Samoyed

[ruski18]

I only just today picked up a Liberty Ultra Lite (I think thats the brand name) dryer and can't wait to use it! (how sad am I )

But I have been told good things about this brand.

One thing I will say it be careful with heat.

The Sammie coat is delicate and continued exposure to heat can make the coat dry and brittle, it can even go yellow in some cases.

What you want is something very strong that will just blast the water right off the coat.

Oh and your Sammie is very cute.

thanks wolfsong. the breeder i got her from only recommends liberty. i just dot want to spend 700 bucks if im not going to be happy with it.

thanks

[kiesha09]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

[SnoPaws]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

Hi Kiesha

I am really amazed at how good Bundys recall but then again I do have Sibes too

I just have to yell Bund come, and he stops dead in his tracks and bounds over to me :p whereas the Sibe will just give you the finger ;) But yes I have definately spent alot of time with him making sure he has a solid recall, maybe it is the novelty factor of actually having a dog that responds to 'come' Would I ever let him off leash to go for a walk, never but that is just me, probably another symptom of having Sibes.

[keroppiyo]

HEY GUYS,

since im after a blow dryer for my sammie, does anyone have any suggestions on which brand would be best. i was after one on a stand and that has a heat function.

thanks in advance

Ruski, your Sammie is so cute! Looks like a polar bear in that photo.

[keroppiyo]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

Hi Kiesha. I know Samoyeds are capable of having a reliable recall, but I would say my 10-month old Buffy has almost no recall. It's most likely from lack of training experience on my part though, and at this point in time I don't see myself ever letting her go off-leash. She's independent and stubborn, but we just think she's got 'character'

[Bjelkier]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

A Samoyed is a very intelligent dog.

It is very possible to train a recall in these dogs. There are a good number of Samoyeds out there with obediance and agility titles.

[ruski18]

HEY GUYS,

since im after a blow dryer for my sammie, does anyone have any suggestions on which brand would be best. i was after one on a stand and that has a heat function.

thanks in advance

Ruski, your Sammie is so cute! Looks like a polar bear in that photo.

thanks kero,

ur sammie looks cute as too

[ruski18]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

Hi Kiesha

I am really amazed at how good Bundys recall but then again I do have Sibes too

I just have to yell Bund come, and he stops dead in his tracks and bounds over to me whereas the Sibe will just give you the finger But yes I have definately spent alot of time with him making sure he has a solid recall, maybe it is the novelty factor of actually having a dog that responds to 'come' Would I ever let him off leash to go for a walk, never but that is just me, probably another symptom of having Sibes.

agreed with kiesha

my sammie has taken a year to answer to "come" even though i never even taught or used the word come till now. she also responds very well to a loud whistle (even though i cant whistle)

but she has her moments just like any dog where she will ignore me untill shes finished sniffing or chasing something.

i also have a sibe- who never listens unless hes in the house or backyard

i can be walking him on the lead and call his name and he wont even acknolege it. (mind u we got him at age 4 and have only had him for 4months now)

i have done obiedience and show training with my sammie and she not once laid down for me. i stopped obeidience training for now and all of a sudden now she lays when i ask her.

but the best thing of all is that i can tie her up or put her in a crate ANYWHERE and she doesnt make a sound or whine or bark, she simply lays down watches things or just falls asleep. and most of all she loves me to pieces and tries to please me all the time and definately knows when shes done wrong

[Kelza]

Hi Everyone,

Samoyeds are a breed of dog that really interest me. CUrrently I'm in no position to add to the furpack but in the future I will be so you never know could end up with a Sammie.

I've heard a few people mention that they are rather independent, but what is their recalls like? I know that a great recall is a byproduct of great training but there are definately some breeds out there who are much better at it than others.

Thanks

A Samoyed is a very intelligent dog.

It is very possible to train a recall in these dogs. There are a good number of Samoyeds out there with obediance and agility titles.

Samoyeds are VERY intellegent and it is important to remember they can be subborn and have a mind of their own. It is important to train them from a young age, but it is also important to never trust them 100% in the early years, regardless if they have titles or training.

