Loose Lead Walking

[Mas1981]

I have a labrador thats nearly 9 months old now, from about 16 weeks he started to pull on lead and we were advised to get him a gentle leader halter and use that when we walk him etc. Now thats all well and good but at 9 months he still cannot walk nicely on lead without the gentle leader, he pulls and lunges to get to people/other dogs, when no one else is around he is way better. I have tried to just stop and making him sit and wait, I have tried changing directions when he pulls. None if it seems to work.

Another thing is that he has no recall off lead, am I expecting too much from him at 9 months?

[poodlefan]

I think some lessons with a trainer would be a good idea for both of you.

Recalls have to be taught.. and constantly reinforced. So does loose lead walking. A good trainer can really kick start these skills.

[Got Spots]

with my 2 whippets for recalls we turn it into a game

one of us holds the dogs and the other runs off down usually the beach but can do it anywhere then turns around and calls them in a really excited voice. Then the person holding them lets go.

It helps that they like to run

but when they reach the calling person they get made a fuss of - lots of excited praise, and sometimes send them back the otherway

We have done this with my 2yo rescue adn the pup and they have quite good recalls even off prey if not too focussed

As for loose leash walking talk to Steve from K9 force he has a really good distance program that I saw demonstrated at a training camp - it was AWESOME !!!!!

[persephone]

Hi- to teach these things to your pup-YOU have to be good at it, and understand the basics of how/why it works.

My suggestion would be to seek advice from a trainer.Having a trainer come to your home and work with you is a great way to learn and gain confidence!

Do you take him to an obedience club or anything? That may be a place to start if you don't want to see a trainer privately

[Steve K9Pro]

K9: In another thread there is some feedback on our distance learning packages, we also have one on teaching the Loose Leash Walk, that may be of interest to you.

[Mas1981]

Hi- to teach these things to your pup-YOU have to be good at it, and understand the basics of how/why it works.

My suggestion would be to seek advice from a trainer.Having a trainer come to your home and work with you is a great way to learn and gain confidence!

Do you take him to an obedience club or anything? That may be a place to start if you don't want to see a trainer privately

Yes I do go to obedience classes, they say I must keep on with the gentle leader.

[persephone]

they say I must keep on with the gentle leader.

and just how many months/years do they say you will have to do it before he gets the message?

check out K9 force's distance package, and arrange for a private training session or two...seems you need some more help

[mrs tornsocks]

Hi- to teach these things to your pup-YOU have to be good at it, and understand the basics of how/why it works.

My suggestion would be to seek advice from a trainer.Having a trainer come to your home and work with you is a great way to learn and gain confidence!

Do you take him to an obedience club or anything? That may be a place to start if you don't want to see a trainer privately

Yes I do go to obedience classes, they say I must keep on with the gentle leader.

MM, you probably know this but some clubs won't allow gentle leaders. eg. the obedience club near us (I have never been) will not allow them. I know this because we have an old lady in our street that owns a lovely youngish goldie -- however she is just too weak to hold him so she uses a halti.

Is it worth calling around a few clubs, or reaching out to a few WA DOLers and asking of clubs that won't allow them as a regular option ? I am presuming this is because they prefer to teach the 'right' way to walk without needing a halti.

It's a tough one, because you want to NOT use it but in the interim it's impossible to walk him.

[Mas1981]

Hi- to teach these things to your pup-YOU have to be good at it, and understand the basics of how/why it works.

My suggestion would be to seek advice from a trainer.Having a trainer come to your home and work with you is a great way to learn and gain confidence!

Do you take him to an obedience club or anything? That may be a place to start if you don't want to see a trainer privately

Yes I do go to obedience classes, they say I must keep on with the gentle leader.

MM, you probably know this but some clubs won't allow gentle leaders. eg. the obedience club near us (I have never been) will not allow them. I know this because we have an old lady in our street that owns a lovely youngish goldie -- however she is just too weak to hold him so she uses a halti.

Is it worth calling around a few clubs, or reaching out to a few WA DOLers and asking of clubs that won't allow them as a regular option ? I am presuming this is because they prefer to teach the 'right' way to walk without needing a halti.

