Maltese/shitzu

[W Sibs]

what a very confusing thread to read

Edited November 18, 2010 by CW EW

[halfthewords]

I think in my line of work I would see a typical representation of the little mongrel cross bred Maltese Shih Tzu, I see them from pet shops, BYBers and the puppy farms. I can't say I've seen one yet with decent conformation and I'm not talking about blue ribbon winners, just a basic well put together animal, that can function.

I am yet to see one with a front end that is not east/west. I'm not talking about dogs that toe out but the whole front end turns out. They have popped elbows, some have fronts that would be classed as deformed. Very weak from the pastern, going into very flat splayed feet.

Moselle, you might not think this matters much, but when you can't hold a dog by the leg to run clippers down it , due to pain not fright, then there's something very wrong.

I've seen them dragging their toes on the move.

They fail to wear down their nails at all. Most owners would expect some natural wear in any breed, but this doesn't happen with this particular cross.

I'll by pass the wry mouths and deformed jaws, because the dogs can still eat.

Perhaps the things that scares me most is their patellas, you can feel the knee caps on many popping in an out, by simply lifting their back legs. It's frightening and I'd say that 50% of the dogs I see are like this.

Some might see a robust little dog, typically I see a disaster on four legs.

I agree with RSG. I work at a dog rescue and 60% of our dogs are malt/shih crosses. Some of the dogs who look more Shih Tzus have terrible duck feet and are typically long and short vs long/tall so they are disproportionate. Many come in with patella problems, overgrown toenails embedded in pads and neck/back issues from their head carriage.

[Greytmate]

Poor little dogs must get a bit sore as they age.

[Hairy Maclary]

They fail to wear down their nails at all. Most owners would expect some natural wear in any breed, but this doesn't happen with this particular cross.

RSG, I'm curious as to what conditions would cause this? I had a shih-tzu/JRT cross who barely wore down her nails even though she was very active and was walked daily.

[Alfie02]

I am the owner of two Maltese Shih Tzu dogs, both purchased from BYB situations. Both are family dogs and I grew up with the older boy since primary school. I am now more the wiser and realise that they were from BYB's and the next dog I get will be from a reputable breeder or from a rescue organisation.

Onto the topic of heath...well it can go wither way. Our old boy who is 11 is very healthy and in fact the vet said his heart sounds so good he will probably last forever . But his temperament with strangers is less than desirable, and he inherited this from his mother, who unknown to us untill months after his purchase, was human agressive. We extensivley socialised him as a pup, but this did not make much difference to his acceptance of strangers. He is however, getting much better in his old age.

Our other boy, who is 4 has more health problems. He has severe luxating (sp??) patellas which will require sugery in the next year or so and a heart murmer. His temperament however is much better than the old boy even though he did not recive the same amount of socilisation as a pup.

So I guess the point of this is that when buying a cross breed dog, which is what a Maltese Shih Tzu is, you really dont know exactly what you are getting and are taking a big chance health and temperament wise. Although in saying this, I love my boys and would not trade them for the anything

Edited November 18, 2010 by Alfie02

[W Sibs]

Despite Charlie being my heart dog and has the best temperament ever... I will probably never get a cross breed again, unless I'm rescuing and I'll be only rescuing senior dogs, as they can live their life being spoilt, loved and happy.

[MalteseLuna]

Multi-shits are dime-a-dozen in rescue and pounds.

Wow - what a rude name. The breed names MALTESE and SHIH TZU. I really hate it when people talk about the Maltese or Shih tzu breeds (or their crosses) in such manners - it's so over done.

Yes Clyde, I agree, the shihtzus are generally nicer than the malts!!

False. I bet you haven't met many purebred (I mean from registered breeders) Maltese - because they are absolutely wonderful. Shih tzu's are also wonderful BUT they have very different temperaments.

Mongrel through and through, and are horrible usually when mixed together

It's probably the most common mix of dogs that I groom. I have heaps on my clients list, and for the most part they are nice little dogs. Of course, in my biased opinion that is the Shih Tzu coming through, if they ever snap then I blame that on the Maltese parentage

Again - you must not have met many "real" Maltese then. Maltese are not generally snappy, yappy or nasty. If they are it's more likely due to improper socialization - and all dogs have this issue. Why blame it on the breed... when it's more likely to be the owners fault.

