raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Bad breeding in terms of people breeding less then perfect dogs as it is known that luxating patellas are usually a genetic fault so it might not be far from the truth to think that chronic tracheal collapse is genetic. My pug is the result of a repeat mating. She doesnt have inherited problems but congenital. Freak mating. My breeder is a member on here and has been very open about that litter. There's an entire thread about it. Am I going to blame my breeder? No way. Am I going to call it bad breeding? I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 She doesnt have inherited problems but congenital. This is subjective. Brachy syndrome is inherited and also congenital. It is congenital in that the structure of the brachy breed lends itself to the various conditions that make up brachy syndrome and these conditions are also an inherited trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 She doesnt have inherited problems but congenital. This is subjective. Brachy syndrome is inherited and also congenital. It is congenital in that the structure of the brachy breed lends itself to the various conditions that make up brachy syndrome and these conditions are also an inherited trait. Urmm OK, Puggles. I think I'll take my vet's diagnosis but thanks anyway. Maybe take your issues up with Pancake's breeder. She has the vet report. If my pug gets sick again - touch wood - the last person who will be blamed is her breeder. Nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Urmm OK, Puggles. I think I'll take my vet's diagnosis but thanks anyway. Maybe take your issues up with Pancake's breeder. She has the vet report.If my pug gets sick again - touch wood - the last person who will be blamed is her breeder. Nuff said. Who said anything about blaming a breeder? Fact is, if you breed a Pug with brachy syndrome you increase your chances of producing offspring with brachy syndrome. Equally, if you breed a perfectly healthy Pug who shows no sign of any brachy syndrome issue (which quite frankly is rare), there is still a chance the off spring will be born with brachy syndrome. As I said, and you can choose to believe it or not at the risk of offending whomever you think it will offend, brachy syndrome is both congenital and inherited. I have said it before, Pug breeders are against the 8 ball from the beginning. It doesn't matter how good a breeder they are, how much knowledge they have, or how ethical they are. The facial structure of flat faced breeds means that many of the offspring WILL be born with brachy syndrome to varying degrees. A good Pug breeder recongises this and takes whatever steps are neccessary to negate the chances. A bad breeders denies that it occurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 The breeder involved has always been open. Send her an email...or a pm Now getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 (edited) The breeder involved has always been open. Send her an email...or a pmNow getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? Raz, why would I want to contact her? What on earth has your breeder got to do with anything? Sometimes, you are so confusing. I know who bred your Pug, you'd have to have had your head down a termite mound for the last 2 years to not know who bred Pancake. So what though? Why are you now saying it is a terrier and a he we are discussing? As for what to do - you said you'd rather take your Vets advice, I suggest you do just that. Edited October 16, 2009 by PugRescueSydney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 The breeder involved has always been open. Send her an email...or a pmNow getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? Raz, why would I want to contact her? What on earth has your breeder got to do with anything? Sometimes, you are so confusing. I know who bred your Pug, you'd have to have had your head down a termite mound for the last 2 years to not know who bred Pancake. So what though? Why are you now saying it is a terrier and a he we are discussing? As for what to do - you said you'd rather take your Vets advice, I suggest you do just that. No idea. I said from the outset it was a terrier I was worried about because he goose honks If you want to discuss my pug - contact my pug breeder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 (edited) No idea. I said from the outset it was a terrier I was worried about because he goose honks If you want to discuss my pug - contact my pug breeder You want to run that past me again. Your words: eta hmmm while I'm freaking out, as a lot of you know, my pug was diagnosed with a congenital abnormality (narrowing) of her trachea before 12 months of age. She doesnt goose honk. This thread makes me think it is indeed a possibility that she could have tracheal collapse down the track. At what age would I possibly see it? My pug is the result of a repeat mating. She doesnt have inherited problems but congenital. The statement above about your Pug is what I replied to. How bizarre. Edited October 16, 2009 by PugRescueSydney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puggy_puggy Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Now getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? How often does he 'goose honk' or have trouble breathing? It could be being caused by something that will not show up on the xray. ie. elongated soft pallet, enlarged larangeal saccules etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Now getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? How often does he 'goose honk' or have trouble breathing? It could be being caused by something that will not show up on the xray. ie. elongated soft pallet, enlarged larangeal saccules etc. For quite some time when it happens, puggy. How often? Not sure. Every few days in summer maybe? I'll take note this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 No idea. I said from the outset it was a terrier I was worried about because he goose honks If you want to discuss my pug - contact my pug breeder You want to run that past me again. No. Take it up with my breeder I know you want to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puggy_puggy Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Now getting back to my terrier - xray required? The last time he went under GA he had a seizure. Should I put him through this again? How often does he 'goose honk' or have trouble breathing? It could be being caused by something that will not show up on the xray. ie. elongated soft pallet, enlarged larangeal saccules etc. For quite some time when it happens, puggy. How often? Not sure. Every few days in summer maybe? I'll take note this summer. Don't panic to much yet. It could be allergies that are causing it if it occurs more in summer. If it was happening every day I would be worried. It could also be the heat in summer causing it. Is he overweigh at all or does he get worked up and then it occurs? Yes keeping a note of how often and when it happens would be a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Thanks puggy. I think I'll just take him in anyway. No he's not overweight but he is larger than the standard. Bloody dogs. Just when you think you have a clear run... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ons Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 my darling maltese Daisy RIP had it, the vet said her windpipe was collapsing. Can not recall the full conversation and diagnosis. She had it from a pup. She also had luxtating patellas and at the end an enlarged heart. Pre DOL days, she was just a puppy from the cute maltese next door to where I lived then. ultimate bybs, my landlord did try to tell me they bred only for money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 16, 2009 Author Share Posted October 16, 2009 (edited) I think the tracheal collapse for toy dogs is caused by different things to the pug suffering from brachy head. The ones that are showing a high incidence are not brachy heads but toy dogs. I guess one question we could ask is whether the condition in pugs is always caused by brachy head or whether it may be caused at least sometimes because its a toy breed - dunno but worth thinking about. It sets off a whole bunch of questions for me - lack of condroitin - how come ? Im sort of running through what else would be needed to make this absorb properly.Id like to see a follow up survey for thoe affected to look at their diet. Edited October 16, 2009 by Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 It sets off a whole bunch of questions for me - lack of condroitin - how come ? Im sort of running through what else would be needed to make this absorb properly.[/u]Id like to see a follow up survey for thoe affected to look at their diet. Can you explain that a bit please, Steve? My terrier who goose honks has exactly the same diet as the terriers who dont goose honk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted October 16, 2009 Author Share Posted October 16, 2009 It sets off a whole bunch of questions for me - lack of condroitin - how come ? Im sort of running through what else would be needed to make this absorb properly.[/u]Id like to see a follow up survey for thoe affected to look at their diet. Can you explain that a bit please, Steve? My terrier who goose honks has exactly the same diet as the terriers who dont goose honk. Yes but yours hasnt been diagnosed with this problem and it may be something else so unless they are all about the same age, and we know they are either clear for it or have it we cant judge in your case. How long has the terrier been making these sounds? What age I mean did it start? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 How long has the terrier been making these sounds? What age I mean did it start? About 2-3. Sorry it's a bit vague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Anne~ Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 I think the tracheal collapse for toy dogs is caused by different things to the pug suffering from brachy head.The ones that are showing a high incidence are not brachy heads but toy dogs. I guess one question we could ask is whether the condition in pugs is always caused by brachy head or whether it may be caused at least sometimes because its a toy breed - dunno but worth thinking about. Do you know if there have been any studies in this regard? Is the information you have come across showing a high incidence of hypoplastic tracheas in the toy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raz Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 How long has the terrier been making these sounds? What age I mean did it start? About 2-3. Sorry it's a bit vague. Actually I think it was even earlier. First time it happened, from memory, was at dog training and he was only about 6 months old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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