Cosmolo Posted August 14, 2009 Author Share Posted August 14, 2009 I have to find some test dogs that pull so i'm not too sure what size they will be.. Maybe a medium large and a large- how adjustable are they? Now to find some pulling dogs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy beagle lady Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Do you want to borrow some hounds that may or may not pull :p They are very adjustable, I can leave the medium large in my post box tommorow for you if you want? I will order in a large. They come with a very easy to read and use booklet and once fitted properly make a huge diffrence I have to find some test dogs that pull so i'm not too sure what size they will be.. Maybe a medium large and a large- how adjustable are they?Now to find some pulling dogs.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted August 14, 2009 Author Share Posted August 14, 2009 Thanks Milzi, i just read through the info there. I have seen a different type of harness that clipped to the front on a dog and when the dog lunged it (without the owner doing anything) pulled her off balance, moving her front leg opposite to the side the owner was standing on toward the owner and the dog slipped quite badly. Has anyone found this to be the case? This was on a large boisterous dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy beagle lady Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Ive found any harness not fitted correctly and for the individual dog size that this can indeed be quite common. Thanks Milzi, i just read through the info there. I have seen a different type of harness that clipped to the front on a dog and when the dog lunged it (without the owner doing anything) pulled her off balance, moving her front leg opposite to the side the owner was standing on toward the owner and the dog slipped quite badly. Has anyone found this to be the case? This was on a large boisterous dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted August 14, 2009 Author Share Posted August 14, 2009 Thanks CBL- it was a while ago and i wasn't close enough to see how the harness was fitted, but it did worry me, especially when the owner didn't seem surprised by the action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusky Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 the only one I like is the sporn. I like the sporn better than a head halter particularly for the old choker users. The problem is that like everything they need to be fitted correctly and combined with loose leash walking. The first I got was sent to me a few years ago by a doler who didn't use it. I trialed it on a very strong dog with an elderly handler and was very impressed. I teach in the usual way...when it is tight call back use treats and reward fading the food once a link in the dogs psyche has been made by a reward word and food, obviously this comes first and is taught as a reward for all behaviour. Easily takes 20 kilos off, saves arms and shoulders from injury. I have tried a couple of others but prefer the sporn. Sizing is tricky, you will need a few in your magic box Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaturallyWild Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 I'm looking at redesigning a harness at the moment that has multiple connection points but also does not restrict the dogs natural leg movement like many of the harnesses do. The use is mainly about getting the dog to rebalance itself and requires some leash skills (from TTouch methods) but because it will have a front connector could still be used like the GL, sensible, etc to redirect the dog from the easier pivot point. A work in progress and will need to test with different breeds when ready, but should be highly adjustible to fit any shaped dog. Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 I use the harnesses much like SnT. I've had the most experience with the Gentle Leader no pull harness, although I have found with some dogs it does rub/ slip down their front if not fitted correctly. I think they are fantastic for small - med dogs too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted August 14, 2009 Author Share Posted August 14, 2009 What do you think about them for larger dogs LP and S+T? Thanks for the comments- much appreciated info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopuppy04 Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 What do you think about them for larger dogs LP and S+T? Thanks for the comments- much appreciated info. I think they work but they are less effective. I think that is more a handling issue though more than an 'equipment' issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piper Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 I have to find some test dogs that pull so i'm not too sure what size they will be.. Maybe a medium large and a large- how adjustable are they?Now to find some pulling dogs.. I had heard miracle stuff about these front attach harnesses about 5 or 6 years ago and decided I had to give 1 a go. So I bought 1 in from America and then realised that I could walk my 3 BCs on 1 finger so testing it on them was pointless, lol. I had a boxer in class at the time that I thought would be a perfect candidate only the 1 I had did not fit her. At the time they were not available in Australia at all. I found a harness that happened to have a ring in the chest so decided to try it anyway. Well tbis boxers face was priceless. She could walk beautifully on a lead but she would have these moments where she caight her owner off guard and would bounce forward to the end of her elad dragging owner with her to play with another dog. We put the harness on, walked towards another dog in class, boxer bounced foward and due to the conenction on her chest found herself facing away from the dog. She backed up, turned around, tried it again and the look she gave her owner had us all laughing. She worked out very quickly that she could ease to the end of her lead and keep going forward but a sudden bounce would see her facing the wrong way. After that I took the harness I had bought from America and the 1 I had used on the boxer to Jenny Ireland's for her to try it out and see. She had a dedicated puller and was greatly impressed although she found it slipped a little form side to side and over time came up with Harmony harness and double ended lead method. Recently I met the boxers owner again (we have ended up at the same place of emplymnt) and she told me it took only a few weeks for the boxer to stop bouncing forwards regardless of the collar or harness she was wearing. I no longer run any training classes and they were only jst starting to be readily available over here when I stopped but the few dogs I used them on I found them to be a success. Especially for the owners, in that there is not the same reaction from most dogs as oyu get with a head collar. If the dog has worn a car harness before you can pretty much put them on and go for a walk, no settling in time needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam&Saki Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Now