laeral Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 I'd take her to your local IPO club, you'll learn more about training in drive and get better results Have you done the K9 Force program, Yesmaam? I don't need to pay anyone to learn about this stuff. "We" have been training this way for years. What Steve does is good for some but if you want first hand experience from people who are actually out there trialling dogs using these methods then go to your local IPO club. The focus in an IPO club is competition not programs that cost you money depending on what you sign up for....... Not everyone has access to an IPO club I don't need to pay anyone to learn about this stuff. "We" have been training this way for years. What Steve does is good for some but if you want first hand experience from people who are actually out there trialling dogs using these methods then go to your local IPO club. The focus in an IPO club is competition not programs that cost you money depending on what you sign up for....... But if you've never done the course how can you know a local IPO club would be better for anyone considering it? Would love to know if my local IPO would be happy to take on my beagle :laugh: I would love to see that! I'd take her to your local IPO club, you'll learn more about training in drive and get better results Have you done the K9 Force program, Yesmaam? I don't need to pay anyone to learn about this stuff. "We" have been training this way for years. What Steve does is good for some but if you want first hand experience from people who are actually out there trialling dogs using these methods then go to your local IPO club. The focus in an IPO club is competition not programs that cost you money depending on what you sign up for....... Who says you have to use TID for competition anyway? I couldn't give a monkeys about trialling of any type, but attending more than one of Steve's seminars has given me insights into ways of working with my pet dog that have improved both his and my quality of life. Problem with clubs as I see them is they can way be too focused on competition, they aren't interested in people who have below average talent! Not to mention some of the how shall I put it "know it all" characters that you come across with their own "expert" value judgements usually based on their own limited experience with their particular breed and "it's right because I have been doing it this way for so long". Steve doesn't care who you are or how bad or good you are he cares that you get the results you want out of your dog and that might not include being a trialling genius, competition is not the be all and end all of life. I agree, I am not interested in trialling or competition just after a better way of training my dog and getting the most out of her. I don't beleive an IPO club would suit us as my dog does not do well in group settings, there is no way I could have got the focus out of her in one to begin with. Doing Steves course I have - a tailor made program that suits both of us, a 'personal' trainer who answers all my questions, is enjoyable and frankly is showing results. Whats not to like Why come on here and pay out on a program you don't have first hand knowledge in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 ETA Hmm not to mention just having googled IPO that it is only open to certain working breeds. A lot of the people posting here about their successes with the program would be excluded merely by the breed of their dog. I think that depends on the club and organisation. The organisation that our local club belongs to only allows certain breeds to do the protection phase and earn full Sch titles. But other breeds are allowed to do the obedience and tracking components, and can earn BH, OB1 - 3, TR1 - 3, FH1 - 2 titles. However, I don't think there are any allowances in jump heights or dumbbell weights for smaller breeds, so you might have trouble doing the obedience phase with a smaller breed anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laeral Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 BTW congratulations gsdog2 on signing up for the program. Are you using prey/food drive? Keep us updated on how you are going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quickasyoucan Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 ETA Hmm not to mention just having googled IPO that it is only open to certain working breeds. A lot of the people posting here about their successes with the program would be excluded merely by the breed of their dog. I think that depends on the club and organisation. The organisation that our local club belongs to only allows certain breeds to do the protection phase and earn full Sch titles. But other breeds are allowed to do the obedience and tracking components, and can earn BH, OB1 - 3, TR1 - 3, FH1 - 2 titles. However, I don't think there are any allowances in jump heights or dumbbell weights for smaller breeds, so you might have trouble doing the obedience phase with a smaller breed anyway. Staranais, I looked at the IPO Rules and it said, "Only registered dogs from recognized AUSC working dog breeds are allowed to participate". ? Anyway for me it is moot, my dog probably wouldn't mind a group setting but I do. I am one of those labelled, "does not play well with others"! I prefer the one on one personal attention so I can sort my dogs issues out rather than a generic approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 ok so my Boston would have no hope then...although it is making me smile thinking of her hanging onto someones arm while they try to escape her :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 "I agree, I am not interested in trialling or competition just after a better way of training my dog and getting the most out of her." Good on you and everyone else but the original poster IS interested in competition and says they have a high prey drive GSD. My post was to the owner of this thread, no one else. They have a breed that is allowed to compete in IPO which is why I replied. I was asked if I have done the course and I answered honestly. I don't need a "course" on basic drive training. Like i said "we" have been doing this stuff for years, it is not something that is new to us...... Yes our focus is different to that of a pet owner which is why my answer was not for all the pet owners out there, it was for the person who asked the original question on training a dog in drive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Staranais, I looked at the IPO Rules and it