Bidding Madness Riles Locals At Blacktown Pound

[reddog21]

I have been out of action for a while. Does anybody know if any changes are proposed and the names of people trying to help?

[~Anne~]

The other fatal flaw of tender systems is that dogs become commodities. The highest bid wins, not the best home wins.

The other issue is that it is also a silent tender. As I didn't have a clause exemption, to get a Pug from Blacktown I had to tender. If it was an undesexed Pug, my biggest concern would be that it would go out and be bred from. I could put a bid for $200 or more on a Pug, but I have no idea if anyone else had also bid. If I won the bid I paid the $200 plus their vacc and admin fee and a fee to register an entire dog if it wasn't desexed (if it wasn't already currently registered) plus chip (if it wasn't chipped). However, if no-one else bid then I could have only bid the minimum which is currently $60. When you are bidding to rescue, that difference of quite a few hundred dollars can be rough on your budget.

To prove the tender system allows the dog to go to 'any' home which may not be suitable, I have had 3 Pugs that I have bid on at Blacktown and lost the bid, only to have them surrendered to me. Two were surrendered within weeks, one within months. If that doesn't indicate the system fails the dog, what else does.

[WreckitWhippet]

That tender system is no different to the pounds that offer up the dogs at a set price. First in the door and first to lay the money on the table gets the dog.

[Mila's Mum]

That tender system is no different to the pounds that offer up the dogs at a set price. First in the door and first to lay the money on the table gets the dog.

The tender system favours the bybs who can put in a large tender bec they know they can recoup the cost in the first litter. The tender system can't be looked at in isolation - it needs to be looked at in conjunction with compulsory desexing. Dogs should be available for a set price which includes desexing, m'chipping, vaccinations etc. As it stands at the moment, people might win a tender and not know if there will be space on the free desexing program - if there's not, then the adoptor is paying a higher price for registration (bec the dog is entire), and then has to pay for desexing once the dog is out of the pound.

It's hard to encourage people to adopt from a pound using a tender system, when they have a number of hoops to jump through to adopt a dog. Adoptions would be higher if all the work was done, and people knew the amount of the adoption expense involved.

[~Anne~]

That tender system is no different to the pounds that offer up the dogs at a set price. First in the door and first to lay the money on the table gets the dog.

The tender system favours the bybs who can put in a large tender bec they know they can recoup the cost in the first litter. The tender system can't be looked at in isolation - it needs to be looked at in conjunction with compulsory desexing. Dogs should be available for a set price which includes desexing, m'chipping, vaccinations etc. As it stands at the moment, people might win a tender and not know if there will be space on the free desexing program - if there's not, then the adoptor is paying a higher price for registration (bec the dog is entire), and then has to pay for desexing once the dog is out of the pound.

It's hard to encourage people to adopt from a pound using a tender system, when they have a number of hoops to jump through to adopt a dog. Adoptions would be higher if all the work was done, and people knew the amount of the adoption expense involved.

And the fact they have no guarantee that the dog they have chosen and often visited at least once, if not several times, will be able to be purchased by them.

The tender system is a no win system for everyone, except Council.

You have to gamble. I am not a gmabler and I hated the thought of gambling. I sat there often deliberately how much I should write down on my tender. How ludicrous. If I put this much, will someone else go higher? If I put this, and no-one else tenders, will I be wasting valuable money I could put towards another rescue dog? It is a stupid, inadequate and revolting way to sell any animal.

[darlingdog]

That tender system is no different to the pounds that offer up the dogs at a set price. First in the door and first to lay the money on the table gets the dog.

No it's quite different. First tender in does not necessarily get the dog, the HIGHEST tender gets the dog so you can be the last one to tender and still get the dog if yours is the highest bid. The dog or cat does not go to what may be the best home for them, they go to the highest bidder and as they have no desexing policy there the puppy farmers are bidding on the purebred entire dogs. The ballot is secret so even if a person is prepared to outbid an unsuitable home there is no way of knowing who is offering the highest money or even what the highest money IS. It's like a raffle for live animals.

[WreckitWhippet]

Unless their is mandatory desexing before rehoming of all pound dogs, it won't matter if they are tendered, sold, given away or otherwise. The BYBer's, the puppy farmers will still pay their money to bring home whatever takes their fancy.

