos. I've got nothing against these dogs in responsible hands. Its the fact they find their way out of such hands that worries me.

I'd like to see Presa's allowed in. They're not an easy dog, not suitable for first-time dog owners, but I reckon they'd go alright. A lot of people only know the breed from the attack on Dianne Whipple in '01, but people don't realise that was the first ever death casued by a Presa/Presa Mix (the dogs that killed Whipple were mixes) in the US. After that attack their popularity went up 400%, which is a bit sick, but I can't find any reports of another Presa attack. But I'm not too google-savvy so if you find any let me know.

Dogo's and Tosa's on the other hand, I'm happy for them to be banned. As much as I think the Dogo's are good-looking animals, no way would I like to see them or Tosa's here.

Dogo's though are pretty easy to ID in my opinion.

Unless it was a really stringent licensing system, like if there was a register keeping track of each dog's owner and location, and random visits by some kind of licensing officials, I doubt it would be very useful. Which is a shame I think.

How con you support BSL of other breeds? have you had first hand experience of these dogs? I have seen filas for sale recently (not sure on how pure they'd be)

Seriously no matter what your opinion is of these breeds you shouldn't be throwing them out there like all the people who think APBT's are man eaters!! and we all know where that has got us, thousands of innocent animals getting PTS.

Plenty of people have dogos as family pets, why are you happy for them to be banned?

What next American bulldogs, bull arabs, rottis, akitas, Standard poodles

[OzPit]

How con you support BSL of other breeds? have you had first hand experience of these dogs? I have seen filas for sale recently (not sure on how pure they'd be)

Seriously no matter what your opinion is of these breeds you shouldn't be throwing them out there like all the people who think APBT's are man eaters!! and we all know where that has got us, thousands of innocent animals getting PTS.

Plenty of people have dogos as family pets, why are you happy for them to be banned?

What next American bulldogs, bull arabs, rottis, akitas, Standard poodles

I'd like to think my somewhat informed opinion of the banned import breeds is a bit more in depth than the average idiot who thinks APBT are "man eaters".

In my post you'll see that I said a licensing system (if it worked) would be good rather than having the dogs banned. But unless "the man" comes up with an adequate owner licensing system, I'd prefer the dogs remained banned. Why?

Dogo Argentino - bred as a pack hunter (jaguar, puma, wild boar) and a family guardian.

Fila Brasileiro - herding, guarding, tracking & controlling large game

Japanese Tosa: fighting (yes, I do know that they "wrestle" their opponents, but it's a myth that they do not bite)

Presa Canario: guardian, cattle dog

We see that they're all obviously large, powerful dogs bred for a specific job which requires them to have a certain temperament.

Dogo Argentino: "It should never be aggressive" according to the breed standard. But it does have a "domineering attitude".

Fila Brasileiro: "With its owners and family it is docile." A good thing. But "One of its characteristics is its aloofness towards strangers".

Japanese Tosa: The tosa temperament is marked by not only "patience", "composure" and courage, but also by "boldness".

Presa Canario: Whilst he is "gentle and noble with his family, with great affection to his owner", the Presa is also "suspicious with strangers" and is "especially equipped for the function of guarding".

Now. Picture that these BIG, POWERFUL dogs with needs the AVERAGE owner can NOT meet have recently been un-banned. And imagine how many IDIOTS will be paying a BUCKETLOAD of money to have one of these "BADASS" dogs (in the idiot's opinion, not mine).

How many do you think will get the necessary leadership, training, work and respect they NEED?

And how many will be encouraged to rush at strangers walking past fences? How many will be encouraged to jump, bark, and growl because it "looks cool" to the idiots?

Sounds sort of like the plight of many APBTs.

Except now we're dealing with MASSIVE dogs twice the size of APBTs and with STRONG guarding/protecting/hunting instincts.

If they are un-banned, and there is no effective owner-licensing system available, every moron will have one. They'll end up being mistreated, abused, encouraged to attack. Then it will take us ALL back to square 1 with the BSL, and they'll try to put even MORE breeds on the banned list out of fear.

If it's going to prevent the mistreatment of certain breeds, and possibly prevent any terrible accidents from occurring because of idiots who mistreat their dogs, then yes, I support the ban. Pet ownership in Australia is not sophisticated enough (yet) to justify giving these dogs to people who do not have any clue how to handle them.

