Breeders Who Raise Puppies On Raw/barf/premium Dry

[Guest belgian.blue]

This got me thinking today, as this morning I met a 6 year old Tervueren Belgian Shepherd .. He is from a breeder I have my name down with in the Eastern States. So it was really great to meet a past puppy of hers.

Lovely dog but his coat was sad and dull. His owners also say he gets periods of itchy skin, which he then gets human grade meds for that .. which helps him. I slipped in the question, what does he eat? They told me His teeth were also rather yellow, don't think he's seen a raw bone .. ever.

But that isn't the reason for my post, I know Ivy was raised on BARF and she's now on a wheat free diet as if she gets wheat or pretty much anything nasty her poohs are foul. Even from day one she was runny from eating wheat etc. Suits me fine.

My first two dogs lived off supermarket food and survived to a great healthy old age .. back then raw was never fed to pet dogs.

I need to confirm what diet the Terv I met today was raised on as I'm not 1OO% certian as he was raised 6 years ago, before raw was spoken about?

So pups that are raised on raw/barf seem to be unable to handle any of the supermarket/cheap dry foods and anything wheaty/artifical. They pooh it right out and/or it causes itchy skin problems.

[WreckitWhippet]

So are you saying/asking

If a pup is raised on barf, is it then unable to eat cheap commercial dry or dry in general, because it would cause skin issue and digestion problems?

[JulesP]

I was going BARF over 10 years ago so it was certainly around 6 years ago.

My breeder does a RAW/prey diet and both pups I have got from her have been fine on Premium dry food.

[Crisovar]

I have always fed my dogs raw meat and bones, from the very first dogs I owned, and my families dogs ate raw meat.

Dogs I have raised on totally raw that have then gone on to eat commercial dry without issues. It is an individual thing with each dog.

[Guest belgian.blue]

So are you saying/asking

If a pup is raised on barf, is it then unable to eat cheap commercial dry or dry in general, because it would cause skin issue and digestion problems?

Ofcourse they can eat it, it's what many owners can only afford but I thought that pups weaned on raw/barf and are then switched to a commercial diet end up with itchy skin etc.

Like their systems just can't cope with the wheat and such.

[WreckitWhippet]

So are you saying/asking

If a pup is raised on barf, is it then unable to eat cheap commercial dry or dry in general, because it would cause skin issue and digestion problems?

Ofcourse they can eat it, it's what many owners can only afford but I thought that pups weaned on raw/barf and are then switched to a commercial diet end up with itchy skin etc.

Like their systems just can't cope with the wheat and such.

I would say that's a pretty fair call.

I've got a couple here that have now spent the majority of their lives on raw. Give them a cheap cup of food and their coats go putrid overnight, their turds are huge and runny.

They can tolerate Royal Canin on a weekend away if need be. I've also got some that still eat Royal Canin and give them anything cheap and nasty and they get runny eyes and itch

[Guest belgian.blue]

Over five years ago wheat in dog food was the norm, itchy skin was rare?

Now raw food is the way to go .. itchy skin is in.

Guess it's like me in a way, I do my best to eat good food and when I don't .. I know all about it!

[Dogsfevr]

So are you saying/asking

If a pup is raised on barf, is it then unable to eat cheap commercial dry or dry in general, because it would cause skin issue and digestion problems?

Ofcourse they can eat it, it's what many owners can only afford but I thought that pups weaned on raw/barf and are then switched to a commercial diet end up with itchy skin etc.

Like their systems just can't cope with the wheat and such.

Not true at all.

raw has been feed since they cows came home,now its like everything else because it has a flashy label/name everyone thinks its a miracle.

I need to confirm what diet the Terv I met today was raised on as I'm not 1OO% certian as he was raised 6 years ago, before raw was spoken about?

What do you mean by this??