said, "Only registered dogs from recognized AUSC working dog breeds are allowed to participate". ? Actually, the only dogs that are allowed to participate in IPO are FCI recognised working breeds. AUSC is one of the Australian organisations that chooses to follow international rules. The rules are made at international level not AUSC level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Good on you and everyone else but the original poster IS interested in competition and says they have a high prey drive GSD. My post was to the owner of this thread, no one else. They have a breed that is allowed to compete in IPO which is why I replied. I was asked if I have done the course and I answered honestly. I don't need a "course" on basic drive training. Like i said "we" have been doing this stuff for years, it is not something that is new to us...... Yes our focus is different to that of a pet owner which is why my answer was not for all the pet owners out there, it was for the person who asked the original question on training a dog in drive. It wasn't your suggestion that people have questioned, but the way you said she would learn more at an IPO club and would get better results. How can you possibly know what is best for the OP and her dog? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) You have a GSD right Laeral, looks workingline...... is it? Re: doesn't do well in group settings? Avoiding the situation is not the answer............... Is he social and environmentally sound? Edited January 25, 2010 by Yesmaam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Staranais, I looked at the IPO Rules and it said, "Only registered dogs from recognized AUSC working dog breeds are allowed to participate". ? Like I said, I think different organisations may differ on what's allowed. But I've watched a trial run by Dogsport NZ, affiliated to AUSC, where there was a mixed breed labrador type dog competing in OB, so it's definitely allowed by some organisations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 It wasn't your suggestion that people have questioned, but the way you said she would learn more at an IPO club and would get better results. How can you possibly know what is best for the OP and her dog? Your right I don't, but if the person wants to take the dog to competition why not give it a chance to go all the way in international rules and place it in a competition focussed club that harnesess training in drive (very differerent to that of your average local OB club, no offence intended but its the truth). It was just a suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laeral Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 You have a GSD right Laeral, looks workingline...... is it? Re: doesn't do well in group settings? Avoiding the situation is not the answer............... Is he social and environmentally sound? Yes Yes & Yes I am not avoiding the situation. I am dealing with it in a way that works for us. After months of failed training at Obedience school, I have gone back to training my dog at home with Steves program in a non distracting environment and have been adding distractions over time. I have found this works best for her rather than throwing her in with a group of dogs initially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 It wasn't your suggestion that people have questioned, but the way you said she would learn more at an IPO club and would get better results. How can you possibly know what is best for the OP and her dog? Your right I don't, but if the person wants to take the dog to competition why not give it a chance to go all the way in international rules and place it in a competition focussed club that harnesess training in drive (very differerent to that of your average local OB club, no offence intended but its the truth). It was just a suggestion. however you didnt even ascertain that the OP wanted to do this (competition). as i said you have come across as extremely arrogant and a bit of a know it all. you made strong suggestions based on limited knowledge not a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Staranais, I looked at the IPO Rules and it said, "Only registered dogs from recognized AUSC working dog breeds are allowed to participate". ? Like I said, I think different organisations may differ on what's allowed. But I've watched a trial run by Dogsport NZ, affiliated to AUSC, where there was a mixed breed labrador type dog competing in OB, so it's definitely allowed by some organisations. My guess is that the mixed breed lab you are referring to was probably only doing a BH (similar to a companion dog test). I think any breed can do a BH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) Your right I don't, but if the person wants to take the dog to competition why not give it a chance to go all the way in international rules and place it in a competition focussed club that harnesess training in drive (very differerent to that of your average local OB club, no offence intended but its the truth). It was just a suggestion. however you didnt even ascertain that the OP wanted to do this (competition). as i said you have come across as extremely arrogant and a bit of a know it all. you made strong suggestions based on limited knowledge not a good start. gsdog2 said - I have a 12mth GSD female who literally goes nuts over "any" ball and I'd like to learn how to harness this obsession correctly as I'm only picking up bits and pieces from here and other sites on the net. I would like to trial her this year and have taken her to classes since she was 8 wks, but she's not half as keen to work there as she is when I take her to the park and use the ball when training. Wot are you talking about Jaxx's Buddy????? ............................................................ ... re: know it all, arrogant etc...... Fact is that training a working dog using its natural drives is not something new let me tell you. The old methods I have seen in OB clubs over the years are light years behind and I think Steve has tapped into a very lucrative market (pet and basic OB market) and good on him, why not. For competition focussed people, the same info and more (and by more I mean more info from people who have actually put this stuff to work at the top end of competition - a lot different) is available at your local IPO club for a fraction of the cost. Edited January 25, 2010 by Yesmaam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 If you guys want to pay lots of money go ahead but the same info and more (and by more I mean more info from people who have actually put this stuff to work at the top end of competition - a lot different) is available at your local IPO club for a fraction of the cost. Surely that would be dependant on the IPO and the trainers there? Again I would love to know if an IPO club would be happy to train myself and my beagle for obedience competition, using food drive not prey drive, dedicating the same time and knowledge to helping us (and believe me, I need a lot of help ) as Steve does. You can't possibly know that an IPO club would offer the same info and more as the K9 Force program without having done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yesmaam Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 If you guys want to pay lots of money go ahead but the same info and more (and by more I mean more info from people who have actually put this stuff to work at the top end of competition - a lot different) is available at your local IPO club for a fraction of the cost. Surely that would be dependant on the IPO and the trainers there? Again I would love to know if an IPO club would be happy to train myself and my beagle for obedience competition, using food drive not prey drive, dedicating the same time and knowledge to helping us (and believe me, I need a lot of help ) as Steve does. You can't possibly know that an IPO club would offer the same info and more as the K9 Force program without having done it. I edited my post Huski Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huski Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 I am training with a competition focus - still wondering how an IPO club would be able to help me?? Club training is not for everyone and not everyone has access to a good club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxx'sBuddy Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Your right I don't, but if the person wants to take the dog to competition why not give it a chance to go all the way in international rules and place it in a competition focussed club that harnesess training in drive (very differerent to that of your average local OB club, no offence intended but its the truth). It was just a suggestion. however you didnt even ascertain that the OP wanted to do this (competition). as i said you have come across as extremely arrogant and a bit of a know it all. you made strong suggestions based on limited knowledge not a good start. gsdog2 said - I have a 12mth GSD female who literally goes nuts over "any" ball and I'd like to learn how to harness this obsession correctly as I'm only picking up bits and pieces from here and other sites on the net. I would like to trial her this year and have taken her to classes since she was 8 wks, but she's not half as keen to work there as she is when I take her to the park and use the ball when training. Wot are you talking about Jaxx's Buddy????? ............................................................ ... re: know it all, arrogant etc...... Fact is that training a working dog using its natural drives is not something new let me tell you. The old methods I have seen in OB clubs over the years are light years behind and I think Steve has tapped into a very lucrative market (pet and basic OB market) and good on him, why not. For competition focussed people, the same info and more (and by more I mean more info from people who have actually put this stuff to work at the top end of competition - a lot different) is available at your local IPO club for a fraction of the cost. so you say but why should i believe you when you know nothing of the course Steve runs? what bothers me about your posts is the lack of understanding of what people are trying to achieve and your arrogance so i am now paying no attention to your pronouncements. i love ignore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K9Pro Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) Y: I was asked if I have done the course and I answered honestly. I don't need a "course" on basic drive training. Like i said "we" have been doing this stuff for years, it is not something that is new to us...... K9: Maybe I am wrong but I don't see anyone promoting Training in drive as a new thing? That seems to be coming up often in your posts, that "we" have been doing it for years. Whilst I don't doubt that, perhaps you can tell us who "we" are? Y: Your right I don't, but if the person wants to take the dog to competition why not give it a chance to go all the way in international rules and place it in a competition focussed club that harnesses training in drive (very differerent to that of your average local OB club, no offence intended but its the truth). It was just a suggestion. K9: As we have discovered you dont know what the program envolves but and this may help but, we often have people still attending their club whilst supporting them through this program, call it extra help in many cases. there are some dogs that we build drive in an environment in which the dog is confident, then when drive is available they can go back to their club & use what they have built. On more than a few occasions people have been turned away from dog sport clubs being told their dog doesn't have enough drive, then drive was built through my program & the dogs went onto compete, and compete very well. I hear you about it was a suggestion, but when someone comes to a forum & makes their very first post in the nature you have, it doesn't go down well at times. Y: re: know it all, arrogant etc...... Fact is that training a working dog using its natural drives is not something new let me tell you. K9: who is saying it is? The old methods I have seen in OB clubs over the years are light years behind and I think Steve has tapped into a very lucrative market (pet and basic OB market) and good on him, why not. For competition focussed people, the same info and more (and by more I mean more info from people who have actually put this stuff to work at the top end of competition - a lot different) is available at your local IPO club for a fraction of the cost. K9: Ok well there are a thousand ways to train in drive so saying you get the same info & more is just rubbish. You don't know what you get as you have never done it. Many clubs are light years behind in terms of training a competition dog, but many aren't & they don't have to be dog sport clubs. You have put your opinion forward, thanks for that. Edited January 25, 2010 by K9 Force Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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