It's a tough one, because you want to NOT use it but in the interim it's impossible to walk him.

It is a hard one and at this stage in the game I dont really have the money to do personal training , I am looking for a job so maybe once I get one I can look at this option. I am meeting a friend at the park tomorrow night and we are going to work with him a bit.

[mrs tornsocks]

Hi- to teach these things to your pup-YOU have to be good at it, and understand the basics of how/why it works.

My suggestion would be to seek advice from a trainer.Having a trainer come to your home and work with you is a great way to learn and gain confidence!

Do you take him to an obedience club or anything? That may be a place to start if you don't want to see a trainer privately

Yes I do go to obedience classes, they say I must keep on with the gentle leader.

MM, you probably know this but some clubs won't allow gentle leaders. eg. the obedience club near us (I have never been) will not allow them. I know this because we have an old lady in our street that owns a lovely youngish goldie -- however she is just too weak to hold him so she uses a halti.

Is it worth calling around a few clubs, or reaching out to a few WA DOLers and asking of clubs that won't allow them as a regular option ? I am presuming this is because they prefer to teach the 'right' way to walk without needing a halti.

It's a tough one, because you want to NOT use it but in the interim it's impossible to walk him.

It is a hard one and at this stage in the game I dont really have the money to do personal training , I am looking for a job so maybe once I get one I can look at this option. I am meeting a friend at the park tomorrow night and we are going to work with him a bit.

yes, that's why perhaps a different club for a while might help ? Just a thought.

I'm sure with lots of practice and some experienced guidance he will get better.

[Red Fox]

Hmmm... I went to an obedience club for about 4 months. Owners of dogs that pulled were told to use a halti, funnily enough the ones who used them often commented that their dogs always pulled without it. Sorry but to me that's NOT a well trained dog

In my case Kei HATED the halti. He wore it for one lesson and went mad trying to get it off, then shut down completely I never used one again.

I have done the K9 Force LLW program. It's not expensive, very easy to follow and the support is fantastic

Here's a video of Kei LLW about 1.5 weeks into the program:

Not bad considering he was deemed a 'puller' by the obedience club and needed a halti

[Tiggy]

Loose lead walking takes patience and consistency. I always use a flat collar. I don't pull on the lead because the dog will pull back, that's oppostion reflex. It must be taught on a loose lead. My dogs have an 'at my side' or 'go on' command. I noticed when I was training Banjo not to come past my side I was anticipating and moving my hand, so now I stick my thumb in my belt loop to keep my hand still and problem fixed, it was me! So the way I teach it is the lead must stay loose. If the dog pulls we stop or now I just have to slow down for a step or two. I also stop regularly and the dogs should stand at my side.

[bedazzledx2]

Gentle leaders and halti's ect are terrific manegment tools, as is a harness, but they rarely teach the dog how to control himself and walk nicely on a loose lead. You have to train it. The problem with most club obedience is they try to teach the dog to 'heel' and tend to do endless hours of group heelwork which is IMO neither useful for competition heelwork or everyday loose leash walking! My dogs heel for competition in a very specific defined manner but I would never take them for a walk at heel. I do get fed up occasionally with them pulling and remind them we are not doing this by making like a tree! They get the message and comply Pulling is enormously rewarding for most dogs and there is a saying "pulling builds drive" As you are finding the 'make like a tree' is time consuming and the dog doesn't get to go for a walk while you are training it. It does work but you really have to be consistant and reward when he is back in position. I would invest in a no pull harness for everyday use so that you can take him for a normal walk and train loose leash walking separately on a flat collar.

As for the recall go to this site http://www.shirleychong.com/keepers/Lesson6.html It really does work!

I have a labrador thats nearly 9 months old now, from about 16 weeks he started to pull on lead and we were advised to get him a gentle leader halter and use that when we walk him etc. Now thats all well and good but at 9 months he still cannot walk nicely on lead without the gentle leader, he pulls and lunges to get to people/other dogs, when no one else is around he is way better. I have tried to just stop and making him sit and wait, I have tried changing directions when he pulls. None if it seems to work.

Another thing is that he has no recall off lead, am I expecting too much from him at 9 months?

