Designer Dogs... Are They Better Than Purebred?

[Steve]

Puppy farmers dont usually have papered dogs.They dont need to get them from registered breeders because there are so many other breeders who breed purebred without papers or at least they look like purebred.

The reality is that a first cross litter where Mum is one breed and the father is another is usually pretty uniform to look at,though its possible to get 68 different coat combinations from a poodle cross lab mating and Im assuming it would be the same for a chow cross Sharpei and if one breed or dog has a recessive disorder such as PRA and the other parent breed doesnt then the puppies wont get

that disorder where they may get it if both parents are the same breed and they both either have it or carry it.

For these type of diseases breeders who know what is in their pedigrees and what is a problem in the breed can test for them and know whether one or both parents have the disorder anyway so if you go to a good registered breeder who knows their stuff the recessives are dealt with and the puppies have as much chance at being clear of these things as any cross bred.

First cross dogs still get all of the known polygenic diseases such as patella luxation(PL), hip dysplasia ( HD), skin allergies etc so they are not necessarily healthier than a purebred for polygenic disorders.

They also get a bunch of real nasty ones which we dont know the mode of inheritance for yet like syringomyelia,protein-losing enteropathy (PLE), protein-losing nephropathy (PLN), and Renal Dysplasia (RD).

The possible health issues which are caused in some breeds by the way the parents look such as brachy head syndrome can be side stepped if its a short nosed breed mated with a longnosed breed where the outcome is usually a nose mid length between the two breeds but there are possible different combinations of 81 just in the jaw area.

If the parent dogs have been affected by in breeding depression where their immune systems are lowered,where they are less fertile and have less longevity then mating them with a different breed would make the puppies more thrifty and live longer than their parents BUT people who are breeding F1 crosses as assumed to breeding healthy parent dogs so this is hardly a consideration either.

Now here is the big deal and something that seems to be overlooked when ever we discuss the health of first cross versus purebred.

First cross breeders only have to consider one litter and not what they may be breeding in for future generations to suffer with and without some of us breeding healthy purebred dogs it would not be possible for them to breed their crosses because the minute they breed the second generation there is a high risk of an outbreeding depression where the puppies could be less healthy than the original parents.If their puppies are desexed the genetic time bomb is diffused but if they back cross literally anything can show in subsequent litters and most are backcrossing.

The question becomes-healthier than what. At a guess Id have about 200 beagles I have bred currently alive in pet homes .The oldest is almost 18 and unless they suffer an accident they all live well into the high teens and none of them need to visit vets or suffer anything which takes from them their optimum quality of life.When I sell a puppy there is nothing which I exclude in my guarantee but well a known first cross breeder has quote "We do not offer a refund with dogs affected by allergic skin problems" because at one stage she was getting 30% with skin problems!

According to our breed health survey neither labs nor poodles have anywhere near that kind pf percenatage with skin problems.

As far as any assertion that first cross dogs are more predictible - another quote from the lab x poodle breeder.

quote "With regard to shedding about 70% are low or moderate shedders, 10% of dogs are non-shedding and the remaining 20% shed a lot (some as much as a Labrador it seems).I can't predict shedding with confidence – based on the results of the survey I have found that the chance of getting a non or low shedding dog is about 50% whether or not shedding was a priority.There are however among the pups a very few that we can confidently predict will be non shedding (about 5%)"

So the people who are saying that first cross dogs have less risk of having some diseases than the parents, that first cross dogs are more predictible than purebreds arent stupid but they arent telling the whole story either.

The are also speaking of breed averages and not dog averages - so unless you breed the same dogs with their own breed and do another mating with the same dogs with another breed any stats telling us they are healthier if they are crossbred than they are if they are not mean nothing anyway.

Its also time we worked out that these breeders are not doing anything illegal and concentrate and promote what we do rather than get caught up in what they say and do.

Edited February 5, 2010 by Steve

[kirst_goldens]

Are you serious?? I thought backyard breeding was illegal?? - As in only registered breeders are legal?? If this is not the case then maybe we should start by fixing that?

And i couldnt agree more we should be out there doing advertising for purebreeds and explaining about the measures we use to control these diseases and what not.

[Steve]

Are you serious?? I thought backyard breeding was illegal?? - As in only registered breeders are legal?? If this is not the case then maybe we should start by fixing that?

And i couldnt agree more we should be out there doing advertising for purebreeds and explaining about the measures we use to control these diseases and what not.

No back yard breeding isnt illegal and nor is puppy farming.

[addy001]

Well maybe they can own a Bullshit one day (Bull terrier X Shitzu) :D

;)

[Steve]

629,000 plus dogs bred each year in Australia of them approx 69,000 are bred by registered breeders.

Someone other than us is breeding puppies.

Julie

Edited February 6, 2010 by Steve

[whippets]

Puppy farmers who run it as a business would be protected under the trades practices act in commerical law. They have more rights under the law than ethical registered breeders who run a hobby.

go figure.

[PrincessCharming]

I can't believe puppy farming isn't illegal...We have laws to prevent chickens from being treated cruelly don't we?

IMO most deigner dog breeds aren't 'cute' they end up looking messed up. Like a jack russel x pug...*Shudder.

[Nekhbet]

I can't believe puppy farming isn't illegal...We have laws to prevent chickens from being treated cruelly don't we?

not really. Dogs are treated either as livestock or under the same laws as buying a fridge. As long as you feed, water and provide basic health care you can do whatever you want and breed as many as you like.

[PrincessCharming]

That's so awful.

[Dfa Dog]

Yeah it's a damn shame BYB is not illegal. Unfortunately many people hahve no idea of the problems associated with BYB and when they decide to go off to get a dog, drop down to the local pet store and pick one up completely unaware!! Pity stories like these are only further exacerbating the problem, rather than taking a prime opportunity to educate people!

[PrincessCharming]

Well I think that it would be very difficult to make BYB illegal, but the least we can do is make puppy mills illegal!

[kirst_goldens]

I cant believe those numbers!! i knew people other then registered breeders were breeding but i thought their were laws controlling the BYB and farmers!!

Now im just really angry and disgusted in our country for not protecting our best friends and in alot of cases our work mates...