Hopefully Bindi will share her experience on this forum.

In saying this I took my girl "shimmer" to the dog beach and she wouldn't run more than 10 metres before turning back to me, but I certainly wouldn't let her off leash when an area is not fenced and she is 2years old. The reason being is if something catches a Samoyeds attention, that becomes their focus and they "cant hear you calling them back".

[Icemist]

Samoyeds are VERY intellegent and it is important to remember they can be subborn and have a mind of their own. It is important to train them from a young age, but it is also important to never trust them 100% in the early years, regardless if they have titles or training.

Hopefully Bindi will share her experience on this forum.

In saying this I took my girl "shimmer" to the dog beach and she wouldn't run more than 10 metres before turning back to me, but I certainly wouldn't let her off leash when an area is not fenced and she is 2years old. The reason being is if something catches a Samoyeds attention, that becomes their focus and they "cant hear you calling them back".

Yes Sammie’s are intelligent, sometimes too intelligent.

Yes, I will bite at this one, because our Sammie’s must be abnormal as we don’t seem to fit the 100% rate.

I find it very unfortunate that you feel this way about your dogs and Samoyeds in general, not being able to trust your dogs off lead, even in the early years, especially if they have obedience titles and they still won't come back to.

I have been involved in training Samoyeds since 1985, I am a qualified All Breeds Obedience Instructor (as with my father) and have never to this current date have had any problems with any of my Sammie’s not coming back on command (or within 2 commands), even puppies at an early untrained age will come back if the right technique is used.

Nor has my father had any problems who has trained Samoyeds since 1975 have never had problems, whether in a trial ring, out at parks, beaches or out amongst livestock.

There are many techniques to train a Samoyed, and not all obedience clubs teach good techniques, and training will vary from dog to dog.

Samoyeds can work just as good as or even better than any other breed if given the chance. Results have shown this time and time again in obedience, Agility, in the herding ring, and Endurance testing, in both Australia and the USA (where Sammies are used for more than just show).

The problem with some training clubs is that they change techniques with what fads are around at the time, and they push that technique, even though it may be correct or not correct.

This reflects on many dogs of any breed.

I’ve seen techniques come and go, most are extremely poor.

The basic’s of obedience is they key to the recall and any obedience related activity. The basics are a must. Neither new beginner, nor dog will pick up the basics properly in eight weeks of basic training, stage 1, what ever you want to call it.

In general, usually after eight weeks of training, owners and there dogs (as a team) will pass an assessment day whether they have earnt it or not. Yes, you are given a certificate to say you pass, but did the dog and owner really deserve it. Most cases no.

There are also a lot of people out there who say Sammie’s can’t be trained, including the recall and can’t be trained to a high level. A lot of dog people who don't own Samoyeds can't trial and even say that Sammie’s should only stay in the show ring because they are pretty (and other reasons). Regretfully this is a mentality that even some people these days still have, both in the breed and those outside.

This has been around for decades, as is still around today.

As part of training, you must trust in your Sammy, as your Sammy must trust you.

With anything you do with your dog, you need to work as a team.

Sammie’s are still being trialled today, in Victoria, ACT and NSW. And yes, young dogs that have been doing recalls and trial work from a young age, from 5 months of age, are still forces in the trial ring today.

Training you dog is hard work, and takes time. Patience is a key, especially at a young age. Training and trialing can be good fun, it can be frustrating, but very rewarding.

[Bjelkier]

So true Icemist, well said

[Bindii]

I don't think it was well said at all... I am so frightened that you are happily announcing that a Samoyed can have 100% recall.

NO dog has 100% recall. YES Samoyeds are smart and have titles over many fields including obedience, herding, agility and tracking but as a general day to day living it is so foolish to announce on an open forum for those wanting information on the breed to suggest that they have 100% recall.

Please read my post http://www.dolforums.com.au/index.php?show...188435&hl=# where I nearly lost Fletcher who I thought had spot-on recall, yes i thought he had 100% recall and luckily i didn't have to learn the hard way. I had a very, very close call and one close enough for me to try to educate those I come across that think that any dog has it.

