Old Dogs And Anaesthetic

[Sheridan]

Just want people's opinions/experiences on old dogs coping with anaesthetic. Grumpy has a cyst on his chin, which he keeps scratching and thus, it keeps bleeding and doesn't heal. Back when the vet could still examine Grumps and not nearly lose his hand, he took a look and said that if necessary, they could basically remove and cauterise it under anaesthetic. Well, it's still happening and Grumpy is just over 13 and a half. He's very healthy but understandably, I'm hesitant to anaesthetise him given his age. The vet cannot examine him without Grumpy being muzzled anymore, I'm sorry to say, because Grumpy is old and grumpy. Old but fast, said the vet, and the offending cyst lies under the muzzle, of course. What, therefore, to do? Would you just leave it? Or would you take the chance and give Grumpy the anaesthetic? Is there another option? I hasten to add that the cyst doesn't seem to bother him, even when he scratches it and it bleeds. I'm concerned because it just doesn't heal.

[Wazzat Xolo]

Sheridan

There is an old link on DOL

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Just want people's opinions/experiences on old dogs coping with anaesthetic. Grumpy has a cyst on his chin, which he keeps scratching and thus, it keeps bleeding and doesn't heal. Back when the vet could still examine Grumps and not nearly lose his hand, he took a look and said that if necessary, they could basically remove and cauterise it under anaesthetic. Well, it's still happening and Grumpy is just over 13 and a half. He's very healthy but understandably, I'm hesitant to anaesthetise him given his age. The vet cannot examine him without Grumpy being muzzled anymore, I'm sorry to say, because Grumpy is old and grumpy. Old but fast, said the vet, and the offending cyst lies under the muzzle, of course. What, therefore, to do? Would you just leave it? Or would you take the chance and give Grumpy the anaesthetic? Is there another option? I hasten to add that the cyst doesn't seem to bother him, even when he scratches it and it bleeds. I'm concerned because it just doesn't heal.

[WoofnHoof]

Is it possible to do it under heavy sedation rather than a full anaesthetic?

[Sheridan]

Is it possible to do it under heavy sedation rather than a full anaesthetic?

I asked the vet previously about a 'twilight' anaesthetic and he said there wasn't much difference between the two. I don't think a local anaesthetic would be good because Grumpy would panic. I'll ask about sedation when I give him a call. Last time I discussed this, he did mention that Grumpy's teeth could do with a clean because he can't have bones anymore.

Wazz, I'm reading the other thread. Big range of opinions.

[Gallomph]

My 14 yr old Shih Tzu has had general anaesthetics twice in the past 2 years (both times for tooth extractions). He's in good health other than a slight heart murmer. He sailed through both times. I did pay for "the works" though - pre anaesthetic blood panel, fluids, pain relief etc etc. My 15 yr old poodle (who has since passed away) also had surgery to remove a cancerous growth, and did very well too.

I guess there is always a chance of something going wrong, so you would weigh that up against the possible / probable benefits to the dog. Then if you decide to go ahead, take all possible precautions available to you to influence the outcome. A lot would also depend on how much confidence you had in your vet.

Good luck.

[Rysup]

I think its a risk you take at any age. I know quite a few dogs that have died at a young age whilst under for hip scoring.

But having said that, I am putting off having my old boy (14) put under to have a fatty cyst removed. It does not bother him so I dont think I will worry about it just yet.

[julesluvscavs]

Is it possible to do it under heavy sedation rather than a full anaesthetic?

Slightly OT, but our Joey altho he's only young always has problems with sedation, but not with generals.

We said something recently to vet with Joey's recent operation, because we were worried, and he said he's having a full general, not sedation, so he will come out it much better (and that is it safer than sedation) I didn't have time to ask why that is ? Anyway according to them, he came out of his recent GA just fine

It's a tough call on a 'older' dog tho ..

Edited October 6, 2009 by JulesLuvsCavs

[Monah]

Poor Grumpy

It's very difficult. I've had several dogs need general anaesthetics at 14 and 15 years of age, all turned out very well, even for big operations. However, every time they needed the op. I was also very worried, like you. I don't know if I would have gone ahead if the ops were not necessary for their lives.

I do have complete trust in my vets though and felt comfortable with my decisions, and I knew there were risks. Scary.

It's a very personal thing, but I have only had good experiences.

[cowanbree]

My vet has always said sedation is more dangerous than a full general as it has no reversing agent. I would do bloods and decide based on that

[Munchin]

I know exactly where you are coming from. Old dog and lumps annoying them. My boy was 14yrs old when I had to have skin cancers removed earlier this year. I went through hell deciding what to do. The best suggestion I had from here was talk all your options over with your vet. If you decide to go ahead pre blood works are a must and fluids before help greatly.

My guy came out of it fine, was home that night with many stitches and wanted to go for his regular walk. That being said, every dog is different.

It comes down to the risk of surgery and the quality of life you want your boy to have.

Good luck with your decision.

[Sheridan]

Factor in Grumpy's reaction to the painkiller a couple of months ago. He's already not quite there, which is my main concern, of course.

[Cavalier]

Hi Sheridan,

The risk is very much determined by the type of anaesthetics used by vets. Some vets still insist on using the older, less safe anaesthetics because they are much cheaper.

We use a combination of Alfaxan CD-RTU and Isoflurane. Over the years of using many different types of anaesthetics this has proven to be the absolute safest anaesthetic combination. Ive anaesthetised my Cavalier with a massive heart murmur (grade 5) with this combo and he came out of it quickly with no complications.

To reduce any risk, get a blood screen done first to ensure good kidney and liver function. Also, pay the extra money and get your dog put on IV fluids during the surgery.

[cashew]

The vet I brought my dog to advised on full blood works, eventhough I sent mine in for a simple desexing. I guess he knows I am a paranoid mum.

[Sheridan]

Hi Sheridan,

The risk is very much determined by the type of anaesthetics used by vets. Some vets still insist on using the older, less safe anaesthetics because they are much cheaper.

We use a combination of Alfaxan CD-RTU and Isoflurane. Over the years of using many different types of anaesthetics this has proven to be the absolute safest anaesthetic combination. Ive anaesthetised my Cavalier with a massive heart murmur (grade 5) with this combo and he came out of it quickly with no complications.

To reduce any risk, get a blood screen done first to ensure good kidney and liver function. Also, pay the extra money and get your dog put on IV fluids during the surgery.

I'll double check on these with the vet. Wheatens, to compound the issue, are 'sensitive' to a particular anaesthetic but I can't recall which off the top of my head.

[Cavalier]

Hi Sheridan,

The risk is very much determined by the type of anaesthetics used by vets. Some vets still insist on using the older, less safe anaesthetics because they are much cheaper.

We use a combination of Alfaxan CD-RTU and Isoflurane. Over the years of using many different types of anaesthetics this has proven to be the absolute safest anaesthetic combination. Ive anaesthetised my Cavalier with a massive heart murmur (grade 5) with this combo and he came out of it quickly with no complications.

To reduce any risk, get a blood screen done first to ensure good kidney and liver function. Also, pay the extra money and get your dog put on IV fluids during the surgery.

I'll double check on these with the vet. Wheatens, to compound the issue, are 'sensitive' to a particular anaesthetic but I can't recall which off the top of my head.

This is thiobarbital. Many dogs are sensitive to this anaesthetic agent (namely sight hounds). It is the cheapest anaesthetic around and some old vets still use it to cut costs.

IMHO, with the newer and safer anaesthetics on the market, Thio has no place in small animal anaesthesia in this day and age. Im sure dog owners would be happy to pay the extra cost if they new the risks.