[Aidan]

he pulls and lunges to get to people/other dogs, when no one else is around he is way better.

If your dog isn't pulling much with no other dogs around then build up a nice, strong behaviour with no other dogs around. When he does pull, stop, AS SOON AS he starts to slacken off the leash or turns to look at you, click and treat. You might need to take a step back if he really doesn't get it. You want him to learn that if you stop he has to loosen the leash immediately and fall back into step with you. Do this until he really, really gets the idea with no other dogs around. This is a lot easier to learn with help from someone who knows how.

Then enlist the help of a friend with a dog. Go somewhere with lots of room. Have your friend walk up and down the paddock with you with however much space between you is required to keep your dog walking on a loose leash. Then bring them in closer together, little by little. Keep him succeeding, without success there is nothing to reinforce and if you're not reinforcing you're not building a stronger behaviour. So pay attention, if he's struggling give them more room, if he's doing it too easy, bring them a little closer.

The policy on head halters in my classes is that they are only used when the dog is able to over-power the handler, in which case they provide leverage for safety sake. An alternative is a front attaching harness which is easier to fit and usually more comfortable for the dog, but does not provide quite the same margin of safety. In either case I recommend a "balance leash" attached to a flat collar or martingale, and this is what the dog is walked on. The halter or harness is only there for leverage when required.

Different people use them in different ways but that is what I teach.

[Tiggy]

I like to have my dogs on a walk 'at my side' but not 'heel' which is totally different like bedazzled said , if I say 'go on' they can go to the end of their leash but still no pulling.

[Adele]

Hi When I first started with Sooty we were also recommended a 'gentle leader' and purchased one from the club but I decided that it just masks the problem it doesn't teach her how to walk so I didn't use it. No-one said anything about her not having it on and I made the decision that we would just use a flat collar. To help keep the leash loose I stopped everytime she pulled (like bedazzled said 'become a tree'!) she would turn around and think why aren't we walking which also made the leash loose and we would start walking again. Yep very boring and time consuming but she now understands that to move forward there has to be no tension.

Also to add... I can see why we were recommended it as she used to get so excited and dart towards other dogs but working on focus helped a lot as well - I gave a lot of praise and rewards for 'watch me'.

Recall - I did a lot of long line work and used the Really Reliable Recall DVD. She has gone from ignoring me to having a pretty good recall...not 100% but a lot better than before.

I soooo understand where you are coming from because they were my feelings as well but what ever you do make sure you are consistent which will help Mason understand quicker what is expected of him.

[Mas1981]

Hi When I first started with Sooty we were also recommended a 'gentle leader' and purchased one from the club but I decided that it just masks the problem it doesn't teach her how to walk so I didn't use it. No-one said anything about her not having it on and I made the decision that we would just use a flat collar. To help keep the leash loose I stopped everytime she pulled (like bedazzled said 'become a tree'!) she would turn around and think why aren't we walking which also made the leash loose and we would start walking again. Yep very boring and time consuming but she now understands that to move forward there has to be no tension.

Also to add... I can see why we were recommended it as she used to get so excited and dart towards other dogs but working on focus helped a lot as well - I gave a lot of praise and rewards for 'watch me'.

Recall - I did a lot of long line work and used the Really Reliable Recall DVD. She has gone from ignoring me to having a pretty good recall...not 100% but a lot better than before.

I soooo understand where you are coming from because they were my feelings as well but what ever you do make sure you are consistent which will help Mason understand quicker what is expected of him.

I can also see why they suggested it as neither hubby or I can hold him with a normal collar he is very strong but i feel he has to now learn to walk nicely because if we leave it any longer he is never going to learn. He is so smart it cant be impossible to teach him to do this!

I have tried the harness where you clip the lead to the front and that didnt work at all for us.

[SkySoaringMagpie]

Different clubs have different philosophies but I like ours - which is you can have a gentle leader if you need it to get you out of a hole (ie, dog is stronger than you, is the difference between coming to training/walking or not). However, you can't pass the third level of basic classes with it still on. So it's perceived as a tool, that you have to wean yourself off. I like Aidan's advice.