I also work at a busy vet clinic and see it every week. Well trained dogs, obdience titled dogs, stupid, naive owners who think their dog has 100% recall. Dogs being brought in screaming, bleeding, eyes out of their heads, necks snapped, bleeding internally, massive hernias, crushed half way down their bodies down. The owners SO regretful, SO painful, knowing full well that they were COMPLETELY TO BLAME. Your dogs life is in your hands.

I am not at all suggesting a Samoyed can't be trained for obedience/agility/tracking etc titles- Fletcher excels at obedience and will be trialling for CD title in the somewhat near future. He is brilliant in training, he knows exactly what I want of him - he has his days, and is sometimes stubborn, a characteristic of this breed which would be stupid to deny to possible future owners of the breed!! (do we want people handing dogs back to breeders or sending them off to pounds because the dog wasn't always 100% obedient and they were told it would be?) It is part of what makes this breed so interesting and such an exciting challenge.

BUT when it comes to a rabbit, or a cat across the road, instincts kick it. This breed was used for herding and was used for hunting and you know this breed is a natural breed, practically untouched and those original instincts will show up from time to time.

If you don't believe that, then perhaps you may not have experienced this kind of situation because of the fact that you are very experienced in dog training yourself, and had the mentor of your experienced father to guide you... but do you tell your average puppy buyers that Samoyeds have 100% recall? If so, you are a fool and you are taking a ridiculously huge risk for the future of the puppies you have bred. Be thankful nothing serious has happened yet but open your eyes and look at what you're actually saying to people.

Please read my post mentioned above and maybe you'll understand. This is how i finished my post that day, I wrote this just after the event:

My dog lived today. My dog lived to remind me who i am, his carer, his everything. It is my responsibility to make sure he is safe. I failed today and i came way too close to losing my best friend. I'm still shaking, and i'm finally having the chance to let it go and cry. Please, don't ever think you have 100% recall, learn from my mistake before it's too late. After tonight.. i will not believe that it is possible. In the end, he's a dog.. and why wouldn't he want to chase a rabbit?

Edited May 3, 2010 by Bindii

[Kelza]

Icemist: Yes Sammie's are intelligent, sometimes too intelligent.

I find it very unfortunate that you feel this way about your dogs and Samoyeds in general, not being able to trust your dogs off lead, even in the early years, especially if they have obedience titles and they still won't come back to.

Samoyeds can work just as good as or even better than any other breed if given the chance. Results have shown this time and time again in obedience, Agility, in the herding ring, and Endurance testing, in both Australia and the USA (where Sammies are used for more than just show).

The problem with some training clubs is that they change techniques with what fads are around at the time, and they push that technique, even though it may be correct or not correct.

This reflects on many dogs of any breed.

I've seen techniques come and go, most are extremely poor.

Sammie's are still being trialled today, in Victoria, ACT and NSW. And yes, young dogs that have been doing recalls and trial work from a young age, from 5 months of age, are still forces in the trial ring today.

Training you dog is hard work, and takes time. Patience is a key, especially at a young age. Training and trialing can be good fun, it can be frustrating, but very rewarding.

Hi Icemist,

I noticed you didn't respond to my post regarding temperament, but glad you have responded to this one.

As you know I am involved in showing, but something you may be aware of is I have also been involved in herding and agility with my kids. No my dogs don't have obedience titles, and they still respond when I have been performing these activities. In my experience our puppy buyer do the basic obedience training, but most puppy buyers are not interested in trialing their dogs. So as this is a forum about Samoyeds and the main reason is to enlighten puppy buyers about our breed I believe it is important for them to know that they need to be fully aware Samoyeds are not always fabulous at recalls, yes they may do it 100 or 200 times, but the 201 occasion the environment could be different, their could be a smell in the air, she could be in season etc, you always need to be careful!