I guess I was very lucky with my first two (and only) pure Maltese: they were both delightful dogs and not at all yappy and I could take them anywhere without worrying that they might snap or yap. Even apart from my own, my experience with Maltese has not been that they are "yappy and snappy".

are the maltcross shihtzu still popular

i remember bourke did a big expose on them and even vets said how good they were ...something about tempering the flaws of both breeds

i think as pups theyre cute but as adults they can be quite odd looking...

tear staining is something i dont like in any dog but this seems to be quite a big prob with these little crosses

i havent seen them in petshops the way i used to years ago

oodles seem to still lead in popularity

i like shihtzus...and the coat retains the beautiful markings..the crosses seem bleached out by the maltese gene

There is no such thing as the "Maltese gene" and the breed is supposed to be white - with no markings.

Tear staining is a problem is most white/light coloured coated dogs - particularly those with large eyes. It generally depends on the diet, environment, eye shape etc on whether a dog will stain not just the breed.

i think as pups theyre cute but as adults they can be quite odd looking...

Well, hardly. You are more likely to get an unattractive Maltese than you are to get an unattractive cross or pure Shih Tzu.

What is with these comments. Both Breeds (Maltese and Shih Tzu) are lovely in their own right. Rating them against each other is subjective.

How can you not just love that face (yes she does seem to be glaring at the camera)

Just realised this is a really old thread... sorry!

Edited November 18, 2010 by MalteseLuna

[Moselle]

are the maltcross shihtzu still popular

i remember bourke did a big expose on them and even vets said how good they were ...something about tempering the flaws of both breeds

i think as pups theyre cute but as adults they can be quite odd looking...

tear staining is something i dont like in any dog but this seems to be quite a big prob with these little crosses

i havent seen them in petshops the way i used to years ago

oodles seem to still lead in popularity

i like shihtzus...and the coat retains the beautiful markings..the crosses seem bleached out by the maltese gene

Tear staining is a problem with purebreds and crossbreds alike, lol....then again, not all purebreds or xbreds have the "tear staining" problem.

I must say that you are misinformed in saying that it's the maltese gene that is responsible for bleaching out the crosses.

[Moselle]

Just noticed that some of these posts are quite old....howz'at??

Edited to add that I just checked the date of this thread and its dated back to last year, I dont have a habit of assuming that some threads could be so old. Hope to hear from brad again...strange though....

Edited November 18, 2010 by Moselle

[WreckitWhippet]

They fail to wear down their nails at all. Most owners would expect some natural wear in any breed, but this doesn't happen with this particular cross.

RSG, I'm curious as to what conditions would cause this? I had a shih-tzu/JRT cross who barely wore down her nails even though she was very active and was walked daily.

basic anatomy of the foot and pastern, the nails fail to come into contact with the ground.

[Adnil444]

Mongrel through and through, and are horrible usually when mixed together

I totally disagree with your comment! I have had pure breed dogs all my life except for the last dog, which was a Maltese/Shitzu. He passed away 2 weeks ago with cancer at age 15. He was the best, most loyal, obedient, and loving dog I have ever had. I would not hesitate to purchase another Maltese/Shitzu. Some would say there is not bad dog, just a bad owner. Dogs like people learn by example.

Welcome to DOL, bradf1405.

The problem with cross breeds is that you can in one puppy get traits from one breed, and other puppy will be more like the other parent, and there is no way to tell what you will get in your mix puppy.

So while your last dog was excellent, your next one might be totally different. It is such a big lottery as to what traits you may end up with when people cross breed.

If your last dog had excellent traits, it would be worth you researching both malt, and shih tzu, and seeing which breed has the traits that were most like what you loved about your last dog. And then buying that breed to ensure you get a dog that is how you want it to be.

The other danger with cross breeding is that there is no incentive for the breeder to use really good dogs for breeding, as cross breed fluffy puppies will sell very fast regardless of any physical problems they may develop when older, and it is hard to see problems under a fluffy coat.

Buying a purebreed from a good ethical breeder is really the only way you can buy a puppy and know what to expect in terms of conformation and behaviour.

Cross breeds such are a lucky dip. And unfortunately, many grow up to be so different from what their owners imagined when they first met their cute ball of fluff.

Unfortunately, there are bad dogs and good dogs and sometimes good owners can end up with a bad dogs if they buy one that is really badly bred. Good breeders are so important for the future of dogs. They are the ones that developed the traits and looks that we admire in our dogs. Cross breeders do not do anything to ensure that the dog they breed has the right genes to pass these traits on to future generations of dogs. They are in it for the money alone, and they put no thought into genetic health at all.

I have also found buying purebreeds from registered ethical breeders is also a lottery - you may know what the dog will look like when it gets older and perhaps have some idea of what the temperament should be, but that doesn't guarantee that you will get the dog in the breed specifiation. I've had great danes (4), two from the same breeder and totally different in conformation and temperament. There is no guarantee at all with any dog.