Don't get me wrong, I don't support the tender system and think the system of sale at a set price, is equally as useless, if dogs, bitches and puppies are rehomed entire.

[darlingdog]

Unless their is mandatory desexing before rehoming of all pound dogs, it won't matter if they are tendered, sold, given away or otherwise. The BYBer's, the puppy farmers will still pay their money to bring home whatever takes their fancy.

Don't get me wrong, I don't support the tender system and think the system of sale at a set price, is equally as useless, if dogs, bitches and puppies are rehomed entire.

I agree, no animals should be re homed unless desexed.

[Mila's Mum]

Unless their is mandatory desexing before rehoming of all pound dogs, it won't matter if they are tendered, sold, given away or otherwise. The BYBer's, the puppy farmers will still pay their money to bring home whatever takes their fancy.

Exactly - the tender system was supposedly brought in to stop the bybs and pet shops turning up first thing in the morning, trawling through the pound and picking dogs/puppies for resale at pet stores, and/or keeping them for breeding. That's part of the reason why the tender system is a complete failure. All it does is make these undesirable types wait a bit longer. This is also why people have been trying repeatedly to get Council to bring in compulsory desexing.

Do away with the tender system, bring in compulsory desexing, and have standard adoption fees. It's not hard, but Council seems to be writing the book on Poor Excuses 101

Edited April 27, 2010 by Mila's Mum

[Mila's Mum]

No it's quite different. First tender in does not necessarily get the dog, the HIGHEST tender gets the dog so you can be the last one to tender and still get the dog if yours is the highest bid.

And the highest tender doesn't always get the dog. I know of a breed rescue who tendered on a dog earlier this year. They also advised someone on their waiting list that this dog was at the pound - the person on the list also tendered and won the tender, even though the rescue group put in a higher tender

[~Anne~]

Do away with the tender system, bring in compulsory desexing, and have standard adoption fees.

This is exactly what is needed and it will happen..... it is just a matter of when I would think.

And the highest tender doesn't always get the dog. I know of a breed rescue who tendered on a dog earlier this year. They also advised someone on their waiting list that this dog was at the pound - the person on the list also tendered and won the tender, even though the rescue group put in a higher tender

Yes, this has happened to me. The reason why I know this happened was the person who won the tender surrendered the Pug to me approx 5-6 days later with it's eye hanging from the socket! The injury occured when her existing dog attacked the Pug. She handed over all the paperwork she had for him, including her purchase receipt from Blacktown. I queried the amount she paid as I noticed it was only about $10 more than my tender and her receipt included admin and vacc fee. She confirmed the amount of her original tender and it was less than mine.

[Nekhbet]

I agree why are these dogs not being desexed? Do they really think a purely profit breeder will be put off by a couple of hundred dollars for a young bitch when she can make them a few thousand? Really negates the reason for rehoming. Does keep them in business though I suppose, more puppies means more upcoming auctions

LDH in melb is similar, I asked about a dog and was told first to call in on the first adoptable day would be in with a chance to take the dog ... what happened to best home?

[aleeleewolfe]

the pound at the moment can only desex 10 animals per week, as they go to camden univesity, but i have been told by staff that the tendering system && desexing program is still under review-- these things take time people!! its not going to happen overnight! yes dogs definitely need desexing for health & population reasons, & the council is working on it...

oh and i was in there the other day, a man said to staff, "oh i only have $22 to buy a dog." he stayed there for a good hour! so weird....but thankfully he didnt get one, imagine if he did? thats the thing, alot of people when i was there try & get cheap dogs, (and cats) yet, if you cant afford to buy an animal, how can you afford to properly look after it? also, blacktown pound doesnt tell customers what anyone else has bid, it is what you can afford!! same as if its first in gets the dog, well people are still going to complain they didnt get the dog arent they?

[Ons]

it's a pity that Blacktown pound didn't refer the gentleman to a rescue group, i'm sure that there are lots of dogs looking for homes that have been desexed and vacinated and microchipped that would have been suitable for the family and the price would have been about $400.00 for a dog that is "known" rather than "unknown quantity"

at Blacktown pound. I fostered a couple of coolies from Blacktown Pound for a few days that had the worse kennel cough. And they were supposed to be desexed but weren't so the head rescuer had to pay the price to get them released of undesexed dogs

pounds should desex all dogs before release. You would think that they would get the message that this would end up making less work for them in the future.