I do love & trust my Samoyeds with everything (kids, other animals etc), but as I said I wouldn't walk the streets off lead as I do not trust that if they see a cat they would not want to run and play.... the risk of being hit by a car is too high for me, and yes you may think this is stupid but my dogs mean the world to me and I would be devastated if my dog was hit and I could have prevented it by something as simple as a lead.. If you knew my kids you would certainty see the unique bond I have with my Samoyeds especially "Shimmer", I do spend a lot of time with my kids training and if I did let them off the lead I probably wouldn't have to worry. But I won’t take the chance just to see...as their is that one time that they may not listen.

I am aware you have been heavily involved in obedience and may know the correct techniques. But as you said

Icemist: The problem with some training clubs is that they change techniques with what fads are around at the time, and they push that technique, even though it may be correct or not correct.

This reflects on many dogs of any breed.

I’ve seen techniques come and go, most are extremely poor.

So puppy buyers need to be aware, that even though they think they have 100% recall they may not. Bindi did experience this and she does go to obedience. I was actually out to dinner Saturday with a couple of Samoyed breeders/owners who all said they had experience one time or another were they Samoyed tuned out and ignored their recalls. These experiences involved near misses of being hit by cars.

A lot of dog people who don't own Samoyeds can't trial and even say that Sammie’s should only stay in the show ring because they are pretty (and other reasons). Regretfully this is a mentality that even some people these days still have, both in the breed and those outside.

Obedience trainers thought I was stupid doing agility because of the way Samoyeds think, but my girl loves it. Anyone that says that about herding needs to read the Samoyed history... but remember these are all controlled environments away from cars.

I am glad you feel your Samoyeds are perfectly trained, but just remember this forum is for puppy buyers and not everyone is interested in spending years becoming a obedience trainer.

[Bjelkier]

I am sorry but the call the no dog could have 100% recall is not true.

I rather suspect that the people in the obediance thread would have a few things to say about that.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Wolfsong

[Bindii]

I am sorry but the call the no dog could have 100% recall is not true.

I rather suspect that the people in the obediance thread would have a few things to say about that.

I rather suspect their opinions would change if their dog suddenly broke and got hit by a car. Or if they witnessed what I see all too often.

The point is, this thread is information about the breed for a potential puppy buyer. Most will not have the experience of those in the "obedience thread".

Read the replies I got on that thread, no one denied that no dog has 100% recall.

I have never heard from a breeder that feels that they should trust a Samoyed off lead 100%, even those involved in obedience. I am involved on a few yahoo groups about Samoyeds and have often read of experiences by Samoyed breeders and owners all over the world. That is why I am so shocked, Wolfsong. You spend your weekends with Icemist so I guess I understand why you wouldn't find it quite as shocking.

In fact, I have an example here of what Kate Hall wrote from Mezen Samoyeds in reply to the same post when i put it on Facebook "YES you are crazy to think a samoyed ever has 100% recall because they dont they are samoyeds!"

Edited May 3, 2010 by Bindii

[Bjelkier]

I am sorry but the call the no dog could have 100% recall is not true.

I rather suspect that the people in the obediance thread would have a few things to say about that.

I rather suspect their opinions would change if their dog suddenly broke and got hit by a car.

The point is, this thread is information about the breed for a potential puppy buyer. Most will not have the experience of those in the "obedience thread".

Read the replies I got on that thread, no one denied that no dog has 100% recall.

I have never heard from a breeder that feels that they should trust a Samoyed off lead 100%, even those involved in obedience. That is why I am so shocked, Wolfsong. You spend your weekends with Icemist so I guess I understand why you wouldn't find it so shocking.

In fact, I have here what Kate Hall wrote from Mezen Samoyeds in reply to the same post when i put it on Facebook "YES you are crazy to think a samoyed ever has 100% recall because they dont they are samoyeds"

Just because I hang around with Icemist does not mean I have to agree with everything he says.

And everyone has their own opinions.

This is mine.

Yes a Samoyed can have good recall as far as I am concerned, any breed of dog can provided the work is put in.

If that means you are training and proofing that dog for years, so be it.

No where did I say that a puppy buyer should go to a park and let the dog off hoping for the best. They need serious amounts of training, years of training and yeah some dogs might never get it but there are dogs out there that can have good recall and it can be obtained.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Wolfsong

[Bindii]

Just because I hang around with Icemist does not mean I have to agree with everything he says.