[spottychick]

I've been feeding my dogs raw food since around 2000 when I did a little research into canine nutrition. At the time I was told by a vet that my 8 year old dally, who was limping in three legs and could barely reach down to her food bowl, was just "old" and would die soon so just make her "comfortable" for her final days.

I ignored the vet and instead ended up changing both dogs to raw food and some supplements. Within 3 months the "old" dally was leaping over park benches and healthier than ever. She lived to the age of 19.

Raw food's not a "new invention" LOL it's been around since Adam was a boy! But it's become more popular recently in today's society.

I have also switched them to commercial food at times - for a variety of reasons. But I would never feed any dog cheap commercial junk. They get EP or something similar. They've never had a problem with the switch but they would always get RMBs with it anyway.

If a dog is used to eating proper food (eg a raw food diet) then of course if you switch them to barely sufficient cheap commercial rubbish their systems will react adversely to it.

[JulesP]

Give your Dog a Bone was actually published in 1993.

[Crisovar]

Over five years ago wheat in dog food was the norm, itchy skin was rare?

Now raw food is the way to go .. itchy skin is in.

Guess it's like me in a way, I do my best to eat good food and when I don't .. I know all about it!

I like to look at all the other things that dogs are no exposed to, vaccinations, spot on flea and tick treatments, heartworm prevention etc.

Feeding raw meat is by no means new, it is now being marketed, and we have the internet and people promoting their ideas more there openly, but standing in the kitchen chopping up raw meat for the dogs and cats is not new. I remember fishing a piece of heart out my sons mouth that I had dropped whilst bagging up our meat order when he was a tot, he is 30 now.

[raz]

I was feeding raw to a dog over 20 years ago

[Scarlet]

My parents fed raw to our dogs over 40 yrs ago-probably longer.

They lived on "cuttings" from the butcher.

I don't even know if much processed pet food was around

[luvsdogs]

My parents used to feed their dog back in the 50's on horse meat bought from the local produce store. I surpose he also got bones & scraps. I can't remember what our next 2 dogs ate but it certainly wasn't processed dog food. I dog I had as a child used to get Munchies as a treat which were little red balls of what I surpose was kibble like.

I first heard of 'raw' in 99 when Ian Billinhurst came to my obedience club to do a talk on the subject & sell his books of which I bought the 2 available at the time & started feeding April the veggie mix I made myself & raw meaty bones. It certainly improved her teeth. She was an ithy dog for a few years until I discovered it was flea allergy & put her on Advantage. She lived to nearly 15.

My present dog is an itchy dog but being lazy I still haven't switched her over to raw. She only gets the occasional bone.

[TeamSnag]

I been there tried BARF all my dogs did was shit!!!

So now they have royal canin and some meat and other things mixed in, and bones here and there.. Glad to be back to 2 shits a day

[t-time]

My grandparents had a Dane in the early 80's which had severe food allergy specifically wheat and they had to put him on a raw diet - he cleared up pretty much straight away after he was taken off commercial food. ;)

I really don't think feeding raw has any effect on the tolerance to commercial food - there's always a dog who is going to get allergies.......also owners are becoming more aware of allergies in their dogs.

[Steve]

It all depends on which food and how long its fed for.

You already know if you have Macdonalds once or twice a week you remain healthy assuming the rest of your diet is balanced.

But if you changed from a good diet to nothing else but big macs every single meal every single day you would expect over a short period of time to develop health issues.If your kids eat a balanced diet the odd junk food is no big deal etc. Some scientists are telling us we should only feed cheap commercial because a good diet hides the show of genetic issues.As a Mum I think if I allowed my kids to eat food which had no enzymes, no live vitamins but minerals which need vitamins to assimilate and throw in some pesticides to prevent fleas,a chemical which would bubble away in their bloodstream to prevent heartworm,and vaccinate them yearly when they dont need it I would expect to see problems and I dont think that would be evidence that I carried bad genes.

In other words that theory is that no matter what - a dog shouldnt develop any symptoms.