to find some pulling dogs.. :p *ahem* *whistles* *looks nonchalant* *gets pulled off the computer by the crazy pulling dog of doom............................................... * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nekhbet Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 (edited) i find all harnesses useless unless the attitude comes with them by then a collar works better there is no such dog that has a pull on the lead only problem. There is probably other things that structure during a walk can help as well which I believe in as a part of the overall lifestyle. They still cause discomfort to the dog but for prolonged periods and for most you will be giving a more prolonged sensation then if you just gave the dog a correction fitting for the dog in the first place. sam n saki if she pulls I'll fix it in under an hour for you honestly people make it out to be this mystical magical quest ... walking on a leash is easy peasy! Edited August 14, 2009 by Nekhbet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4 Paws Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 The Sensible and Senation harness http://softouchconcepts.com/products/sense_ible_harness.html hands down when fitted correctly has worked wonders with all the rescue beagles, we have now incorporated these as part of our adoption package and each beagle goes to their new home wearing one do you purchase them from that website or are they available in Aust now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staff'n'Toller Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 (edited) With large breeds I gauge it on the dog and the owner combined. I do like them for Boxers that I would ordinarily like to put on a head collar but I don't fit head collars on Boxers as a rule. If the owners timing is really bad or they are apathetic as far as effort is concerned I put a head collar on. There seems to be an inordinate amount of owners in the area I work that are frightened their dog will slip a regular collar and run away... :D it's got me beat, I've come across a few that had dogs as children and dog escaped collar and got run over. I started off with the sensation harness, brought them in a few years ago with another trainer but I prefer to have the martingale style at the front, stops them slipping as much. Edited August 15, 2009 by Staff'n'Toller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miz J Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 I have just put my two boxers onto sense-ible harnesses. I am impressed so far, they walk really well on them. I like that I can use their soft collar to clip onto if they get a bit "active" during the walk or if I am sure that they are calm I can just clip onto the harness itself. Wil give them a month to see how we go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmolo Posted August 15, 2009 Author Share Posted August 15, 2009 Thanks guys- all of your feedback is realy helpful. Do any of you use no pull harnesses with the aim of transitioning the dog to a normal collar? Nekhbet, i disagree- loose lead walking is something many clients find difficult. If loose lead walking was easy for everyone, all the no pull harnesses, martingales and headcollars wouldn't have been created! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piper Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Thanks guys- all of your feedback is realy helpful. Do any of you use no pull harnesses with the aim of transitioning the dog to a normal collar?Nekhbet, i disagree- loose lead walking is something many clients find difficult. If loose lead walking was easy for everyone, all the no pull harnesses, martingales and headcollars wouldn't have been created! From what I can gather with the use of the double ended leash you can transition back to a collar. By having the leash on the collar and the harness you can transition where the "pressure" is by how you are holding it, so keep using the double ended leash attached to te harness until you can do a normal walk without needing to use the end of the leash. Hope that makes sense. Something that I haven't tried is something Ian Dunbar mentioned as making transition back to collar easier. This was in relation to head collars but I can see it applying to harnesses as well. What he said is most people attach the lead and walk the first time they get the head collar on, so the dog learns that the new condition is due to this new thing on it. What he suggested (and he did use some toehr examples other than head collar back to collar, but can't remmber them all now) was when introducing a new training aid, put it on (or in place) but do not use it for the first dozen or so times. So put harness on but walk on normal collar. Continue to do this for a few weeks then commence using the new accessory AND introduce a new cue. He says this way the change is most likely to be attribued to the new cue consitantly being applied rather than the new piece of training equipment, as the dog has already reasonable experience of that piece of equipment causing no change to their behaviour. He says that in doing that you can often transition back to the prefered collar as the dog has learnt the new cue means don't pull as opposed to the new piece of equipment means don't pull. I probably explained that really poorly and missed heaps. I enjoyed Dunbar's seminar but was as sick as with glandular fever when I went so lots of it was missed ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staranais Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Something that I haven't tried is something Ian Dunbar mentioned as making transition back to collar easier. This was in relation to head collars but I can see it applying to harnesses as well. What he said is most people attach the lead and walk the first time they get the head collar on, so the dog learns that the new condition is due to this new thing on it. What he suggested (and he did use some toehr examples other than head collar back to collar, but can't remmber them all now) was when introducing a new training aid, put it on (or in place) but do not use it for the first dozen or so times. So put harness on but walk on normal collar. Continue to do this for a few weeks then commence using the new accessory AND introduce a new cue. That's pretty much exactly what you do when you're going to use an e-collar, to ensure a dog doesn't become e-collar smart, but it never occured to me to do it with harnesses and headcollars as well before using them. Interesting idea! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piper Posted August 16, 2009 Share Posted August 16, 2009 That's pretty much exactly what you do when you're going to use an e-collar, to ensure a dog doesn't become e-collar smart, but it never occured to me to do it with harnesses and headcollars as well before using them. Interesting idea! I think he said he does similar when introducing any new equipment or visual aid. It makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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