Quite frankly, BSL in Australian states is a more pressing concern to me right now than trying to overturn federal import bans that the average Australian pet owner isn't ready to have overturned. People's families are suffering with the legislation re: APBTs. I don't see anybody's family suffering immensely because they can't import a dog that never even existed in Australia before the bans.

So I'm going to worry about the pits first. And until the laws regarding pet ownership change to reflect an individual's right to own their breed of choice as well as some breeds' extensive ownership requirements, I'm content for the import ban to stand.

PS - I've seen Dogo's advertised online, in WA.

[geo]

I whole heartedly agree with your argument, and why they can be difficult for inexperienced dog owners, but where do we draw the line..

If APBT owners say it's ok for other breeds to be banned, we have no leg to stand on, that's my point. Our whole argument of, "deed not breed" goes down the toilet. Can you imagine us pleading our cases in the court saying how wonderful our pets are, then saying, "oh but you can ban those other breeds, they're more likely to do more damage".

BSL does not work, regardless of what breeds are on that list.

It does stop some morons owning what they want, but then they just go and get a backyard bulldog/rotti and give them bad names.

It would be great if the government had some structure around ownership/breeding and proper control of all dogs, responsible owners and breeders would have nothing to hide.

[OzPit]

I whole heartedly agree with your argument, and why they can be difficult for inexperienced dog owners, but where do we draw the line..

If APBT owners say it's ok for other breeds to be banned, we have no leg to stand on, that's my point. Our whole argument of, "deed not breed" goes down the toilet. Can you imagine us pleading our cases in the court saying how wonderful our pets are, then saying, "oh but you can ban those other breeds, they're more likely to do more damage".

BSL does not work, regardless of what breeds are on that list.

It does stop some morons owning what they want, but then they just go and get a backyard bulldog/rotti and give them bad names.

It would be great if the government had some structure around ownership/breeding and proper control of all dogs, responsible owners and breeders would have nothing to hide.

Point taken.

I was unaware of how my point may be taken, e.g. "oh but you can ban those other breeds, they're more likely to do damage"

Frankly I think if BSL does get overturned, I'd like to see APBT owners licensed, because as marvellous as they are, they're not for inexperienced dog owners either. But again, it'd be nearly impossible to monitor such a scheme.

So what we're left with is 5 prohibited imports (though I've heard the import ban isn't stopping the importation of one of those breeds).

4 of those were never in Australia before the law came in.

And 1 of them is now a prohibited import & RB in the Australian States.

If we assume we start in our own "backyard" so to speak, what do we do?

Do we work on getting the APBT "undeclared" as a RB? (As well as the other breeds deemed "dangerous" in varying local councils?)

Then work on having the import ban on APBTs lifted?

Then work on having the other 4 import bans lifted?

If all that is achieved, I seriously think it won't last long. If all those 5 breeds become just like your other, regular, non-RB breeds, there's going to be a huge wave of "popularity" and it's going to come from all the wrong people. It'll take us back to where we are now.

I'd like to see more action groups, more public demonstrations of the dogs' temperaments (and I'm talking APBTs, Rotties, Dobes, GSDs, Belgians, Bullmastiffs, DDBs, Boxers, Amstaffs, SBTs, any breed that Joe Public is likely to be misinformed about). Active lobbying for the laws to change, that is not excessively emotional - getting veterinarians, trainers, behaviourists, breeders, shelter/pound operators to be advocates for the group.

Is there a national action group to overturn this? State action groups?

If there were a way to get one state at a time to get rid of BSL, and then overturn the federal import ban, we'd have half the battle won.

The other half would be the harder part. Keeping those breeds, ALL breeds actually, safe from BSL in the long-term.

I think a license for dog ownership would be a start. Like your idea re: structure around ownership/breeding. If you need a license to own a snake/frog/turtle why not a dog?

Sorry for rambling.

[geo]

OZ pit,

I think firstly, Australia needs a federal law on this and not local councils doing as they please.

Also if BSL and import bans were overturned without proper controls in place, you're dead right we would be back to breed banning with in no time.

