Dog Allergic To Chicken Any Dry Food Reccomendations

[poodlefan]

My dog does not have a thyroid issue.

None the less, thyroid issues are noted to occur in the breed.

[SparkyTansy]

Just to add to this, skin issues can crop up after a very long time and from a totally unsuspected source. My breeder said they hadn't seen issues for 10 years or so... the line that my boy came from was a complete outcross out of a new imported line and one of their older lines. Both dogs in question plus their parents showed no sign of skin issues. It is safe to say they considered that they had bred it out of the line until it cropped up, seeing as they hadn't seen it in 10 years.

I am guessing, just like other genetic issues such as hip dysplasia, it is polygenic and hard to trace. You can do all the research in the world but you are never going to know if the gene is going to show up, and if it does you have to deal with the consequences.

Finally, as far as I am aware, out of Spartan's litter, he was the only one with the problem. His sisters were both fine, and went on to breed healthy puppies with no skin or thyroid issues. His other brothers were pet homed but i had contact with one of them and they had no skin issues.

I am also going to say (controversially or otherwise) that it is probably likely that breeders have in the past bred dogs with minor skin issues due to perhaps not considering issues it could cause down the track, and placing conformation or lineage over health... another person involved in the breed i have spoken to said that skin issues were very common when she was breeding in the 70s... I am guessing that there were many breeders who eventually put a focus on it hence many English Setters not having the issue today - and yet it can still crop up and there is just no controlling that unless you stop breeding the breed altogether...

[poodlefan]

Interestingly, they have linked some health issues to colour.

[SparkyTansy]

My dog does not have a thyroid issue.

None the less, thyroid issues are noted to occur in the breed.

yes definitely I have seen it. i hope that they will be able to find a good solid link between thyroid and skin issues and perhaps even make it testable but i can't say i have looked into it very far to see if there is anything they are researching...

[gundoglover]

White dogs > skin issues > thyroid issues.. a well established link.

And no, I'd not breed from a dog with a thyroid issue.

Poodlefan,

Do you have any links to research on the white dogs > thyroid issue ? I did a quick search but could not find anything. What I did find was a list of breeds most commonly affected by thyroid problems:

"Studies indicate that the breeds most commonly affected by autoimmune lymphocytic thyroiditis include Golden Retriever, Great Dane, Beagle, Borzoi, Shetland Sheepdog, American Cocker Spaniel, Labrador Retriever, Rottweiler, Boxer, Doberman Pinscher, German Shepherd, Akita, Old English Sheepdog, and Irish Setter."

Many of these breeds have no white in their coats. Was it a different thyroid problem that is colour-linked?

[Dogsfevr]

i dont see the runs as an allergy but an intolerance.

A food allergy to me means the dog suffers differently ie bad ears,hot spots,chronic itching,skin sores..

For example my boy can eat meats(except beef which i will never feed for issues it causes) but in portions,any over the portion he gets the runs but he isnt allergic.

He gets eggs but to many eggs can cause a stomach upset .

I cant eat egg whites because it makes me sick but the middle no issues.i just cant stomach it.

In relation to westies as a groomer yes we see dogs with issues BUT i have to say they have a very high incidence of owner created ,like my breed they need a good diet of essential fatty acids & many people dont feed correctly ,give shit treats & way too much junk food.

Many treat them like little kids & feed my dogs & the likes & they just dont cut it.

many westie owners we have suggested a new diet & it has worked fine & sadly there vets just dish out prednil which doesnt help the cause.

[stormie]

Every dermatologist I've heard talk about any kind of allergy, has said the first thing people with allergic dogs (food or environmental) need to do is notify their breeders, because it is genetic.

Doesn't matter what they are reacting to - it's still an abnormal over reaction of the immune system. That dog that 'gets a bit itchy' from buffalo grass can produce a dog with full blown allergy issues. Even though it might be mild, it's still an allergy.

