Does Anyone Choose Not To Crate Train?

[mumsy]

We have an eleven week old puppy. We didn't have a crate and we put him in the bathroom, with bed, toys etc for two nights. He howled, scratched and cried. The next night I put his bed next to ours and he went straight to his bed and went to sleep. I hear him start to move around and get him up and outside. He toilets immediately and we go back to bed. He goes straight to his bed and back to sleep. During the day we can block off all the carpetted areas of the house so I keep an eye on him and toilet him often. We have had one or two mistakes, but that isn't his fault, it is ours for not watching. He comes in the car with us and sits quietly in his harness. He is now starting to go to the door and whimper when he wants out. For us crate training wasn't that important. I want him on the couch with us and until he is old enough I am happy to do the trip out at night. He now sleeps from about 11pm to 4 or 5 am. I think crate training is great if that's what you like otherwise I'm happy to supervise.

[FD26]

I'm pretty sure we'll be crate training our new pup. We didn't with our last dog because we didn't know enough about it and thought it was cruel. What we did instead was....lots and lots of laundry and floor scrubbing :D

[poodlefan]

We have an eleven week old puppy. We didn't have a crate and we put him in the bathroom, with bed, toys etc for two nights. He howled, scratched and cried. The next night I put his bed next to ours and he went straight to his bed and went to sleep. I hear him start to move around and get him up and outside. He toilets immediately and we go back to bed. He goes straight to his bed and back to sleep. During the day we can block off all the carpetted areas of the house so I keep an eye on him and toilet him often. We have had one or two mistakes, but that isn't his fault, it is ours for not watching. He comes in the car with us and sits quietly in his harness. He is now starting to go to the door and whimper when he wants out. For us crate training wasn't that important. I want him on the couch with us and until he is old enough I am happy to do the trip out at night. He now sleeps from about 11pm to 4 or 5 am. I think crate training is great if that's what you like otherwise I'm happy to supervise.

Howard's crate was beside my bed. He doesn't sleep in a crate now but is still fed in it and will go there when he wants some time out.. assuming he doesn't need to evict a poodle to get in there. :D

The idea of crate training is not to house your dog in a crate most of its waking life. It's not a case of crate or couch at my place but both.

[Lara19]

BBB hang in there...being a new mum is NOT easy, I can attest to that. Humphrey is so new yet and trying to work out soo many things in his little head, he's still a baby! Fortunately, so far Logan has found his crate to be a happy, secure place. I did not realise how special it was already for him until, without thinking, I turned on the vacuum cleaner this morning and he ran straight into his crate; if he could have shut the door after him, I'm sure he would have....stupid mother I am!

Being so "new" as well, I'm not going to give any suggestions, but so much great advice here from those who have had the same issues...you are not alone! :D

[poodlefan]

Of course it's perfectly possible to toilet train a puppy without using a crate. In the thirty years we have owned and bred dogs we have never owned a crate. The pups live for the first roughly eight weeks outside in the kennel/run and once they are able to walk and get out of the kennel they rarely mess in it. After that the one who is staying comes and lives inside with us they tend to follow the example of the other adult dogs here and try not to mess in the house, yes of course there is the odd accident, but really a little puppy wee or poo doesn't take much cleaning up. I know this isn't the fashionable way to rear pups any more, but it works for us so I'm sticking to it.

Pam

Besides, imagine the size of the crates you'd need for a couple of your dogs! :D :D

[mumsy]

Sorry poodlefan, I didn't mean to say it was one way or the other. The only reason we tried without it was the cost of a crate when I wasn't sure it would be used alot. I do appreciate the advice you have been giving us along the way too! :D

[poodlefan]

Sorry poodlefan, I didn't mean to say it was one way or the other. The only reason we tried without it was the cost of a crate when I wasn't sure it would be used alot. I do appreciate the advice you have been giving us along the way too! :D

No drama :D

I think to some people, the idea of crate training is that your dog basically becomes some kind of in house zoo animal - in the crate unless being fed or walked.

That's not a crate for such dogs - its a cage. I certainly don't advocate dogs being crated when you're at work all day although in the USA it's not uncommon.

Mind you, I don't have coyotes, cougars or bears visiting my yard.