[Mila's Mum]

but i have been told by staff that the tendering system && desexing program is still under review-- these things take time people!! its not going to happen overnight! yes dogs definitely need desexing for health & population reasons, & the council is working on it...

And how much more time do you think Council needs to keep reviewing and reviewing and reviewing and ....... ? It's not hard to change the system, and Council has been coming up with the "it takes time" excuse for years. They keep trying to pull the wool over people's eyes, but it's wearing very thin, and more and more people are starting to see it for what it is - an excuse to do nothing. It's not hard to change the system - the only thing that's hard to change is the 18th century mentality of a certain Councillor who doesn't think that compulsory desexing should be brought in. And when he's one of two Councillors who have ultimate responsibility for the pound, it's no wonder "it's still under review".

Edited May 3, 2010 by Mila's Mum

[Mila's Mum]

oh and i was in there the other day, a man said to staff, "oh i only have $22 to buy a dog." he stayed there for a good hour! so weird....but thankfully he didnt get one, imagine if he did? thats the thing, alot of people when i was there try & get cheap dogs, (and cats) yet, if you cant afford to buy an animal, how can you afford to properly look after it? also, blacktown pound doesnt tell customers what anyone else has bid, it is what you can afford!! same as if its first in gets the dog, well people are still going to complain they didnt get the dog arent they?

If there was a set adoption fee that included all the work done, then you wouldn't get the nit wits coming in who want to adopt a dog for $22. People shouldn't have to try and guess what they should bid on a dog bec if they want the dog desexed, they don't know for sure the dog will make it on to the desexing program. And if it doesn't then they are up for a lot more money.

For anyone who wants to read more, there is this thread

http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?showtopic=192191

Edited May 2, 2010 by Mila's Mum

[aleeleewolfe]

The tender system is a PITA for rescuers as well. To rescue a dog from Blacktown, the rescue group has to put the minimum bid on the dog, and hope that if a member of the public wants the dog they will put higher than the minimum on. If the dog then goes to rescue, the rescue group has to pay that minimum charge, and from memory you don't get anything for it except the dog. It would be so much simpler if they just let rescue put their name on a dog and it goes to them if due to be euthanased (which is what most pounds do)

For this reason we didn't often get dogs out of Blacktown pound - it was too hard! This might be why they have (apparently) high kill rates as they are not able to go outside their tender system to work with rescue. Plus it would also put off public purchasers.

And of course I agree with everyone that compulsory desexing would solve any problem of BYBs getting the dogs.

not if you have a clause 16d. look into it, it helps...

[~Anne~]

The tender system is a PITA for rescuers as well. To rescue a dog from Blacktown, the rescue group has to put the minimum bid on the dog, and hope that if a member of the public wants the dog they will put higher than the minimum on. If the dog then goes to rescue, the rescue group has to pay that minimum charge, and from memory you don't get anything for it except the dog. It would be so much simpler if they just let rescue put their name on a dog and it goes to them if due to be euthanased (which is what most pounds do)

For this reason we didn't often get dogs out of Blacktown pound - it was too hard! This might be why they have (apparently) high kill rates as they are not able to go outside their tender system to work with rescue. Plus it would also put off public purchasers.

And of course I agree with everyone that compulsory desexing would solve any problem of BYBs getting the dogs.

not if you have a clause 16d. look into it, it helps...

The 16D doesn't neccessarily help any one. The dog is open for tender first. This means that people are bidding on dogs, desexed and undessexed and what isn't tendered on, can then be rescued. Having an exemption clause means nothing in regard to the current tender system. BMP - I am confused as to why you think rescues need to bid?

I think part of the issue is that rescues like to be given first 'dibs' on dogs in pounds (beofre the general public). I know I do. However, that isn't the way the majority operate, and in fact, it is the other way round. The public are offered the chance to purchase first and then rescues pick up those at risk of euth due to not being sold and their time limit running out. At least, that's the way I see it.