[stormie]

Adnil were the two Danes from the same breeder of similar breeding/lines?

[Greytmate]

I have also found buying purebreeds from registered ethical breeders is also a lottery - you may know what the dog will look like when it gets older and perhaps have some idea of what the temperament should be, but that doesn't guarantee that you will get the dog in the breed specifiation. I've had great danes (4), two from the same breeder and totally different in conformation and temperament. There is no guarantee at all with any dog.

It isn't anywhere near as much of a lottery as buying a dog without a pedigree.

Having the pedigree means that your dog will be a combination of genes of its ancestors, and by learning more about or knowing those dogs and studying pedigrees you can increase your chances immensely of getting a dog with the traits you want. Some good breeders do offer guarantees that the dog will be fit for the purpose it was sold for. They know their lines that well.

Not every buyer of purebreed puppies checks back through pedigrees, but good breeders should be doing this. They should also be producing dogs that come fairly close to having the conformation and temperament described in the standard.

[tdierikx]

Moselle:

I agree with tdierikx in that each dog should be judged on its own INDIVIDUAL merits rather than on its parentage.

Well there goes any reason to develop purebreds in the first place. Its the fact that selective breeding increases the likelihood of traits that led to breed development. People got tired of taking pot luck on traits they wanted in dogs and wanted to improve the odds of getting what they wanted. Those who choose purebred pets today are using the same logic. If you don't care what size, coat, temperament and activity level you get in a dog, then you're far less choosy than most.

Ummm... can I clarify MY statement about judging individual dogs on their merits?

With a pure bred dog from a great breeder who specifically breeds for certain conformation and some inheritable temperament traits, one is more likely to end up with a dog that is more predictable with regards to physical and temperamental traits. That's a given, and I will never dispute that...

... however, with crossbred dogs of unknown lineage - I prefer to judge the individual dog in front of me instead of generalising about particular breed mixes...

T.

[RubyStar]

Haven't read the whole thread, but to MalteseLuna - your Maltese are gorgeous I own a 16 and a half year old Maltese (though she stayed with my parents when I moved out), but she probably isn't the best bred thing as my parents didn't know any better and bought her out of the paper when I was a teenager. She is a bit smaller than your average Maltese, her coat always had a slight wave to it and parents weren't so into grooming so it is kept clipped short. I am no longer a "small dog person", but will always appreciate a nice small white fluffy dog

The whole Maltese cross Shih Tzu thing, ugh, the vet nurses listed my Maltese down as being crossed with a Shih Tzu when I said nothing of the sort! It's probably that they are used to getting those in all the time so it was like an automatic thing to them to write that as the breed. I spied it written on the vet's computer screen during a consult so when I told her that is incorrect, she commented that she didn't think she saw any Shih Tzu in her!

[Lollipup]

what a very confusing thread to read

yes CW, I just read all of it. Some bits were quite entertaining. But yes confusing too.

[bradf1405]

Oh dear. Buckle up folks. Hi Brad. You might want to equate yourself with the board rules.

Sorry if I broke any rules - I did NOT mean to hurt / upset anyone.

There are always a difference of opinions all things, especially when it comes to things one love or hate.

A broad generalisation and the brash statement of "Maltese/shitzu - Mongrel through and through, and are horrible usually when mixed together" was very offensive to me, especially just losing by dog "Jake" who was a broad generalisation. I had five previous "pure breeds" that did not even come close to my Maltese/shitzu.

[bradf1405]

Mongrel through and through, and are horrible usually when mixed together

An unfair statement, such a comment is akin to saying that a child from mixed parentage is horrible, you cannot generalise.

umm nothing alike at all, dogs are not humans

cross those two breeds and conformation goes down the toilet, I agree the vast majority are horrible

I am not advocating cross breeding but realistically speaking....what is so dastardly wrong with a maltese x shih tzu's conformation? I have seen a large number of maltese x shih tzus in my life time and none came across as having a "horrible" conformation, in fact I would go so far as saying that they appeared to be very healthy and robust.

I fully concur. All other Maltese/shitzu owners I have ever talked to over the past 15 years all adore their dog(s) & the dog(s) their owners. Never once has any Maltese/shitzu owner ever told me anything derogative about the Maltese/shitzu X breed - its was always quite the contrary.

[Sandra777]

I had five previous "pure breeds" that did not even come close to my Maltese/shitzu.

Sorry for your loss, all dogs are precious to the people who love them. The breed is SHIH TZU - who on earth could love something called a "shitzu"

[Alfie02]

MalteseLuna, I think that your dog looks beautiful, and I love the Maltese breed. Dont ever listen anyone who puts down your breed, you know that they are wonderful and thats all that matters