[First Time Puppy Owner]

BBB - confession! :D I had only just heard about crate training before I got Benson and I just didn't have time to read up on it nor the cash to buy a crate, so I cardboard box trained Benson. I kept in a big box next to my bed for the first 9 nights with a pillow in there and after the first 3 nights of getting up and going to the toilet he was sleeping through the whole night and then I got him a kennel and he slept outside until he started getting skin issues at 8 mths and ever since he has been sleeping inside in my bedroom :D

[Bundyburger]

What I'm finding is that he HATES and I mean HATES being in the crate/pen, I take him out to the toilet and he does his little business but not 5 or 10 minutes later he wees in the floor in the house, so to me the crate training isn't doing anything except getting him distressed.

Er, thats a puppy who hasn't been outside long enough to empty his bladder PROPERLY.. nothing to do with being distressed about being crated! Speaking from experience here. Until we started using the pen/crate a lot more and staying outside with him longer we had the same thing happening, now he's on his way to being housetrained. Of course he's going to hate the pen at first, he can't be out running around causing mayhem!! So it needs to be made a nicer place for him.

You need to make it a safe comfy place for puppy to go. We pen ours during the day with toys etc, and pop him in his crate at night with a cover and a kong to chew(not that he ever does). For the first month he slept in our room and he settled instantly. He's now out in the lounge room at night and he grumbles a bit but soon settles when he realises he's getting ignored unless it's a desperate "I NEED TO PEE NOWW" whinge(which only ever happens at 1.30am), any other time of night he gets ignored..

9/10 we have a velcro puppy who is wherever we are.. he sleeps on the couch and dog beds around the house more than he does in his pen or crate.

[Pointees]

Of course it's perfectly possible to toilet train a puppy without using a crate. In the thirty years we have owned and bred dogs we have never owned a crate. The pups live for the first roughly eight weeks outside in the kennel/run and once they are able to walk and get out of the kennel they rarely mess in it. After that the one who is staying comes and lives inside with us they tend to follow the example of the other adult dogs here and try not to mess in the house, yes of course there is the odd accident, but really a little puppy wee or poo doesn't take much cleaning up. I know this isn't the fashionable way to rear pups any more, but it works for us so I'm sticking to it.

Pam

Besides, imagine the size of the crates you'd need for a couple of your dogs! :D

Try a whelping pen for large breed doggggies in my room! :D And even so, the dogs sleep on each other. :D

[Bluefairy]

With all my other dogs I had never heard of crate training. The good old newspaper on the floor and being on edge while the pups are in the house was a nightmare and seemed to take forever....last pup took 5 months to TT.....

For my next dog I will definitely be crate training.....I have read so many good things and no bad. So I am going to give it a go.

Ellz, you could class the four outside walls of a house as a crate if you wanted to, the inside walls and doors are just sectioned off parts of the same crate.....I don't see it as the same thing as confining a dog to a crate or house, or even a back yard. A crate is too small to compare it to anything else.

Bluefairy

[BooBooBear]

What I'm finding is that he HATES and I mean HATES being in the crate/pen, I take him out to the toilet and he does his little business but not 5 or 10 minutes later he wees in the floor in the house, so to me the crate training isn't doing anything except getting him distressed.

Er, thats a puppy who hasn't been outside long enough to empty his bladder PROPERLY.. nothing to do with being distressed about being crated! Speaking from experience here. Until we started using the pen/crate a lot more and staying outside with him longer we had the same thing happening, now he's on his way to being housetrained. Of course he's going to hate the pen at first, he can't be out running around causing mayhem!! So it needs to be made a nicer place for him.

You need to make it a safe comfy place for puppy to go. We pen ours during the day with toys etc, and pop him in his crate at night with a cover and a kong to chew(not that he ever does). For the first month he slept in our room and he settled instantly. He's now out in the lounge room at night and he grumbles a bit but soon settles when he realises he's getting ignored unless it's a desperate "I NEED TO PEE NOWW" whinge(which only ever happens at 1.30am), any other time of night he gets ignored..

9/10 we have a velcro puppy who is wherever we are.. he sleeps on the couch and dog beds around the house more than he does in his pen or crate.

He actually has heaps of time outside, we don't rush the whole toileting process in any way. He just seems like a peeing machine

Thanks so much everyone for your help and encouragement, I really do appreciate it and I know that little Humphrey is only a bubba so I just need to be more patient and disciplined in my approach.