I've phoned a couple of the councils that i've lived in and asked them about their requirements on restricted breeds, why they have them, etc...

Most of them don't get back to me or the office clerk says, "i dunno"! or sadly bow to misrepresented public opinion.

It's hard to find out what is actively being done, many apbt owners keep their dogs out of the general public and aren't likely to take their dog wherever the Animal control officers are going to be.

So i'll keep phoning councillors and asking them what they're doing about it.

I really hope it changes soon.

geo

[bulldogz4eva]

You'd hear of them if the Filo Brasiliero were allowed. They are 45 kg+ dogs, bred to be highly intolerant of humans outside the family. Original purpose: Capture (maim and kill acceptable) runaway slaves. Still used to protect cattle from cattle rustlers and jaguars . . . perhaps also protect children from kidnapping (kidnapping for ransom is a big thing in some areas of Brasil). They are only shown in specialty shows in the US. Require a judge that can handle a breed where it is acceptable (by breed standard) for the dog to bite the judge and unacceptable for the dog to be tolerant or (breed-standard forbid) friendly toward strangers. Obviously, feeling the testies is not safe practice. Lovely, strong mastiff-type dogs. But too dangerous for general circulation.

I don't support BSL with respect to the APBT . . . but think it is sensible for any breed where the breed standard supports and requires temperament only suitable to environments where extreme human aggression or dog aggression is required. If the APBT were still being advertised as a dog suited to pit fights, I would also support BSL for the APBT.

Why is it every time BSL gets mentioned you jump on the Fila band wagon.Its Fila not Filo,Filo is a type of pastry.They werent bred to maim and kill as slaves were a commodity.They were bred to run them down and catch them.Fila in old Portuguese means to 'seize',just the same as the bull mastiff was bred to run down and hold poachers not to kill them.They have been used to protect children from kidnapping and I know people that run an orphanage in Thailand that keep a couple of them and also knew a guy that sold dogs to a fella that ran an orphanage on the Texas/Mexican border.Bottom line is when raised with children they love them and will protect them with their life.Its not acceptable for the dog to bite the judge its acceptable when agitated for the dog to want to bite the judge and not show fear as this is his true nature to confront a threat.

Like I have said before you dont have to worry as their is none here and there is never going to be.

[bulldogz4eva]

I'd like to see Presa's allowed in. They're not an easy dog, not suitable for first-time dog owners, but I reckon they'd go alright. A lot of people only know the breed from the attack on Dianne Whipple in '01, but people don't realise that was the first ever death casued by a Presa/Presa Mix (the dogs that killed Whipple were mixes) in the US. After that attack their popularity went up 400%, which is a bit sick, but I can't find any reports of another Presa attack. But I'm not too google-savvy so if you find any let me know.

Dogo's and Tosa's on the other hand, I'm happy for them to be banned. As much as I think the Dogo's are good-looking animals, no way would I like to see them or Tosa's here.

Licensing would be great, but if the councils are having a rough time policing the ownership of RB's I have serious doubts about the effectiveness of licensing for Tosa's/Dogo's/Presa's. The responsible people would get licenses, the irresponsible ones wouldn't. And councils are having a hard enough time getting breed ID for APBTs correct, Tosa's and Presa's I reckon they'd really struggle to get ID correctly. Dogo's though are pretty easy to ID in my opinion.

Unless it was a really stringent licensing system, like if there was a register keeping track of each dog's owner and location, and random visits by some kind of licensing officials, I doubt it would be very useful. Which is a shame I think.

Why is it that you think that Presa's should be allowed and Dogo's or Tosa's shouldnt?A well bred Presa is probably a lot more dog than a dogo.I dont think that any of them should be allowed to be owned by just anyone,pitbulls included but I also dont think you can single any one breed out as that is still BSL.There are dogs that havent made it to these shores yet that pose more risk than the breeds mentioned but give it time and they will as they arent banned,Under the right ownership they wont pose a threat.I agree in restrictions not outright bans.If they licenced certain breeds and visited the premises before issuing a licence and deemd the people worthy of owning one all good and well if they can prove that they are capable of containing,training exercising and not causing a general nuisance.Its nice to dream of a perfect world.I also agree that It probably wouldnt work becuase its not the licenced people its the ones they sell too and because some people worship money more than anything and will put that above all else and dogs will get into the wrong hands.Greed drives some people.Its the nature of the beast.