Studies with HD show that if you feed a dog considered suseptible to HD raw food rather than commercial you can keep the HD at bay in 60 % of dogs more than you can if you feed commercial.

So some scientists are saying we shouldnt do that because it masks the genetics - but really recent studies are showing we can alter DNA by diet. You know if you eat the wrong diet you will be more suseptible to heart diseases, cancer etc. From a science view if you put in the nutrients needed to feed the joints properly the joint will remain healthy feed foods which dont have all thats needed the joint doesnt function.Yes some dogs which eat commercial foods dont get HD but we dont know what their Mum ate and bunch of other stuff which might also impact on that.

Way back about 60 years ago a guy called Pottinger did a big study on cats and that showed that many things we consider to be genetic are in fact nutritional and they can be passed down from Mum, Grandmum etc to the babies. On the whole that theory went to sleep for a half a century but now there are new sciences which are backing up what he said.

So its kind of like what came first the genetic predisposition or the diet.

Dogs havent evolved to eat commercial dog foods.Their digestive tracts are different to ours and they are only born with a certain amount of enzymes to live on so if they dont get live enzymes in their food they have to use up what they have in supply and when that runs out they cant break down their foods and they cant convert certain nutrients to others.For example They dont need vitamin C because their system produces vitamin C by using others assumed to be in their foods -if thats not there you expect to see problems.If you try to head that off and add vitamin C that means other enzymes have to be there to convert it to a usable form.

Its simple feed your dog a varied balanced diet. If you have to feed a commercial food then add to it live enzymes such as Thrive D and some multivitamins and pro-biotics.Live enzymes ,vitamins and pro biotics CANT live in commercial dog food no matter what it says on the bag and no matter when they are added because heat and storage kill them off .The plastic most are packed in also leeches into the foods and becomes a cancer causing agent too.

Dont only feed one brand of commercial for long periods of time no matter where you buy it or what quality you think it is.

Before Commercial everyone fed table scraps and raw food - it was all we had.

Edited January 26, 2010 by Steve

[~Midniara~]

Excellent post steve.

So pups that are raised on raw/barf seem to be unable to handle any of the supermarket/cheap dry foods and anything wheaty/artifical. They pooh it right out and/or it causes itchy skin problems.

No not true. ;) Ivy had 9 other sibblings in her litter and it is true that all of them were raised on a completely raw diet and never had commercial food fed to them while they were here. While I encouraged all of the new owners of these pups to feed their pupppies raw I also understood that not all could so I encouraged those that couldn't to feed their pups a good Premium food with added goodies to make up for the shortfall. Out of the 10 pups 5 of them are on commercial food and all of them are healthy with no problems at all.

The key for these people was to wean their puppies onto commercial dry slowly to avoid any stomach upsets which is what every single one of them did. They all still feed their dogs some raw to fill the gap but their dogs are mostly on commercially produced food. None of these dogs have shown any signs to intollerance to commercial food at all.

In my opinion Raw is best but I do realise as you've probably read here on dol that it is not for everyone.

Edited January 26, 2010 by ~Midniara~

[mumsy]

I been there tried BARF all my dogs did was shit!!!

So now they have royal canin and some meat and other things mixed in, and bones here and there.. Glad to be back to 2 shits a day

We have a new puppy and he has a BM about six times a day. Is this typical on BARF? This is our first puppy although we have had an adult dog before. Is there a link on DOL to more info on BARF. My concerns with this diet for us is getting the balance and all the nutrients right.

[Steve]

I been there tried BARF all my dogs did was shit!!!

So now they have royal canin and some meat and other things mixed in, and bones here and there.. Glad to be back to 2 shits a day

We have a new puppy and he has a BM about six times a day. Is this typical on BARF? This is our first puppy although we have had an adult dog before. Is there a link on DOL to more info on BARF. My concerns with this diet for us is getting the balance and all the nutrients right.

Puppies poo more than adult dogs.What are you feeding him?