[MsBex]

We started out crate training Cory, however he never seemed to 'love it'. Would be happy to stay in for an hour or so during the day, and wouldn't cry at night, however his nights were restless and he never went near it unless made to!

Once he was about 15wks old and pretty much toilet trained, we stopped using it. Now its an ugly mess in the corner of the living room where all our shoes are piled on top in a box so he can't chew them!! :

At night, he'll bypass all the soft places like human beds/dog beds/couches and head straight to the cold, hard tiles of the bathroom to sleep the night away! Will wait and see how/if things change once winter arrives.

Good luck with your pup, time was the only thing that seemed to matter with Cory's toilet training!

[SpikesPuppy]

All our current dogs are crate trained and I'll never look back We have assorted crates throughout the house and the dogs often go into them of their own accord because they associate them with happy things.

[Jed]

I've never crate trained. I simply watch the pup when it is inside, ensure it goes outside at regular intervals, if it's circling, and after meals. Stay outside until something happens, make a big fuss. Big dogs here go outside before bed, pup goes too. We rarely have accidents.

I teach them early what is acceptable to chew and what is not. Pups sleep a lot anyhow, so you aren't watching them all the time. Only when they are awake.

I don't believe in crate trainng. When the dogs are older, they are trained to stay in large crates, or show trolleys when they are drying after a bath, or if they are being fed separately. An hour or so max after a bath and a short time to eat.

[Mim]

Yep I do the same as Jed.

I am buying a soft crate just because the pen that I have is awkward to set up and too small anyway but I need something to confine the dogs if needed (post desexing, if feeling unwell etc). The corgis are all crate trained because their breeders did so.

[The Spotted Devil]

I generally used an open, solid crate in the laundry, which worked perfectly for our set up. Ziggy was paper trained at 8 weeks and used the newspaper on the laundry floor approximately twice in 10 days and never toileted overnight again When I was home I simply took him outside every 15-30 min to begin with and he very, very quickly got the idea. I used chairs to block doorways, which limited him to one room and yet allowed the cats to come and go as they pleased.

Later on I would pop him in the soft crate so we could relax for 5 min (he was pretty full on :D ) but he had trouble sleeping in the lounge room.....every time he shut his eyes something interesting would happen and he ended up like a tired, cranky toddler!!! He loved having a snooze in the laundry for a couple of hours during the day - I had a "3 yawns and you're out rule" TheniInto the open crate with a puppy kong filled with dry food - he still dives into his crate or bed at night waiting for his kong :D I only ever shut the crate if we are at a show/trial or if we have tradespeople/visitors in the house and I can't watch him.

[BooBooBear]

Jed - thank you thank you thank you, that's what I wanted to know! If there were people that didn't crate train and what you actually did in place of crate training.

I'm not entirely sure crate training is the way to go for me either but I really needed to hear from someone who a. knows a lot more than I do and b. was willing to 'go against' the grain.

My 12 year old Bull Mastiff (who passed away in September) was never crate trained and neither was our 14 year old Staffy Kimba (still going strong :D ) and they were and are beautiful.

I understand why a lot of people choose to crate train but to me I'm not sure it fits with what I believe. Just me I guess. Will see how we go with it all :D

[Bundyburger]

BBB what does your breeder recommend?

I PM'd you too but you can ignore that if you want

[JulesP]

BBB I think that you need to decide the best thing for you. If crate training doesn't feel right than don't do it. To be honest (and I hope you don't mind me saying this) I think that you are going to cause more issues crate training the way you are then if you didn't crate train. If you are going to crate train then you either do it very slowly or you have to be committed to not responding to the pup howling.

I actually don't crate train for the purposes of house training either but more because my dogs have to go in crates at dog school.

I am pen training I guess more than crate training this time. It has been good. Would be chaos if I wasn't using the pen as I have 4 dogs and 2 cats in the house at night! Pup seems to like her pen area. I like being able to relax and watch TV without having to jump up every few seconds to see what pup is up to.

You have to do what feels right for you. My pup is currently outside with the big dogs. Lots of people wouldn't do that. Pup is snuggled up with my old girl at the moment. Old girl has more patience than the other 2. Someone was horrified that I let my dogs all hang out together, in case they bond with each other and not with me. I haven't found that to be the case yet and I like them being friends. So I do what feels right for me.