[sandgrubber]

If the APBT were still being advertised as a dog suited to pit fights, I would also support BSL for the APBT.

I don't understand this point.

A proper, game-bred APBT is a dog suited to pit fights.

That it's a disgusting practice and one which is thankfully outlawed is irrelevant, as is the fact that nobody in their right mind would "advertise" them as such.

But it's a fact. The dogs are bred to enjoy fighting another dog and to not give up. Does this mean you do support BSL, because they are bred to enjoy fighting other dogs?

I don't think there's a breed standard for the APBT in Australia, though I may be wrong. but yes, if there were a breed standard that implied DA was good, I would support BSL. If an animal is deliberately bred, up front, according to a recognised standard, to be dangerous to other animals (or people) I think it is appropriate that the Law step in and make sure there are provisions . . . eg, extreme penalties for allowing the dog to run free, requirements to hold liability insurance, restriction of the breed from off-lead dog parks, etc. that protect the public from idiots that favor a breed out of a macho taste for brawn and potential blood sport.

[tybrax]

The is no breed standard in Aus for the APBT.

[Adnil444]

I wonder if people still breed these dogs, i know pit bulls are still out there, but the more rare breeds like the Brasillian Mastiff. I asked this the other day, but i think the post was deleted.

I understand it is illegal to buy OR sell. Im not after one, just curious (i just got myself a dog - thats all i need for now)

Not here GABBA, or at least not openly. They've been banned from import for many years.

Personally I can live with the import bans on Tosa, Presas and Dogos. I've got nothing against these dogs in responsible hands. Its the fact they find their way out of such hands that worries me.

Definitely a dog that an owner should have to be licensed to own after meeting suitability criteria. If that were done, I'd have no problems with them being here.

This is where the problem lies - the fact is they WILL end up in the wrong hands and they will cause enormous damage to other animals and people. I have tried to understand why it is that the certain people own these types of dogs - you don't see many amstaffs, pitty type dogs etc in the middle to upper classes (I'm not trying to be snobby here, but stating a fact), is it because there are more lawyers in these areas that don't want a legal situation on their hands if something goes wrong, have these people researched the breed of dog they want more so than others that just want a status symbol etc. Can anyone explain this to me - I'm just curious.

If these banned dogs were allowed in, you can bet your bottom dollar you won't find them in Mosman, Northern Beaches (Sydney), or any of the other middle to upper suburbs of different states. They will be found in areas where education maybe lacking and responsible dog ownership is not encouraged. You will also find that the backyard breeders, making a quick dollar, but not being a registered breeder will breed from the wrong dogs for the wrong reasons and sell to the wrong people.

I'm all for responsible people having these dogs, under strict guidelines, but history has shown that this does not work, will not work and can easily be twisted - look at the drug trade in Australia. All the rules in the world cannot stop this trade, it will continue as will the wrong people having the wrong type of dog. I also agree that any dog can become aggressive, but not every dog will kill, this again is a big difference when we are talking about BSL - these dogs were bred to kill or be killed. Just like a beagle was bred to sniff a scent, a trait that continues with them always, these BSL dogs will always have that instinct and only an extremely dedicated owner/trainer should be allowed to own them, but for the reasons stated above, this won't happen, they will find there way into the general community and into the wrong hands.

With so many wonderful breeds to choose from, why does anyone want a BSL breed - all dogs are loyal, all dogs love you, it just isn't worth the risk.

[Sam&Saki]

I'd like to think my somewhat informed opinion of the banned import breeds is a bit more in depth than the average idiot who thinks APBT are "man eaters".

In my post you'll see that I said a licensing system (if it worked) would be good rather than having the dogs banned. But unless "the man" comes up with an adequate owner licensing system, I'd prefer the dogs remained banned. Why?

Dogo Argentino - bred as a pack hunter (jaguar, puma, wild boar) and a family guardian.

Fila Brasileiro - herding, guarding, tracking & controlling large game

Japanese Tosa: fighting (yes, I do know that they "wrestle" their opponents, but it's a myth that they do not bite)

Presa Canario: guardian, cattle dog

We see that they're all obviously large, powerful dogs bred for a specific job which requires them to have a certain temperament.