I would be getting it fully worked up by a dermatologist to know exactly what you're dealing with. Allergies in dogs causes skin conditions - the release of histamines causes a reaction which makes them itchy. They can also have GI symptoms to foods they are allergic to. If it's just GI symptoms, then it's generally most likely an intolerance and not an allergy.

[Dog_Horse_Girl]

I have a dog (staffy x) with severe allergic response. This is partly environmental and contact and partly food allergy. My vet's advice was to complete a food elimination which is underway (has been going on since March or April). Since then, we've discovered she can eat:

fish, sweet potato, turkey (on the bone), roo mince (human grade, only roo meat, no preservatives etc), and fish oil (capsules).

She can't eat:

eggs, chicken, yoghurt, zucchini, canola oil, lard, beef

and that's only part way through the trial. I'm sure when we finish, the list of safe/tolerated foods should be a reasonable amount. I have to say our dogs have been raw fed for years, I've followed the BARF diet based on Dr Ian Billinghurst philosophy and I couldn't believe that my dog would have so many foods that she can't tolerate but that's how it is. Her skin reacts, she's actually come up in huge welts. Her skin turns pink to red when she contacts or ingests something she can't tolerate. She's also had vomiting and the squirts as a result of eating something she's allergic to, but this is not a typical allergic response, most dogs have the primary response via the skin.

It's a very slow process, finding out what she can and can't eat. But processed foods are OUT. Most have some form of chicken, eggs, beef or lard in them, and nearly all have preservatives (many, many dogs are allergic to these preservatives, including Ruby it would seem). I wouldn't risk giving her a processed food again and this makes it difficult for us, but that's life! We adopted this dog from the pound, she's been with us nearly 9 yrs, and she deserves to be managed appropriately - regardless of how inconvenient or expensive it might be for us.

By the way - there is NO way I'd breed from/with an animal with a genetic flaw. It's been proven, at least anectodally, that allergic responses are passed on from parent to off-spring.

Go back to your vet and request further work-ups...and help with a proper food elimination trial. I think your dog needs this sort of help.

BTW - you can read more about Ruby's journey (and mine!) in this forum...it has some info which might help...and there are other allergy dog threads too.

[poodlefan]

Many of these breeds have no white in their coats. Was it a different thyroid problem that is colour-linked?

Same issue. I just noted that every all or nearly all white breed I know of seems to have thyroid problems noted as a potential health issue. West Highland Whites, Dalmations, Maremmas, Pyrs etc.

[Got Spots]

A couple of suggestions that I like

Vitalife by Petco - http://www.masterkarn.net/enduro_hypo_and_snax.html

Based on roo only - about $10 for 1.5 kg - I could feed 2 whippets for about a month and a bit off this and they like it and did well

A cheaper option again and easier to access:

Bonnie Complete - dogs love it and do very well - made by purina approx price 20kg $40 about ~$2 per kg

Ground whole wheat, kangaroo meat, vegetable protein, ground whole corn, beef tallow, canola seed, poultry by-product meal, fish meal, natural antioxidants, essential vitamins and minerals.

Also have a working dog formula

Note:

I no longer use any of these b/c of allergy issues we suspect grains played a part but still would use them on my non-allergic whippet at any time

[woodbyne]

Hello,

This is really interesting thanks guys. My next question is whne i go to the vets what do i ask for in regards to thyroid test and how do they do it blood urine tests? What sort of thing would they be looking for i'd like to be prepared for the worst. Is there something i could google to get information. I know i should wait and see what the results are but you know i want to know..... None of my other dalmatians i have owned over the years have ever had anything wrong with them all lived long lifes with only vet checks for needles and arthritis in old age and old age i mean 13 plus years old. I just feel so sorry for her.