I'm sorry if I offended you, I didn't mean to. I just find it even more shockng to find two people now that feel this way, i just assumed the opinion must have come through from your breeder (and, understandably, of course)

And everyone has their own opinions.

This is mine.

Yes a Samoyed can have good recall as far as I am concerned, any breed of dog can provided the work is put in.

If that means you are training and proofing that dog for years, so be it.

No where did I say that a puppy buyer should go to a park and let the dog off hoping for the best. They need serious amounts of training, years of training and yeah some dogs might never get it but there are dogs out there that can have good recall and it can be obtained.

I agree. Fletcher does have good recall. In fact great recall! Until that day, it had always been 100% since i'd been training him from a young age. That day, i learnt good recall does not mean 100% recall.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Bindii

[Bjelkier]

Just because I hang around with Icemist does not mean I have to agree with everything he says.

I'm sorry if I offended you, I didn't mean to. I just find it even more shockng to find two people now that feel this way, i just assumed the opinion must have come through from your breeder (and, understandably, of course)

And everyone has their own opinions.

This is mine.

Yes a Samoyed can have good recall as far as I am concerned, any breed of dog can provided the work is put in.

If that means you are training and proofing that dog for years, so be it.

No where did I say that a puppy buyer should go to a park and let the dog off hoping for the best. They need serious amounts of training, years of training and yeah some dogs might never get it but there are dogs out there that can have good recall and it can be obtained.

I agree. Fletcher does have good recall. In fact great recall! Until that day, it had always been 100% since i'd been training him from a young age. That day, i learnt good recall does not mean 100% recall.

All good you didnt offend me

I think we might have to agree to disagree on this one.

And I will say for the record unless a pet owner is willing to put a huge, and I really mean huge, (years even), amount of training into a Samoyed, I would never recomend the dog is proofed enough to believe the recall is 100%.

We are talking about a breed here that has been bred for thousnads of years to have a mind of its own, to think for itself and many owners are not willing, able or even bothered to put that kind of training into a dog, thats fine, dont let it off lead unless the area is 100% safe.

All I am saying is, if the owner is willing and able and is more stubborn then the dog, it could be done, eventually.

Oh and in regards to the previous post about Fletch getting away. I know exactly how scary that can be, I have had a dog do that to me before and it is the worlds worst feeling.

Edited May 3, 2010 by Wolfsong

[Bindii]

I think we might have to agree to disagree on this one.

And I will say for the record unless a pet owner is willing to put a huge, and I really mean huge, (years even), amount of training into a Samoyed, I would never recomend the dog is proofed enough to believe the recall is 100%.

We are talking about a breed here that has been bred for thousnads of years to have a mind of its own, to think for itself and many owners are not willing, able or even bothered to put that kind of training into a dog, thats fine, dont let it off lead unless the area is 100% safe.

All I am saying is, if the owner is willing and able and is more stubborn then the dog, it could be done, eventually.

In the case of this post... I think we can agree that we actually pretty much agree!

It is important to stress that Samoyeds can be stubborn and are not the easiest breed to train, they can be trained and are very smart. And I think that as long as someone is aware of the fact that they can be difficult then it is okay. I questioned Snerzok about this and he said it was because about 50 years difference in our understanding of Samoyeds I think he was saying that I was wrong, but kind of proved my point in saying it takes years to have a fully trained Samoyed.. maybe in 50 years I'll master the 100% recall!

But Icemist was making it sound like it was strange that someone didn't trust their Samoyeds off lead and that he felt 'sorry' for them - and that is what I found surprising, when most will stress that it is not just 'that easy.'

Edited May 3, 2010 by Bindii

[Bjelkier]

I wont speak for Icemist but I took it to mean that it is possible, that a pet owner shouldnt assume that just because its a Samoyed means its impossible to train.

I could be wrong

Oh and believe me I will never say a Samoyed is easy to train!

I should film Misty and I training OB, it can be very funny sometimes

Edited May 3, 2010 by Wolfsong