Dogo Argentino: "It should never be aggressive" according to the breed standard. But it does have a "domineering attitude".

Fila Brasileiro: "With its owners and family it is docile." A good thing. But "One of its characteristics is its aloofness towards strangers".

Japanese Tosa: The tosa temperament is marked by not only "patience", "composure" and courage, but also by "boldness".

Presa Canario: Whilst he is "gentle and noble with his family, with great affection to his owner", the Presa is also "suspicious with strangers" and is "especially equipped for the function of guarding".

You can't be serious. If you wanted every breed that had "aloofness", "dominance" or "guarding" in the breed standard banned; there'd be very few breeds left.

You really want Huskies, Malamutes, Akitas and most spitz breeds banned?

Most Mastiff breeds?

Ridgies and some Bully breeds?

Maremmas and CAOs and all the livestock guardian breeds?

So what, the only breeds left allowed will be Labradors and Maltese (which happen to have the highest bite statistics, but clearly the actual facts don't matter!)

Edited February 17, 2010 by Sam&Saki

[GeckoTree]

Hahahaha BSL for some but not for others?, that is ummm not well thunked because it's still BSL.

Edited February 17, 2010 by GeckoTree

[geo]

- these dogs were bred to kill or be killed.

With so many wonderful breeds to choose from, why does anyone want a BSL breed - all dogs are loyal, all dogs love you, it just isn't worth the risk.

Yes they were bred to kill other animals, Not people. many people still cannot get passed this, or decide not to.

If i could give you half hour with my dogs, then you'd understand why i choose to own bull breeds, they all have their special qualities and the one i love the most is their complete slutiness for human attention and who can resist a staffy or the sullen 'love me more' look of an amstaff.

The comment to class is relevent in some respect, (ie, undesirables owning pitties to look tough) but if SBT's ever became banned, that theory would no longer be true, as being one of the most popular breeds i'm sure upperclass people own them too.

[Adnil444]

Hi Geo,

I understand what you are saying, but the fact remains that these dogs do attack people (whether they be pure or crosses). I don't have a pit bull but I understand that human aggression was a trait that was not desirable and those dogs that were, were dealt with or not bred from.

I also understand what you are saying about your dogs - I'm sure you and the others on here all love, care and do the right thing by your dog(s) and people in the community.

Dog aggression or aggression towards other animals is also something that is not acceptable. From what I can gather from other posters on BSL, these breeds are not for everyone, certainly the majority cannot be taken to dog parks to mix with other dogs. I think the reason why PBT are singled out here is because they are already in this country, most of the other breeds in the BSL are not yet here, and let's hope they never do arrive. I was reading an article the other day about someone wanting one of the Ovcharka breeds (Russian breeds, certainly not suitable for family pets). The reason this person wanted one was because it looked nice!! Well I'm sorry but because a dog looks nice isn't a reason to have one. I googled the breed (this breed consists of several within this grouping) and you wouldn't want to come across one.

There are plenty of morons out there that want a status symbol; an extension of their manhood etc etc - why else do they need to walk them with massive studded collars and harnesses (also the dogs that I have seen do not resemble what I would call a pure APBT - correct me if I am wrong, but I thought they were smaller, more athletic dogs, not these massive muscle bound creatures).

Perhaps your last paragraph holds some truth in it - if every tom, dick and harry owned a pit bull, the novelty would soon wear off - not much fun having a dog that everyone can have. Nothing makes people want something moreso than if it is banned.

It comes down to responsible dog ownership - I totally appreciate that there are people who are wary of my dogs (rottiexdoberman and a dobermanxkelpie) and I respect that and I would never put my dogs or more importantly these people in a situation where they felt threatened. Mind you both of mine are extremely dog friendly and people friendly, but alot of people out there don't have dogs, are afraid of them. I can only hope that with education people will learn more about the pit bull and that they can and do make wonderful pets, however only in the right hands. You see at the dog park every day people who have chosen the wrong breed for them and their lifestyle and once the owner can no longer control the dog, the dog is sentenced to the backyard with little stimulation, contact, socialisation etc and eventually will either be dumped or sent to the pound. The ones that remain locked in yards become ticking time bombs and then when something does go wrong, the media will be onto it and the cycle continues.