[Dogsfevr]

Hello,

This is really interesting thanks guys. My next question is whne i go to the vets what do i ask for in regards to thyroid test and how do they do it blood urine tests? What sort of thing would they be looking for i'd like to be prepared for the worst. Is there something i could google to get information. I know i should wait and see what the results are but you know i want to know..... None of my other dalmatians i have owned over the years have ever had anything wrong with them all lived long lifes with only vet checks for needles and arthritis in old age and old age i mean 13 plus years old. I just feel so sorry for her.

I would also suggest checking outthe Dallie club of America website which has a great health section

[sas]

Hello,

She was perchased as a show dog with the view to one day breed from her. The breeder thinks i'm mad not to breed her and claims that no of their dogs have ever had any alergies mmmmm.......

Yeah I've heard that one before.

[sas]

speak to her breeder - if she was purchased as a breeding bitch then you should HAVE a breedable bitch not one allergic to chicken of all things.

sorry i dont agree with this part,reacting to one food isnt the end of the world & each dog is an individual.My dogs cant stomach beef ,many dogs cant tolerate chicken its very common.

Its like saying if your a parent & you cant eat peanut butter you shouldnt have kids.

The demodex is a whole different ball game ,i have never experienced it but i believe it can come in different forms & certain scenarios can set it off.

We board alot of dallies & pointers who all have red bellies & no food issues but laying on the ground & having fine skin there seem to irritate it especially concrete.

Also Eukanuba has been known to send dogs red .

Eagle pack holistic gives my guys the runs,optium makes them scratch like crazy & lose weight so in reality any food can set a dog off so before considering your breeding doomed make sure you research well.

Intolerance is one thing, allergies are another.

[sas]

speak to her breeder - if she was purchased as a breeding bitch then you should HAVE a breedable bitch not one allergic to chicken of all things.

sorry i dont agree with this part,reacting to one food isnt the end of the world & each dog is an individual.My dogs cant stomach beef ,many dogs cant tolerate chicken its very common.

Its like saying if your a parent & you cant eat peanut butter you shouldnt have kids.

The demodex is a whole different ball game ,i have never experienced it but i believe it can come in different forms & certain scenarios can set it off.

We board alot of dallies & pointers who all have red bellies & no food issues but laying on the ground & having fine skin there seem to irritate it especially concrete.

Also Eukanuba has been known to send dogs red .

Eagle pack holistic gives my guys the runs,optium makes them scratch like crazy & lose weight so in reality any food can set a dog off so before considering your breeding doomed make sure you research well.

I tend to agree with settrlvr...

I do have a dog with skin issues - cropped up at an early age with many ear issues etc. Discovered the allergy to chicken at about 6 months but continued to have issues so had him referred to a specialist - he was diagnosed with not only food allergy, but atopy as well (inhalant allergy). My specialist vet basically said that it is unlikely that the food allergy was inherited, but that the atopy was. My breeder refused to believe it at first, claiming that they hadn't had any issues for many years, however when she saw the state he was in she quickly changed her mind. I chose not to breed with him due to not wanting to risk anybody else (or any other dog) go through the same thing... I continued to show him but it was for fun and the intention to breed was never there.

Had he had only the food allergy I would have considered breeding him - there are many dogs out there with food allergies and I tend to lean towards it being environmental influence over genetics.

As for food my boy cannot tolerate any type of meat generally except on occasion lamb and kangaroo (he hates kangaroo) and turkey. He loves fish and is fine with it.

Early in the piece he could handle Advance Turkey and Rice but i later discovered a food called Natural Balance which is all lamb and he does well on this.

He is 7 years old now, and after a long time with desensitisation injections he is basically allergy free except for during the season change (winter to spring). He is still allergic to chicken - how do i know? He ate a whole chicken carcass (stole it!) and 4 days later got a bad ear infection and his usual lumps and bumbs...

He is an English Setter, and like Dalmatians, it's a breed that have been known to suffer from skin issues historically...

Your Vet may think it's unlikely food allergies are not inherritated but considering there is no scientific proof your Vet is only guessing,

so research and the honesty of your Breeder and people who other dogs in the line is generally what is going to get you answers.