Perhaps the PBT owners need to do something like the GSD group did to lift their ban. Have info days, have shows etc, let the public see what these dogs can really be like unlike the ones that are portrayed in the media - the ones the morons of our society have. I would love to come along to an PBT day and learn all about them. I just wish the undesirables and the morons would stop breeding there version of a pit bull, and get themselves a Cavalier instead.

[geo]

Hi Geo,

I understand what you are saying, but the fact remains that these dogs do attack people (whether they be pure or crosses). I don't have a pit bull but I understand that human aggression was a trait that was not desirable and those dogs that were, were dealt with or not bred from.

Perhaps the PBT owners need to do something like the GSD group did to lift their ban. Have info days, have shows etc, let the public see what these dogs can really be like unlike the ones that are portrayed in the media - the ones the morons of our society have. I would love to come along to an PBT day and learn all about them. I just wish the undesirables and the morons would stop breeding there version of a pit bull, and get themselves a Cavalier instead.

I agree with your post, but all breeds have been known to attack people, and pitbulls are very low on the bite statistics (not that i think stats are worth anything) morons should not be allowed to breed any dogs, and trust me there's plenty out there not breeding pitbulls. BYB pitbull breeders aren't even a spec on the radar when it comes down to amount of dogs bred compared to 'hobby' breeders. (again i condone niether)

Many people that have apbt's i think would love to show off the breed, but for the owners where they're banned they're not likely to take them out in public.

I think the apbt club tried but could no longer get insurance.

It would also help to have a Priminister who was a fancier of apbts like the GSD's had.

[chrisjc]

some of you guys are realy funny.

for starters bsl helps no one . you all have an opinion on wheather it should or shouldnt be around and those of you that agree with it to a certain point either know very little about the dogs that are banned hell some of you cant even spell their names. good to see youve done some heavy research.

none of the dogs banned are anyworse than any of the dogs we already have here legally, can no one even grasp that point?

personally i am fond of each and every banned breed on the list, why? mainly because there is nothing wrong with any of them. alot of them are the very best for the role they were bred for.

personally im a huge fan of the doggo, but i would never own one. i happen to be fortunate to know a fella from argentina who is a close personal friend of the Nores family who were responsible generations ago for starting the breed, they are a pack hunting dog and must be worked constantly as they are full of energy, wouldnt suit my lifestyle, but why cant a pro boar hunter have a choice at owning the greatest animal around for the job?

Apbt is where it is today here with some because it IS banned , for some its a status or a symbol, and to others its a penis enlarger. main reason being that its banned so they must be "bad ass". if they were legal im sure it would be very different.

i dont like knocking anyones opinions on anything but it realy bothers me when people have so much to say about something they know so little about.

bulldogs4eva, thanks for your posts, have got my sanity back [for now atleast!]

[tybrax]

some of you guys are realy funny.

for starters bsl helps no one . you all have an opinion on wheather it should or shouldnt be around and those of you that agree with it to a certain point either know very little about the dogs that are banned hell some of you cant even spell their names. good to see youve done some heavy research.

none of the dogs banned are anyworse than any of the dogs we already have here legally, can no one even grasp that point?

personally i am fond of each and every banned breed on the list, why? mainly because there is nothing wrong with any of them. alot of them are the very best for the role they were bred for.

personally im a huge fan of the doggo, but i would never own one. i happen to be fortunate to know a fella from argentina who is a close personal friend of the Nores family who were responsible generations ago for starting the breed, they are a pack hunting dog and must be worked constantly as they are full of energy, wouldnt suit my lifestyle, but why cant a pro boar hunter have a choice at owning the greatest animal around for the job?

Apbt is where it is today here with some because it IS banned , for some its a status or a symbol, and to others its a penis enlarger. main reason being that its banned so they must be "bad ass". if they were legal im sure it would be very different.

i dont like knocking anyones opinions on anything but it realy bothers me when people have so much to say about something they know so little about.

bulldogs4eva, thanks for your posts, have got my sanity back [for now atleast!]

tybrax