Allergies are such a hard thing to nail down, so better to be safe not sorry and not breed and potentially pass the issues on? Also just because a breed is known to have skin issues hostoricaly doesn't make it ethical to bred a dog with skin issues.

Edited August 27, 2009 by sas

[sas]

In relation to westies as a groomer yes we see dogs with issues BUT i have to say they have a very high incidence of owner created ,like my breed they need a good diet of essential fatty acids & many people dont feed correctly ,give shit treats & way too much junk food.

Many treat them like little kids & feed my dogs & the likes & they just dont cut it.

many westie owners we have suggested a new diet & it has worked fine & sadly there vets just dish out prednil which doesnt help the cause.

Are you talking about food intolerance here or food allergies because sound dog is not going to develop allergies because it was fed PAL.

[SparkyTansy]

sas that is true my vet was probably only guessing... just like we guess that it could be inherited...

anyway, I didn't go ahead and breed with my dog... I also never said it was ethical to breed a dog with skin issues, I said it's been done in the past hence the reason why there are certain breeds prone to the issues.

The fact remains though, that food allergies are more rife now than they were 10-20 years ago... in an age where our dogs food is made and dried into little unnatural nuggets, where meat is pumped with all sorts of rubbish, even if the mode of inheritance is high, something else is causing the surfacing of food allergies to be more likely NOW than they were... especially since we also see a lot more allergies in humans as well.

[sas]

sas that is true my vet was probably only guessing... just like we guess that it could be inherited...

anyway, I didn't go ahead and breed with my dog... I also never said it was ethical to breed a dog with skin issues, I said it's been done in the past hence the reason why there are certain breeds prone to the issues.

The fact remains though, that food allergies are more rife now than they were 10-20 years ago... in an age where our dogs food is made and dried into little unnatural nuggets, where meat is pumped with all sorts of rubbish, even if the mode of inheritance is high, something else is causing the surfacing of food allergies to be more likely NOW than they were... especially since we also see a lot more allergies in humans as well.

Stormie could correct me here but I was under the belief food allergies are actually quite rare, people just think they are rife.

Many dogs on raw diets have allergies too.

Are allergies more rife now than they were 10-20 years ago because people kept breeding allergic dogs?

Edited August 28, 2009 by sas

[Staranais]

sas that is true my vet was probably only guessing... just like we guess that it could be inherited...

anyway, I didn't go ahead and breed with my dog... I also never said it was ethical to breed a dog with skin issues, I said it's been done in the past hence the reason why there are certain breeds prone to the issues.

The fact remains though, that food allergies are more rife now than they were 10-20 years ago... in an age where our dogs food is made and dried into little unnatural nuggets, where meat is pumped with all sorts of rubbish, even if the mode of inheritance is high, something else is causing the surfacing of food allergies to be more likely NOW than they were... especially since we also see a lot more allergies in humans as well.

Stormie could correct me here but I was under the belief food allergies are actually quite rare, people just think they are rife.

Many dogs on raw diets have allergies too.

Are allergies more rife now than they were 10-20 years ago because people kept breeding allergic dogs?

True food allergies are much rarer than atopies or flea allergies. But dogs prone to one type of allergy are more likely to get the others, so you can't always differentiate between them.

I too would not breed from any dog that had suffered from demodex issues (which are often an expression of an underlying immune problems), and would think twice about breeding from any dog that had any type of allergy. Even if it is just mild localised demodex, or a mild allergy, there is often a genetic component to these problems that result in the pups having a predisposition towards the issue.

IMO it's just not worth it as there are almost always other breedworthy dogs that don't suffer from these immune problems or allergies.

Edited August 28, 2009 by Staranais

[huski]

I would definitely try the fish based Eagle Pack Holistic. We've had Cherry on this for a while now and she's doing really well on it.